Look at Ray Ray Run

Yes, "preach" because you appear to be incapable of adding anything of substance to these discussions but for passive aggressive vibes at some and a lot of thataboy to others. The Sox targeted high ceiling guys for the rebuild. I've already posted an article clearly citing and showing this... with comparisons to other rebuilds. That was my point when discussing acquiring this guy via Intl free agency.

Based on this, floor to you means college mostly. Theres nothing about Steele Walker that says high floor.

Apparently, other pitchers drafted that high were starters or out of the league. There was a TON of risk attached to Fulmer. There was nothing safe about that pick. There were multiple teams that didn't even have Fulmer on their draft board.

Don't bother? My goodness, you don't bother because you can't present a reasonable or rational case for your side of the discussion. I don't get personal; I post what has happened. I posted a reputable source breaking it down for you, hoping maybe you could learn something from it, but apparently it's better to add nothing to a discussion but belittling nonsense of others views. Thanks for your contributions. The best part is you told me bmags was talking about the draft at the beginning so apparently, reading is a class you should consider taking up on the side as this entire discussion was about the current direction of the organization that has clearly targeted tools over production - as the article I posted very clearly states and lays out for you.

what?

Oh, sorry.. so they occasionally drafted a guy that was safer. I over spoke when I said every - I should have said the vast majority. My bad. On the other hand, you have claimed this wasn't their philosophy at all for the rebuild.

On the verge lol. Collins is in AAA 3 years after he was drafted as a "college ready hitter" according to you. That somehow proves your point? I'd disagree. Fulmer did not earn a trip to the big leagues, and he certainly hasn't been productive there. Rodon fit the bill of high ceiling and high floor. That doesn't happen often.

Internationally their philosophy is very clearly the same - very toolsy, but less production so far. I'm honestly not sure how you can continue to argue this but OK. The Sox took more risks with high ceiling talent than any other rebuild prior to them. Those are the facts. More than the Cubs and the Astros and etc. Carry on though.

What's funny is that's not what I said to start this conversation, yet I'm somehow the one who didn't read. Odd stuff. Let's break this down for you since you seem to be struggling with the facts of what happened. This thread is about signing an international free agent prospect. Not the draft. Here is how this went down: SS2k said he was disappointed that with 2 years to prepare, the Sox big take home was a limited defensive wizard... I responded with the following: "You never know how any of these guys will pan out. The Sox have a history of always going high ceiling low floor over high floor, lower ceiling players. That leads to a lot of busts. Sometimes, it's nice to maybe lock up a guy with a higher floor and a perceived lower ceiling. Those guys sometimes becomes superstars too - see Jose Ramirez. Baseball is a tricky game." That has clearly been the organizational philosophy for about a decade. Bmags responded to my post with: "In what world is this true?" So far, absolutely NOTHING about drafting was said. So the whole, Ray Ray doesn't read is nonsense. The entire formulation of this discussions delved from a comment made about a limited prospect signing with the Sox over others... and I said it's a breath of fresh air for the Sox to go after a high ceiling guy for once. BMags says since when? Then I point out about 100 players the Sox have acquired that were high ceiling, low floor with at on of risk. AFter all of that, he starts bringing up drafts from 15 years ago to support his point. So, no... I'm not the one who wasn't reading or misunderstood.

Yes, but these guys will tell you the Sox were drafting high floor guys... even though the only prospect they've had reach the majors from those draft classes and contribute is Tim Anderson who was the definition of high floor, low ceiling. Weird that they draft all these high floor guys and they never reach the big leagues... it's almost like, they weren't high floor guys.

No, I can claim their high ceiling because that's what the team targeted. In comparison to other rebuilding organizations, the Sox took a lot more risk with their player acquisitions. I posted one link from a source that isn't me, if that'll make it more "valid" to you.

Here you go: https://blogs.fangraphs.com/the-white-sox-big-bets-on-risk/ Soxtalk says the Sox don't target high ceiling, low floor guys though. Weird. You have to consider the source though, I guess...

No, I'm going off a guy with a 45/45/55/55/65 skill set. That's the scouting report. The same scouting report you said has him with only 1 plus tool when there are 3. So clearly you're not going off scouting reports... and scouting reports had Tatis at 45/40/55/50/50. How did that work out? Ironic to see the guy who said he doesn't want a guy with 1 tool say he was going off scouting reports that showed 3 + and 2 slightly below average.

The source? OK. I didn't skim over anything. I pointed out the Sox current philosophy for about 7-10 years now.. I don't care about 20 years ago. Sorry.

And I'm talking about an organizational philosophy TODAY and with this rebuild and modern organization; not picks from 15 years ago. It's quite obvious the Sox have been targeting guys with higher ceilings for about 10 years now.

They draft out of college more because the guy in charge of all of this has a college background. They aren't' drafting safe college players every year. They take a lot of risks with college guys.

Collins was not drafted to be a 1st baseman, and if he was he wouldn't have been drafted in the first round. Hence, the risk with the pick, and hence the shooting for the high ceiling.

Jared Mitchell wasn't even GOOD at LSU. I have no idea how you say he wasn't a high ceiling guy. Laughable really. There's nothing safe about getting a reliever with a top 8 pick. There was huge risk attached to Fulmer and Sale. Arguing otherwise is just pointless.

You literally call Collins a high floor guy and then say... if he doesn't catch, he's not an MLB player. He was a big risk to stick at catcher when they drafted him, so there was nothing high floor about him.

Who says they don't give him 2 million and sign 10 other guys between 250-750?

There was nothing safe about: Madrigal - Definitely fits the bill. Very high floor. Collins - Collins didn't have a high floor if he couldn't stick at catcher. He had a high ceiling because HE COULD stick at catcher. He was a risk there. Fulmer - Certainly didn't have a high floor as a starter - most thought he was a risk at that pick because of his delivery. Tim Anderson - the definition of high ceiling, very low floor, when drafted. Rodon - Pretty consensus, I'd say he had a very high floor but there also wasn't anyone they could have drafted with a higher ceiling. Courtney Hawkins - All tools, no productions. Definition of high ceiling terrible floor. Chris Sale - Risky pick, many thought he wouldn't stick as a starter. In the eyes of scouts, Chris Sale did not have a high floor as a starter. Jared Mitchell - The poster boy example for why college does not equal safer. He was about as high ceiling low floor as you get from a prospect. Beckham - He was a high floor guy, hence why he's still around. Clearly, in 2009 the White Sox changed their approach.

You've never seen him play. You have no idea where his skill set is headed. At this point, you're just complaining to complain.

College doesn't mean they attack high floor, low ceiling guys. This entire rebuild has been predicated on high ceiling, low floor guys. I honestly have no idea how anyone could argue otherwise. Moncada, Kopech, Cease, Giolito, Lopez, Rutherford, Robert - every single one of those guys were more tools and hype than production at the minor league level. They all had substantial bust risk attached to them because they were rated highly based on their tools, not their production. As I said, Fangraphs has written multiple pieces on this - regarding the White Sox rebuild direction, and how risky their top elite prospects were compared to other teams who have done the same thing.

Fangraphs has literally done a piece on how the White Sox focused on high ceiling, low floor guys, in this rebuild. But OK bud. I guess I couldn't be more wrong. When people say things like "you couldn't be more wrong" and then don't tell you why, it's kind of a pointless post.

I couldn't disagree with you more. Prospect rankings for guys in MiLB are inconsistent and unreliable; plenty of guys at the top bust, and plenty of the unranked ones become stars. This after watching these guys play professional baseball stateside. Prospect rankings for international prospects is even worse and less reliable; which is saying something. If you trust Paddy, then just sit back and relax. Ideally, a guy like Paddy, would prefer to sign 25 guys than a couple big ones. That's been his MO of success.