Look at Ray Ray Run

Salary figures are trending downward in the MLB, so I don't think this is a correct number in the least bit. Payrolls have not been going up with revenue increase - they have stagnated a bit.

Well, I'm using a 30+ year sample of Reinsdorf owning the team as my budget. If you think the Chicago White Sox are going to start spending 200 million and competing with the Yankees and Dodgers for the top payroll in MLB then I'm afraid you are going to be one disappointed fan. They have operated in the top 5 when they have been successful, which is why I give them 50 extra million than they've ever spent before because they have been in that territory before... but 180 is being very generous. They certainly aren't threatening to outspend the big boys though.

Sure, but banking on filling your roster with 22 prospects and having them pan out just isn't realistic. They have no one else signed for 2021. They will clearly want to add other pieces. The White Sox will be lucky if 6 of their top 20 prospects become average/above average MLB contributors. They need more veterans, and they won't be able to afford them if they sign both.

baseball reference salary obligations. Herrera and Jones have mutual/vesting options. So they are not 100% committed and locked up. The only person signed in 2021 for sure, is Tim Anderson. They will literally have to fill out an entire roster in 2021 and it won't be 22 minor league prospects, Tim Anderson, Byrce and Manny. That will not work.

So you think the White Sox are suddenly going to start outspending the Yankees and Dodgers? The White Sox have never once had a pay higher than 129 million. They were top 5 in payroll (5th) 4 times in the past 15 years. If they return to that, it puts them around 180 million and I am being generous with that ceiling given that they've never had a payroll over 129 million.

The White Sox are not going to be able to supplement all the young players with only two star veterans - it just won't work. The White Sox have very few salary commitments in 2021 but they also have very few players. Honestly, the Sox (ignoring arbitration) would have nearly 100 million dollars tied up in 5 players: (4 if no Herrera and 3 with no Jones). They'd have 85 million locked up on 3 players. Jones, Herrera, Anderson, Manny and Harper. They would need to fill every other roster spot (20+ guys) for around 70 million. A little over 3 million a player. This doesn't even count Rodon either. It's just not plausible. We'd be going right back to the stars and scrubs nonsense that got us into this rebuild in the first place.

Say they all get 5 million instead of the 10 million, the Sox still aren't in much better position. They still have very limited funds to fill 15 roster spots. You can't commit 65 million to two guys - maybe even 70 million - when your salary ceiling is probably 170ish million, MAYBE 180.

My point, is the White Sox cannot commit 65 million dollars to two players with the young talent they'll have to pay (arb salaries have been going up up up and in 4 years it wouldn't be shocking to see things similar). Yes, Rendon is good, but expecting one of the young players to become Rendon (who has injury history) isn't absurd nor was it projected as I didn't put anyone anywhere near 18 million. Year 2, year 3 - they all matter given the length of contracts being given to Harper and Machado. I hear you, and I understand, but the point is the Sox don't have zero salary obligations - or 21 million - in 2021/2022 whatever year. They have to pay guys, and if those guys suck the'll have to pay someone else.

I just don't think this is necessarily true. Kevin Gausmann just got 9.35 million in arbitration and he is far from a star. He's a league average pitcher, maybe. Wheeler, who has barely pitched, got 6 million (hence my 7 million for Lucas if he's still around). Rendon just got 18 million - Moncada could easily be as good as Rendon and he could also be a little less good which puts him around 14 million. Scooter Gennet just got 10 million. Kneble got 5.2 million - which is where any of the young relievers could be by then. Xander got 12 million. Those guys aren't "super stars." They are good/average MLB players. Arbitration is becoming more and more expensive, and the number quoted are easily attainable without a star-level of success.

You are correct; I was looking end of 2021, not prior. That is my bad. So still, that's your issue in 2022 instead of 2021 - the point still stands.

They would be in Arb 2, not Arb 1. That's a big difference.

7 and 10 million in arbitration aren't what they used to be in Arb. If Moncada is actually good he could easily go 15+. Lopez could easily get more than 10. Those were actually not optimistic projections - based on arbitration 2 settlements this year, if those guys are still in the league contributing all year those salaries are actually quite likely. If they're not in the league, the Sox will have to spend at least that to fill those holes.

Yeah, I'm not even counting the money they'll owe to young bullpen guys that will be arb eligible. It won't be a lot, but it'll be 3-5 million per if their any good. The Sox would be better off giving Manny the 32 million/per and then using the Harper 35 millionish to sign 2+ MLB players.

Arbitration won't be cheap in 2021 - assuming growth. If you commit 65 million to two players, you are capping yourself quite a bit. Let's say the Sox return to the days when they ran a top 5 payroll - you're still looking in the 170-180ish range. That would mean that Machado and Harper would be taking up 36% of the payroll, roughly, and they'd only make up 8% of the roster. Tim will be owed 10 million: Then you have: Moncada - Arb 2 (if decent, 10 million) Lopez - Arb 2 (If decent, 10 million+) Gio - Arb 2 (7 million) Rodon - Arb 3 (14 million+) Herrera - 10 million Nate Jones - 6 million This is 132 million and it is tied up in They will then be without a 1st baseman, without a catcher (let's assume Collins or Seby fill this roll, so we'll say 2.5 million at catcher). Robert will be on the books still as well. That means, between just the guys above, the Sox will have 10 players on their roster and 132 million in payroll - leaving them with about 50 million to sign/fill the remaining 15 spots on the roster - or about 3.3 million per player. The Sox would have zero wiggle room for failure by signing both.

Futures are pulled all the time. That market is irrelevant to this entire outcome anyway.

Many scouts say the #1 NFL comp for Murray is Baker. Just an FYI.

Yes. This times 1000.

The White Sox and their Front Office aren't even in Chicago. Hahn will be in Arizona tomorrow; they're not calling a press conference to announce a signing of Manny in Chicago.

Why do we continue to post fake twitter people?

eh, there's some decent smoke... reason i say that, is because every single indicator this week has pointed to the White Sox which is typically how these long drawn out disputes starting coming to light. JD Martinez is the example everyone is using and rightfully so. My confidence has moved from 80% to 100% that Manny Machado signs with the White Sox. Mainly because there are NO OTHER suitors for Manny. Lozano is desperately trying to get just some other reasonable offer and he can't. It's just a matter of time at this point; sit back and relax because Machado is going to be a White Sox and in camp within 5 days.

Personal? You've attacked the people of the USA and called people failures and losers lol. I said nothing of the sort.

Kiwi, you seem to have a lot of pent up anger and absolutest views on society and the people within it... I'm sorry you're so angry, but here's to hoping you get it all out one day. In the meantime, you can go ahead and cast judgement on anyone and everyone you please with ignorant views and I'll just go ahead and ignore them going forward. Any other erroneous facts you want to spew, someone else can call you on them. Now Australians just work better; which is something that would be impossible for you to measure but whatever.

Another erroneous "Fact" form Kiwi. American's work longer hours and more days than Australia and most developed nations.

There's a large portion of this country that can't even get cable internet. I have already shown the statistics stating that Australians make more money. Undeveloped? This would be like saying the US is undeveloped because large portions of the west are undeveloped. My goodness. Have a good day.

Education is something that everyone deserves though and the more educated people are, the better the world in general. It's an investment in advancements and futures - not everyone with a comm degree go on to work as a Barista - just as not all pre-med kids become doctors. You can't withhold opportunity from those kids, even though I agree with you. Also, the subprime mortgage lending was much more dangerous because you can default on those loans; as I said. Student loans can't really cripple unless unemployment surged to levels that would cripple the economy anyway. The big problem with student loans is the money it takes out of the economy from young people who can't buy homes, cars, condos and other big purchases with that burden.