Sox will not offer arbitration to Dotel, Dye, Pods or Castro

[southsider2k5]

http://www.chicagobreakingsports.com/2009/...avio-dotel.html

 

White Sox face arbitration decisions on Dye, Dotel

November 30, 2009 6:00 PM | No Comments | UPDATED STORY

By Mark Gonzales

 

The landscape is different for the White Sox at this time than it was last winter, when they offered salary arbitration to free agent Orlando Cabrera. They were confident he would decline because of the emergence of Alexei Ramirez and the fact that Cabrera could have been cut and lost the majority of his salary.

 

By Tuesday night, the Sox must announce whether they will offer salary arbitration to their Type A free agents: right fielder Jermaine Dye and reliever Octavio Dotel. The Sox declined to announce their intentions any earlier, but chances are they won't offer arbitration to either player.

If that occurs, opposing teams would be expected to increase their interest in each player since they would no longer run the risk of losing a high draft pick. Meanwhile, the Sox would lose out on the chance to gain more high draft picks but would avoid the risk of either player accepting and receiving at least a fraction of their 2010 salary.

 

It's extremely rare for a player to take a pay cut in salary arbitration. Dye earned $11.5 million in 2009 and Dotel $6 million. Even if either player accepted salary arbitration and they were later cut in spring training, those players would receive either 30 days' pay or 45 days' pay, depending on the date in spring training that they were released. The major league calendar is around 180 days.

 

Last winter, Cabrera declined salary abribration but waited until early March to sign with Oakland for about $3 million.

 

A major league source told the New York Post last week that the Yankees had internal discussions about Dye (a report that general manager Brian Cashman denied to the Post), but Atlanta and San Francisco are in the market for power-hitting outfielders of Dye's caliber.

 

The Sox already have shored up their bench with the signings of Mark Kotsay, Omar Vizquel and Andruw Jones. SI.com pointed out that the Jones signing (for $500,000 base salary) marked a thaw in the relations between agent Scott Boras and the Sox, but Jones already is assured of about $13.8 million in deferred payments since getting his release from the Los Angeles Dodgers after the 2008 season.

 

And in last June's draft, the Sox selected Rocky Mount (NC) High School outfielder Brian Goodwin, who was advised by Boras but is attending the University of North Carolina.

 

In other free agent news, FOX Sports reported the New York Mets are close to signing backup catcher Henry Blanco, whom the Sox have interest in, according to Blanco's agent.

[LittleHurt05]

no way they offer either of them arbitration. Can't risk Dye accepting and having to pay him $11 mil again, same with Dotel at $6 mil or more

[balfanman]

I know it's a lot of money (not mine fortunately), but I still think that Dotel is the best option out there and personally I would offer him arbitration. The worst that happens is he accepts and we overpay for what should be a quality reliever. JMHO.

[iamshack]

I know it's a lot of money (not mine fortunately), but I still think that Dotel is the best option out there and personally I would offer him arbitration. The worst that happens is he accepts and we overpay for what should be a quality reliever. JMHO.

I think Dotel's been undervalued by most Sox fans as well.

I think the best bet is to not offer him arb though and try to resign him to a 2/$6 m deal or something though.

[NorthSideSox72]

I know it's a lot of money (not mine fortunately), but I still think that Dotel is the best option out there and personally I would offer him arbitration. The worst that happens is he accepts and we overpay for what should be a quality reliever. JMHO.

Sounds good in a vacuum, but it sounds bad when you consider that the $6M he'd probably earn would likely hinder the efforts to fill actual holes in the lineup. So I don't think offerring arb is a good idea - try to sign him to a new deal as shack said, if he'd take a couple mill maybe, but I think he'll get more than that as a free agent.

 

[balfanman]

Sounds good in a vacuum, but it sounds bad when you consider that the $6M he'd probably earn would likely hinder the efforts to fill actual holes in the lineup. So I don't think offerring arb is a good idea - try to sign him to a new deal as shack said, if he'd take a couple mill maybe, but I think he'll get more than that as a free agent.

 

That's all well and good, and I'm not necessarily disagreeing, but you do risk losing him that way. Would Dotels value be replaced by whoever replaces him in the bullpen? I'm not talking about financial value, I'm referring to performance.

[chetkincaid]

Wow... I just read somewhere that Roy Halladay is pretty much on his way to the either the yanks or the red sawks. They'll sign him to a 5 year 100 and something million dollar deal like it's nothing - and we're struggling over paying Dotel SIX million. I can't even imagine what it's like to be a Pirates fan. Is it time for a salary cap in baseball? What do you guys think?

 

Sorry to hijack the thread... this probably should have been posted somewhere else...

[NorthSideSox72]

That's all well and good, and I'm not necessarily disagreeing, but you do risk losing him that way. Would Dotels value be replaced by whoever replaces him in the bullpen? I'm not talking about financial value, I'm referring to performance.

If the Sox had another $20M of headroom, then sure, offer him arb. He would probably (but not necessarily) be better than what else we could find. But you cannot take the financial aspect out of the picture, because these are not the Yankees. The Sox have limited money left for OF, DH, and assorted other lesser needs. So the real question is, if you sign Dotel for $6M versus someone else for $1M, is that difference in results going to outweigh having to settle for scraps for OF and DH?

 

[Jordan4life_2007]

Wow... I just read somewhere that Roy Halladay is pretty much on his way to the either the yanks or the red sawks. They'll sign him to a 5 year 100 and something million dollar deal like it's nothing - and we're struggling over paying Dotel SIX million. I can't even imagine what it's like to be a Pirates fan. Is it time for a salary cap in baseball? What do you guys think?

 

Sorry to hijack the thread... this probably should have been posted somewhere else...

 

Link? This is not exactly news. Has something new developed?

[NorthSideSox72]

Link? This is not exactly news. Has something new developed?

In the Diamond Club there is a thread - Halladay says he'd reject any trade deal that was done after first day of Spring Training. He is forcing TOR's hand.

 

[southsider2k5]

The only way we offer arbit is if we can get one, or both, of these guys to agree to reject it so that we can protect picks, which we would receive back. As bad as the market was for the questionable type A free agents last year, I can't see the guys hanging an extra noose around their neck just to help out the Sox.

[justBLAZE]

White Sox will not offer salary arbitration to free agents, Dye, Dotel, Podsednik and Castro.

 

per Reifert.

[NorthSideSox72]

White Sox will not offer salary arbitration to free agents, Dye, Dotel, Podsednik and Castro.

 

per Reifert.

I thought Pods and Castro had already filed for FA, so that would be moot?

 

No surprise on Dye and Dotel.

 

[justBLAZE]

When do we find out how much, the arbitration eligible players on the Sox roster, are going to make next year?

[southsider2k5]

When do we find out how much, the arbitration eligible players on the Sox roster, are going to make next year?

 

When they agree to a contract prior to the process. The Sox never go to arbitration with their own players. Honestly I couldn't even tell you the last time that it actually happened.

[Kalapse]

When do we find out how much, the arbitration eligible players on the Sox roster, are going to make next year?

Mid-January. The arbitration filing period is the second week in January, they exchange figures on on the 19th and the hearings are held the first 3 weeks of February so you'll see 1 year deals handed out after the filing period.

[Kalapse]

That's all well and good, and I'm not necessarily disagreeing, but you do risk losing him that way. Would Dotels value be replaced by whoever replaces him in the bullpen? I'm not talking about financial value, I'm referring to performance.

Takashi Saito could potentially do what Dotel does, you can find that kind of production. It's not worth paying him 2+ times what he's worth just because you don't want to risk losing him. For no team in baseball is Octavio Dotel worth ~$6.5M a year let alone one that bumping up against their budgetary ceiling.

 

And just because they're not going to offer him arbitration doesn't mean they won't at least attempt to bring him back at a more palatable price.

[elrockinMT]

Trying to keep an open mind, but at the same time I hope we are not making a mistake here. I thought winning was the name of the game. Maybe we have something up our sleeves for the Winter Meetings in the way of trades, but I am not to optimistic

[NorthSideSox72]

Trying to keep an open mind, but at the same time I hope we are not making a mistake here. I thought winning was the name of the game. Maybe we have something up our sleeves for the Winter Meetings in the way of trades, but I am not to optimistic

Winning is the name of the game, but the Sox are a business, and like any business have fiscal constraints. You try to win, within your available reality.

 

 

[scotty22hotty]

While Dotel had a great '09 season

~$6Mil for a 36 year old arm isn't worth the risk. But looking at FA options... I doubt KW will find anyone better for the price.

Edited December 1, 2009 by scotty22hotty

[elrockinMT]

Winning is the name of the game, but the Sox are a business, and like any business have fiscal constraints. You try to win, within your available reality.

 

 

Then we were lied to. All you have to do is go back on previous owner and GM comments about putting money out there on salary spending. Obviously finances are a concern for all teams unless there is collusion amongst team ownership as has been put out there by agents. I am hoping we are working on a new master plan to win

[Jordan4life_2007]

Then we were lied to. All you have to do is go back on previous owner and GM comments about putting money out there on salary spending. Obviously finances are a concern for all teams unless there is collusion amongst team ownership as has been put out there by agents. I am hoping we are working on a new master plan to win

 

Huh? We were lied to? This makes no sense.

[balfanman]

Takashi Saito could potentially do what Dotel does, you can find that kind of production. It's not worth paying him 2+ times what he's worth just because you don't want to risk losing him. For no team in baseball is Octavio Dotel worth ~$6.5M a year let alone one that bumping up against their budgetary ceiling.

 

Once again, I'm not necessarily disagreeing, but we are looking at potential here. There are probably a hundred or more options out there that can "potentially do" what Dotel does. Dotel is not a lock to perform as his usual self either, but I believe that he is a much safer bet than most any other name that I've heard is available. I would hate to miss the playoffs next season mainly because our bullpen sucked when we had a piece in our grasp and let him go. I think that we tremendously under value what Dotel has done the last couple of seasons.

 

You may well be correct, I just don't know. I only hope that K. W. and his scouting staff make the right decision here.

[Princess Dye]

Then we were lied to. All you have to do is go back on previous owner and GM comments about putting money out there on salary spending. Obviously finances are a concern for all teams unless there is collusion amongst team ownership as has been put out there by agents. I am hoping we are working on a new master plan to win

 

The Sox have been pretty consistent about being one of the respectable payroll teams each year.

 

I'm glad they're waiting this offseason out. When Konerko comes off the books then you'll have enough money to address the middle-of-the-order problem in a legitimate free agency way.

 

You can tell when Kenny sets his mind on filling a spot during an offseason. He made plays for Torii and Fukudome before settling on Swisher.

 

This year is a wait-and-see, and part of that will be seeing if they can get by a year with scrap heap guys that could pan out.

 

But with Peavy in place I think they're seeing '10 as a maybe-we'll-contend year...with '11 as an aim-at-contention year.

Edited December 1, 2009 by Princess Dye

[BigSqwert]

But with Peavy in place I think they're seeing '10 as a maybe-we'll-contend year...with '11 as an aim-at-contention year.

I kept being told that all the moves we made last year were for 2010 and if we happened to win the division in 2009 that was supposed to be gravy. Now we're pushing it another year?