2008 General Election Discussion Thread

[kapkomet]

So what exactly is surprising here to you? Obama has been conducting a much more positive campaign than we've seen in a generation and counting on a true grass roots movement. And then add his charisma.

 

Compare that to McCain who seems like an ordinary, run-of-the-mill guy running for president that you'd have difficulty differentiating from someone like Bob Dole or Walter Mondale (Personality-wise at least).

 

Is there any surprise that a lot of people with little interest in politics are gravitating towards Obama?

No, and that makes my point even bigger. If people understood as a whole the irrepairable damage RSO can do with a supermajority congress, they wouldn't gravitate toward him. That's the main reason why this man isn't going to delve into details on anything (so he has plans on his website, whooo, most people aren't going to sit there and read it). Charisma alone is probably going to win him the election.

 

[lostfan]

The whole point is that a large number of people that will vote for McCain know equally as little about him. So what else is new? This happens all the time.

Right. Nothing new. Move along. In fact, if looking at the polls tells me anything, it's that the average American voter hardly even pays attention to politics and mostly just associates things along a general liberal or conservative mindset, and takes things mostly at face value. People who pay attention to things like this, to include the reporters and talking heads on TV who overanalyze these things, assume everyone else is like them, and knows what they know.

 

No they won't. The "feel good" exposure is on RSO, not McCain.

How is this a "fault" of Obama's? Do you want him to stop being charismatic? Ok, so he has a tendency to hypnotize voters, which you may find creepy and automatically associate with some historical tyrants and dictators who ran cults of personality. Ok. But whenever I find people bringing this up they always ignore the fact that people like Reagan, Kennedy, Churchill, Roosevelt etc. also had this quality. So in and of itself, being a charismatic figure/great public speaker doesn't mean jack diddly.

[kapkomet]

Right. Nothing new. Move along. In fact, if looking at the polls tells me anything, it's that the average American voter hardly even pays attention to politics and mostly just associates things along a general liberal or conservative mindset, and takes things mostly at face value. People who pay attention to things like this, to include the reporters and talking heads on TV who overanalyze these things, assume everyone else is like them, and knows what they know.

 

 

How is this a "fault" of Obama's? Do you want him to stop being charismatic? Ok, so he has a tendency to hypnotize voters, which you may find creepy and automatically associate with some historical tyrants and dictators who ran cults of personality. Ok. But whenever I find people bringing this up they always ignore the fact that people like Reagan, Kennedy, Churchill, Roosevelt etc. also had this quality. So in and of itself, being a charismatic figure/great public speaker doesn't mean jack diddly.

The difference between RSO and Reagan is light years different. RSO has to keep reminding us about how bad everything is and he's going to fix it all for us. Reagan told us that WE the people should be the example, not our government.

 

[BigSqwert]

No, and that makes my point even bigger. If people understood as a whole the irrepairable damage RSO can do with a supermajority congress, they wouldn't gravitate toward him. That's the main reason why this man isn't going to delve into details on anything (so he has plans on his website, whooo, most people aren't going to sit there and read it). Charisma alone is probably going to win him the election.

I think you're being a little melodramatic about how out country will turn out with an Obama presidency. I was saying the same things in '04 about a 2nd Bush term. Granted things may happen that you may not be a fan of, not unlike what liberals just went through with GWB, but the world will continue to spin on its axis and the sun will still rise from the east.

[kapkomet]

I think you're being a little melodramatic about how out country will turn out with an Obama presidency. I was saying the same things in '04 about a 2nd Bush term. Granted things may happen that you may not be a fan of, not unlike what liberals just went through with GWB, but the world will continue to spin on its axis and the sun will still rise from the east.

When you look at what this man wants to do, there's fundamental shifts away from what makes us a better country. There's going to be little in the way of ingenuity or wanting to do things better from a private sector standpoint, if he gets purely what he wants (and they never do, but I am just saying it will be much easier for RSO then anyone else in modern history if he gets the super majority). We might as well all join the government and work for them, which is exactly what they want because then they're in control.

 

Edited August 13, 2008 by kapkomet

[BigSqwert]

When you look at what this man wants to do, there's fundamental shifts away from what makes us a better country. There's going to be little in the way of ingenuity or wanting to do things better from a private sector standpoint, if he gets purely what he wants (and they never do, but I am just saying it will be much easier for RSO then anyone else in modern history if he gets the super majority). We might as well all join the government and work for them.

Again, you are being melodramatic. After what many historians consider the worst president in history you think Obama would destroy the country? Come on now.

[kapkomet]

Again, you are being melodramatic. After what many historians consider the worst president in history you think Obama would destroy the country? Come on now.

Really? He's the worst president in history, why?

 

Iraq? That's laughable. The environment? Really?

 

How bad will Obama screw things?

 

-National Healthcare

-Windfall Taxation

-Extreme modification on free trade agreements

-Taxation as a whole - if he wants to tax pure profits of anyone in the private sector, where does it stop? "fair share" is pretty extreme and objective at best

-Environmental agreements that don't mean a damn thing but in essence tax our corporations again and put us on an uneven playing field - I'm all for it if the rest of the world is bound to the same thing

-whatever else is deemed necessary to be taken over by the government, since the private sector is too stupid to do it on their own (GIMME CONTROL, BABY!)

 

That's just a start, but I'm sure that all these issues, RSO is "right on" from your point of view. He'll have the power to do things that many before him couldn't do.

 

[lostfan]

The difference between RSO and Reagan is light years different. RSO has to keep reminding us about how bad everything is and he's going to fix it all for us. Reagan told us that WE the people should be the example, not our government.

I'm not trying to compare Reagan to Obama, that's just silly, I don't know where you drew that assumption.

 

I think you misinterpret Obama's general message. He talks about leadership (and yeah duh he is going to be that leader if he gets elected) and also talks about what he thinks the government should do (too much, IMO) but he talks about what "we" have to do "together" and he does talk a lot about individual responsibilies and obligations. I guess that can be interpreted as some kind of socialist mentality, having the society come together for a greater purpose, although I don't really know why. Conservatives actually say the same thing but in a different tone and from a different angle. All the rest of what Obama says, about complaining about where the country's been going, is just campaign talk to get elected.

[Rex Kickass]

Yup, that's my ENTIRE reason for not voting for Rock Star Obama.

 

Sadly, though, there will be a few people like that... and even sadder, most don't know why they ARE voting for him, other then he'll "CHANGE" things.

 

I for one, don't want a hell of a lot of change, but apparently, most want "change" (i.e. government running everything for me since I am not smart enough to do anything for myself).

 

At least you know what Obama stands for, by and large, if you actually take the time to look. His positions have for the most part been pretty consistent. I have no idea what McCain stands for because he only seems to be against what Obama is for. Even if that contradicts what he stood for two weeks earlier.

[kapkomet]

At least you know what Obama stands for, by and large, if you actually take the time to look. His positions have for the most part been pretty consistent. I have no idea what McCain stands for because he only seems to be against what Obama is for. Even if that contradicts what he stood for two weeks earlier.

I know that you haven't read a lot, but I've long said McCain sucks donkey balls. I can't stand the man. He better get his head out of his ass, but quick.

[lostfan]

Really? He's the worst president in history, why?

 

Iraq? That's laughable. The environment? Really?

Iraq is laughable? Please explain. That was probably the worst strategic decision made by any world power in the last 30 years. Well, it's on par with the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan, not to mention the horrendous mishandling of intelligence that led up to it. My current position on the war is that all of this is irrelevant right now, and that we've made that bed and we have to sleep in that. But this doesn't mean a favorable end, assuming we get there, will justify the means.

[NorthSideSox72]

Someone please explain who "RSO" is. I mean, contextually, I figured it was Obama. But what does that stand for?

 

[lostfan]

Someone please explain who "RSO" is. I mean, contextually, I figured it was Obama. But what does that stand for?

Rock Star Obama - he coined it a few posts ago and started short-titling it

[NorthSideSox72]

Rock Star Obama - he coined it a few posts ago and started short-titling it

Got it. I suppose that makes his campaign the RSO Speedwagon.

 

Maybe McCain should use a little Oingo Boingo for his campaign's theme music... Dead Man's Party?

 

[BigSqwert]

Rock Star Obama - he coined it a few posts ago and started short-titling it

Am I the only one that thinks it's strange that the GOP is attacking Obama for having too many people liking him? Should he be trying to get as few people to like him as possible?

[HuskyCaucasian]

Am I the only one that thinks it's strange that the GOP is attacking Obama for having too many people liking him? Should he be trying to get as few people to like him as possible?

THe GOP often forgets about oh say... Reagan and the Governator. It's ok for THEM to be a celebrity with little experience (especially in Arnold's case), but naaa.... not Obama.

Edited August 13, 2008 by Athomeboy_2000

[NorthSideSox72]

Am I the only one that thinks it's strange that the GOP is attacking Obama for having too many people liking him? Should he be trying to get as few people to like him as possible?

McCain is running an awful campaign so far. It really is all about Obama, which is just a horrible idea.

 

[kapkomet]

THe GOP often forgets about oh say... Reagan and the Governator. It's ok for THEM to be a celebrity with little experience (especially in Arnold's case), but naaa.... not Obama.

Arnold is a freaking idiot. He is not a GOP guy at all, so please don't label him in THEM. And I already said the difference between RSO and Reagan.

 

[kapkomet]

Am I the only one that thinks it's strange that the GOP is attacking Obama for having too many people liking him? Should he be trying to get as few people to like him as possible?

WHO likes him? Europe? People who think they're going to get something out of it (when they won't... in fact, I would argue the people he's going to "help" will end up being worse off, but that's just me, I guess).

 

And to NSS's point, McCain is ABSOLUTELY running a terrible campaign. But it's about what I expected from someone like him, which is why I don't like him.

 

[kapkomet]

Got it. I suppose that makes his campaign the RSO Speedwagon.

 

Maybe McCain should use a little Oingo Boingo for his campaign's theme music... Dead Man's Party?

Nice, on both lines.

[HuskyCaucasian]

Politics at it's finest.... Party First

Right-Wingers Oppose Drilling Compromise

The Wall St. Journal reports that some conservative Republicans are coming out against the "Gang Of 10" energy compromise, which increases offshore drilling while simultaneously increasing funding for alternative energy. The Journal notes that drilling could cease to be an effective wedge issue if both parties actually came together and agreed to a compromise plan.

[kapkomet]

Politics at it's finest.... Party First

When you read what's been leaked of the "compromise", it's no different then what's in place today, so let's (not you personally, the people who are trying to make it sound like this is some "breakthrough") just stop with the theatrics, huh?

[HuskyCaucasian]

When you read what's been leaked of the "compromise", it's no different then what's in place today, so let's (not you personally, the people who are trying to make it sound like this is some "breakthrough") just stop with the theatrics, huh?

I would argue it's very different than what's in place today.

It dramatically increases funding to alternative energy, increases taxes on oil, makes off-shore drilling "states rights", sets a goal of 85% non-oil based cars in 20 year (i think it was 20 years). It's a pretty drastic in my opinion.

[kapkomet]

I would argue it's very different than what's in place today.

It dramatically increases funding to alternative energy, increases taxes on oil, makes off-shore drilling "states rights", sets a goal of 85% non-oil based cars in 20 year (i think it was 20 years). It's a pretty drastic in my opinion.

Alternative funding on alternative energy. Ok.

 

Makes off shore drilling "states rights" in what, 4 states? And they still have a moritorium within 50 miles of the coast line, IIRC, so effectively, that leaves us where we are today. Big deal. It's all makeup on a pig.

 

Taxes on oil. YEA! We need THAT right now. That tells me that RSO doesn't give a s*** about the average American.

 

And goals don't mean s***. Gerald Ford, Jimmy Carter, Ronald Reagan, George Bush I, Bill Clinton, and GWB all had goals of getting us off of oil. It hasn't happened yet.

[southsider2k5]

I would argue it's very different than what's in place today.

It dramatically increases funding to alternative energy, increases taxes on oil, makes off-shore drilling "states rights", sets a goal of 85% non-oil based cars in 20 year (i think it was 20 years). It's a pretty drastic in my opinion.

 

Higher taxes with gasoline still $4 a gallon is pretty drastic IMO as well.