YASNY Posted June 13, 2003 Share Posted June 13, 2003 If you walk Bonds, you have a chance with the double play, or you have a chance at the other guys swinging too hard to do something. I would NEVER pitch to Bonds in that situation. And neither would 90% of major league managers - that's why he leads the league in walks every year. Colon had struck him out 3 straight times - Bonds obviously had figured out Colon's repitoire - he waited for the pitch he thought would come and he hammered it. He's not a Top Ten Player Of All Time for nothing. Bonds hadn't "obvisiously" figured out anything prior to that at bat.... other than he hadn't been able to touch Colon. Hindsight is 20/20 my friend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pastime Posted June 13, 2003 Share Posted June 13, 2003 But, hindsight is killing us. Too many opposing players are living off of hindsight. I'm ready to cash it in. I know I should never do that, but s*** -I'm 32 now, and I've been suffering for 24 years now. I have to teach 2nd graders, and realistic thinking is something I have to be a part of. I am at the end of my rope, but I keep holding on to hope. I have no more optimism. Why should I? We were up 4-2 in the 9th against the best team in the National League, and we blew it. If Las Vegas tramps could blow clients like the Sox blow leads - they would retire as millionaires. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted June 13, 2003 Share Posted June 13, 2003 If Las Vegas tramps could blow clients like the Sox blow leads - they would retire as millionaires. LMAO .... Great line. Alas, I am right there with you in the lack of hope department. I've been a Sox for as many of my 45 years that I can remember. It seems to be a lifetime curse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Be Good Posted June 13, 2003 Share Posted June 13, 2003 JERRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRY!!!!!!!!!!, what the hell is wrong with him WHY did it take you that long to ask the question?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxplosion Posted June 13, 2003 Author Share Posted June 13, 2003 I was at the movies. I didnt get home til like 11... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steff Posted June 13, 2003 Share Posted June 13, 2003 OK, Bart did K Bonds 3 times. Maybe that was logical. But to have Marte face Aurilia? No way. Like someone said, that shoulda been Koch... Whhhooooosssshhhhh...... That gust nearly blew me away! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chosk8 Posted June 13, 2003 Share Posted June 13, 2003 Aurilia was PH for Marvin Bernard, a lefty. JM called for Marte for the lefty, lefty mach-up. Alou countered that move with Aurilia. JM made the right move at the time. Also, leaving Colon in was the right move, however not having someone up in the bullpen at the beginning of the inning wasn't. Marte should have been ready from the get-go of the ninth to face Bonds. Hell with the complete game, you have to play to win. Not scoring runs after the 3rd inning was the biggest problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted June 13, 2003 Share Posted June 13, 2003 Aurilia was PH for Marvin Bernard, a lefty. JM called for Marte for the lefty, lefty mach-up. Alou countered that move with Aurilia. JM made the right move at the time. Also, leaving Colon in was the right move, however not having someone up in the bullpen at the beginning of the inning wasn't. Marte should have been ready from the get-go of the ninth to face Bonds. Hell with the complete game, you have to play to win. Not scoring runs after the 3rd inning was the biggest problem. Yeah the whole getting 2 hits in innings 4-8 thing was a killer. Also the big DP's including Frank GIDP with one out and runners on the corners, the O just seemed to die after that one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CubKilla Posted June 13, 2003 Share Posted June 13, 2003 I don't care if Colon was throwing 107 mph - Barry Bonds should have been walked. Like others have said, no way do you walk Bonds in that situation. With no one out, you're bringing the winning run to the plate. And seeing as the next 2 or 3 batters reached base safely, JM would have been crucified for NOT allowing Colon to pitch to Bonds..... who he struck out, up to that point, 3 times. You take your chances in that situation. JM, for once, made the right move. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SI1020 Posted June 13, 2003 Share Posted June 13, 2003 If Las Vegas tramps could blow clients like the Sox blow leads - they would retire as millionaires. LMAO .... Great line. Alas, I am right there with you in the lack of hope department. I've been a Sox for as many of my 45 years that I can remember. It seems to be a lifetime curse. Many times I have asked my self why? Then I ask myself why not say the hell with it? But I taught my kids not to quit no matter what, so I've got to practice what I preach right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chosk8 Posted June 13, 2003 Share Posted June 13, 2003 Actually in hind sight, maybe JM should have pulled Colon for Marte to turn Durham around to the right side where he is a weaker hitter. Who knows, this team just continually finds different way to lose games. Last night was gut-wrenching. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CubKilla Posted June 13, 2003 Share Posted June 13, 2003 Actually in hind sight, maybe JM should have pulled Colon for Marte to turn Durham around to the right side where he is a weaker hitter. Maybe..... but Colon doesn't lead this gaggle of losers (exception: Loaiza) in CG's for nothing. You leave Colon in..... especially the way he was throwing up to that point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest wsc425 Posted June 13, 2003 Share Posted June 13, 2003 Its not just Jerry its also JR. Refer to an article in the Cubune. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted June 13, 2003 Share Posted June 13, 2003 But, hindsight is killing us. Too many opposing players are living off of hindsight. I'm ready to cash it in. I know I should never do that, but s*** -I'm 32 now, and I've been suffering for 24 years now. I have to teach 2nd graders, and realistic thinking is something I have to be a part of. I am at the end of my rope, but I keep holding on to hope. I have no more optimism. Why should I? We were up 4-2 in the 9th against the best team in the National League, and we blew it. If Las Vegas tramps could blow clients like the Sox blow leads - they would retire as millionaires. If Manuel brings in Marte to face Bonds and he gives up the HR, then Manuel looks stupid for replacing a guy who had dominated Bonds all night. Why can't you just chalk it up to Colon making a bad pitch and Bonds being a good hitter?? And there is NO way you walk Bonds and put the tying run on base with no one out. Lastly, if Jerry brings in Koch to face Aurilia, then Alou counters with a left-handed hitter. The bottom line is the Sox lost and the Giants won. There is no one to blame. If you want to blame Manual for everything, go for it. But you are off base here, Past. With the results that happened last night, there is no way he could win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chosk8 Posted June 13, 2003 Share Posted June 13, 2003 Lastly, if Jerry brings in Koch to face Aurilia, then Alou counters with a left-handed hitter. I thought JM made the move for Marte, then Alou countered with Aurilia to hit for Bernard? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted June 13, 2003 Share Posted June 13, 2003 Lastly, if Jerry brings in Koch to face Aurilia, then Alou counters with a left-handed hitter. I thought JM made the move for Marte, then Alou countered with Aurilia to hit for Bernard? That is exactly what happened. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted June 13, 2003 Share Posted June 13, 2003 Lastly, if Jerry brings in Koch to face Aurilia, then Alou counters with a left-handed hitter. I thought JM made the move for Marte, then Alou countered with Aurilia to hit for Bernard? That is exactly what happened. I didn't see, I was just basing it on what I read in other posts. If that is the case, then Manuel could have done nothing else. You can't change pitchers again. Marte had to pitch to Aurilia. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted June 13, 2003 Share Posted June 13, 2003 As Bond's ball sailed over the fence Colon should have been walking into the clubhouse with his head held high. JM should have made the move. I have three witnesses at my house, I was screaming at my computer even before the 9th went the rest oif the way to hell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTC2784 Posted June 13, 2003 Share Posted June 13, 2003 Lastly, if Jerry brings in Koch to face Aurilia, then Alou counters with a left-handed hitter. I thought JM made the move for Marte, then Alou countered with Aurilia to hit for Bernard? That is exactly what happened. I didn't see, I was just basing it on what I read in other posts. If that is the case, then Manuel could have done nothing else. You can't change pitchers again. Marte had to pitch to Aurilia. Like I said on 2 other threads, this is what I would have done had I been JM. Alfonzo at bat, runners on 2nd and 3rd, I believe. Colon pitching, Marte warming up. JM HAS TO KNOW THAT AURILIA IS ON THE BENCH. Bring in Marte against Alfonzo and his .214 average. Sometimes you should be able to count on Marte for a K. If Aurilia comes in to PH, you have 1B open to walk him. If Aurilia PHs for Bernard after Alfonzo gets out, he's faced his one batter and you bring in Tom Gordon to have the precious Righty-Righty matchup. So many more possibilities would have opened had JM put in Marte ONE batter earlier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted June 13, 2003 Share Posted June 13, 2003 Lastly, if Jerry brings in Koch to face Aurilia, then Alou counters with a left-handed hitter. I thought JM made the move for Marte, then Alou countered with Aurilia to hit for Bernard? That is exactly what happened. I didn't see, I was just basing it on what I read in other posts. If that is the case, then Manuel could have done nothing else. You can't change pitchers again. Marte had to pitch to Aurilia. Like I said on 2 other threads, this is what I would have done had I been JM. Alfonzo at bat, runners on 2nd and 3rd, I believe. Colon pitching, Marte warming up. JM HAS TO KNOW THAT AURILIA IS ON THE BENCH. Bring in Marte against Alfonzo and his .214 average. Sometimes you should be able to count on Marte for a K. If Aurilia comes in to PH, you have 1B open to walk him. If Aurilia PHs for Bernard after Alfonzo gets out, he's faced his one batter and you bring in Tom Gordon to have the precious Righty-Righty matchup. So many more possibilities would have opened had JM put in Marte ONE batter earlier. I didn't have a problem with Marte facing Aurillia. Until that HR righties were hitting a total of .104 against Damaso. I had a big problem with no one being ready against the 3-4-5 hitters of the Giants line up with a two run lead in the 9th. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soxhawks Posted June 13, 2003 Share Posted June 13, 2003 I was happy to see the slow start to the season so manuel would be fired but it has not happened someone needs to fire williams if he cannot fire manuel. HEY REINSDORF- :fyou Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxfest Posted June 13, 2003 Share Posted June 13, 2003 A lot of things are wrong with Jerry, in fact there are a lot of things wrong with this entire organization. I just don't feel like listing them now. CWSOX45 Agreed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted June 13, 2003 Share Posted June 13, 2003 You could second guess this whole f***ing game, and odds are, nothing would have worked the way we wanted it to. I personally feel that we should have actually walked Bonds, because he probably realized Colon was looking to get him to bounce into a DP, so Bonds looked down and in. That's where the pitch was, Bonds hammered it, and the game is essentially over. You walk Bonds, then you get to Santiago(or whoever it is), get him out however you can(whether it be getting him to GIDP, or popping up, flying out, striking out, etc), and you get the next guy(GIDP, or just getting him out), and then if you have to, the next guy. IMO, in that situation, you do not let Bonds beat you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rex Hudler Posted June 13, 2003 Share Posted June 13, 2003 You could second guess this whole f***ing game, and odds are, nothing would have worked the way we wanted it to. I personally feel that we should have actually walked Bonds, because he probably realized Colon was looking to get him to bounce into a DP, so Bonds looked down and in. That's where the pitch was, Bonds hammered it, and the game is essentially over. You walk Bonds, then you get to Santiago(or whoever it is), get him out however you can(whether it be getting him to GIDP, or popping up, flying out, striking out, etc), and you get the next guy(GIDP, or just getting him out), and then if you have to, the next guy. IMO, in that situation, you do not let Bonds beat you. Bonds didn't beat the Sox. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted June 13, 2003 Share Posted June 13, 2003 You could second guess this whole f***ing game, and odds are, nothing would have worked the way we wanted it to. I personally feel that we should have actually walked Bonds, because he probably realized Colon was looking to get him to bounce into a DP, so Bonds looked down and in. That's where the pitch was, Bonds hammered it, and the game is essentially over. You walk Bonds, then you get to Santiago(or whoever it is), get him out however you can(whether it be getting him to GIDP, or popping up, flying out, striking out, etc), and you get the next guy(GIDP, or just getting him out), and then if you have to, the next guy. IMO, in that situation, you do not let Bonds beat you. Bonds didn't beat the Sox. Technically, you are correct. However, I disagree. I just don't know how to put it into words. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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