77 Hitmen

Fair enough. I know my list is very subjective. As far as Sale goes, it'll depend if he can have another few years of his 2024 performance to see where his legacy ends up.

This was the story I read with the one rep saying they were "close and just ran out of time." We'll see in a few months - it's just one elected official saying that while the reps from Chicago (who would lose the Bears to AH) don't share the same optimism. https://www.chicagotribune.com/2025/06/01/general-assembly-bears-stadium/ I'm not sure how this would impact the White Sox, but I'd imagine *IF* Justin Ishbia wants a new stadium for the team he's going to buy AND is willing to commit private financing for the ballpark itself, then a deal to help the Bears could help pave the way for action to help with infrastructure needs for a new Sox stadium. And there's also the Fire saying they want to break ground at the 78 this fall. We'll see if that indeed happens and what kind of infrastructure investment the city/state commits for that site to get the Fire stadium built.

The Commanders new stadium has a price tag of $2.7B (which the team is paying) but the whole project will cost ~$4B when you count infrastructure and other development at the site. That's probably how you get to $5B for the Bears since they want to develop more than just a stadium at Arlington Park. Heck, the 1901 Project at the UC is supposed to cost $7B. And the proposed redevelopment of the parking lots around Citi Field in NYC reportedly has an $8B price tag. https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/44893202/washington-commanders-dc-reach-deal-new-stadium-rfk-site

The new Washington Commanders stadium So, you think that 75% of all the people in Cook Country are grifters or (gasp) government workers? And that being in a union automatically makes someone a grifter? Sounds far fetched. And I'm not sure what government workers have to do with building a new stadium.

And at least Jerry hired people in the first 20 years or so that could develop talent internally (the late 80s core and the late 90s/early 00s core). That has mostly dried up over the last 20 years. I know it's still to be seen if Crochet has nearly as much of a success as Sale in his career, but his trade followed the same pattern: the Sox are so bad at fielding a winning team and developing talent, that he may as well be traded for some top prospects since he's being wasted here. And the Sox were never going to pay him when he was up for free agency anyway if he gets good enough.

You're right. I knew they got him in a trade of course, but I thought he was a minor leaguer at the time who later came up to the majors for the Sox. At any rate, he was at the very beginning of his MLB career when he came over to the Sox with only 25 games with the Rangers.

While more expensive for sure, I doubt that being in IL would more than double the price of a stadium. There has to be more to the $5B figure than just the stadium itself. We'll see what happens in the fall IL legislative session. One of the state reps suggested they were really close to a deal, but ran out of time in the spring.

Sounds like I struck a nerve. How does Bell's TOTAL RBI's for both 92 and 93 seasons help this team when they really needed him in 1993 when they went to the ALCS and only won 2 games against the Jays. You didn't answer where Bell was during the 1993 playoffs. As I said before, the Sox sure could have used Sammy's bat that year when he was knocking in 93 RBIs while Bell was one step away from pumping gas for a living. Oh, and the Sox finished 3rd in 1992, so Bell put up great numbers that year for a team that went nowhere. I hate Sosa as much as anyone, but let's be real here. During the Reinsdorf era, I'd say the Sox had 4 players with generational talent that they brought up from their minor league system: - Thomas: first ballot HOFer inducted as a Sox player - Sosa: traded away for one good season of George Bell while Sosa supercharged the Cubs popularity in Chicago, though later disgraced (and rightfully so) - Tatis: superstar for the Padres after traded for a washed up pitcher - Chris Sale: Elite starter for years before and after Sox traded him. Traded in an attempt to stock the Sox system with talent for a rebuild. But Moncada and Kopech were total flops. Sox were never going to pay for an extension for him anyway. Am I missing anyone? Not exactly a great track record for Jerry's franchise.

Bingo. It wasn't until Sosa burst onto the scene that the Cubs averaged 30k per game year in and year out and they haven't looked back except for during Covid. And the last two you listed were given to the Cubs by the White Sox on a silver platter.

So, you think Bell having 64 RBIs in 1993 was worth trading away a generational talent like Sosa? Sosa had 93 RBIs that year vs. Bell's 64 if we're treating that one stat as the only indicator of success. Bell's slash line in 1993 was .217/.243/.363 with a -2.5 WAR. Woof! And where was he during our 1993 postseason when the Sox needed him? We sure could have used Sosa's bat then. After that Bell was out of baseball. He never played another game after 1993. Sox coaching staff being unable to work with such an immense talent speaks more to the failing of this organization than it does to a player whose career took off like a rocket after he left this organization. I don't know about other Sox fans, but I'll take chopped liver over the s%*# sandwich that this trade was for the Sox. And yeah, Sammy turned out to be a huge fraud, but in the meantime he help supercharged the Cubs' edge over the Sox in the Chicago market beginning in 1998 and they've never looked back. Somehow they've survived the embarrassment of Sosa's steroid/corked bat/walking out on the team debacle.

What's even more galling is that taxpayers are still on the hook for something like $600M from the last Soldier Field renovation in 2002. In a way, them asking for more taxpayer $ again for a new stadium is worse than JR's request (which is plenty galling)

The new Titans domed stadium in Nashville costs $2.2B and the renderings of it look impressive. Why would a Bears stadium cost well over twice as much? And you're not wrong that a $5B price tag has been reported for a Bears stadium at AH. Is the other $3B for development of the rest of the Arlington Park property? As far as a Sox stadium at the 78, it's possible that the Ishbias' plan is to keep the Sox at their current location. If they are actually planning to privately finance a new stadium at the 78, who's to say they aren't working behind the scenes to make that happen? Sure, we fans want to know one way or another asap, but I don't expect them to think that they need to negotiate all their plans in public. Heck, has Justin Ishbia made any public announcement of his deal with Reinsdorf to (eventually) buy the Sox?

I'd imagine it's a lot easier for the city and state to justify that infrastructure funding if there's also a (privately financed) MLB stadium going into the site. Having a Red Line station right at 15th and Clark would be huge for the site. That line already runs underground at that intersection.

....and the Fire say they're going to do exactly that. Joe Mansueto isn't announcing that he's spending $650M to build a stadium on that site without being aware of the Roosevelt Rd. and Metra track alignments. Part of the Fire's plans are to build an extension of LaSalle St to connect Roosevelt to the site. It looks to me like the biggest issue with the site (as shown by that Google Maps link) is the Metra tracks which essentially blocks it off from any access via Clark St. But railroad track can be lowered to below grade to open up access. Would that be expensive? Yes. But probably not prohibitively so and that kind of work isn't exactly cutting-edge engineering marvel stuff.

Back to the topic of idiot asshole fans insulting the mother of someone on the field, this is exactly what got Mr. Met fired. https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2017/jun/01/mr-met-fired-obscene-gesture-new-york-mets And this article even has a quote from the Sox latest washed up former star acquistion: Last season, Mets ace Noah Syndergaard said he was terrified of Mr. Met and his wife, the appropriately named Mrs. Met. “They’re just creepy,”...

The way this got huge coverage in the press AND because the Sox have had several black eyes in the national media over the years with fan incidents, I doesn't surprise me that they felt they should take quick, strong action. People are still talking about the belly fat shooting incident (especially with Jerry being deposed now) and it took at least a decade for the franchise to live down the Ligue incident. Yeah, there are idiot fans everywhere and at pretty much any MLB park, but the Sox image has really been hit hard in the past by fan incidents.

That actually matches perfectly with any optimism I have for the future. Plans are in place for our current inept owner to sell this team to a deep-pocketed local billionaire and we pray that he'll totally turn this franchise around. Sounds like as good of a rebuild strategy as any of the Sox recent failed attempts.

Good point about the footprint needed. Just doing a quick online search of a few random open air and retractable roof stadiums showed that the retractable ones took up something like twice the amount of acreage. Something like 12-15 acres vs. about 25 or so. And yes, it's a legitimate question as to whether (no pun intended) such a thing is necessary in our part of the country. The only cold weather cities with retractable roof ballparks are Toronto and Milwaukee. The other northeast/midwest cities seem to have managed without a roof.

Yep, it would easily add a few hundred million to the cost of a stadium. That would be on the new ownership's dime and it's not clear they even plan to pay for an open air stadium to replace the current one. On the plus side, such a stadium could be used for other events like concerts during more of the year - especially since the chances of an indoor football stadium, which would compete for such events, being built nearby are close to zero. But do such events and the number of times the Sox play in bad weather justify the cost? I don't know - it's not my money.

I just searched for images of the Houston ballpark. Wow, I didn't realize that it opened up so completely. That looks pretty good. Thanks for the views of Miami and Milwaukee, too. Chase Field in AZ also has panes in the outfield that open when the roof is opened. Those are nice touches, but Milwaukee and AZ still feel like a "building" and such a design at the 78 would still block the skyline. I've been to Seattle's ballpark and it really opens up great, but that stadium is not climate controlled.

Paul Sullivan has an article in the Trib today says he believes if Ishbia is going to build a new stadium at the 78, it's "imperative" that he comes up with plans for a retractable roof stadium. He says the intense heat/humidity we've had in recent days is a good argument for a retractable roof stadium. https://www.chicagotribune.com/2025/06/25/chicago-white-sox-stadium-retractable-roof/ Thoughts on this? One obvious downside would be that it costs a lot more to build such a stadium vs an open air ballpark (which is already very expensive at over $1B). But what about aesthetics? One big selling point of a ballpark at the 78 is a stunning skyline view it would offer. Wouldn't that be negated/blocked by the structure needed for a retractable roof stadium? IMO, comparing most retractable roof stadiums to an open air stadium is like comparing a car w/ a sunroof to a convertible. The parks in Arizona and Milwaukee lack a certain charm due to the roof structure IMO. That being said, I would probably change my tune if I had to sit there in frigid early season games, a rain out, or when the heat index is 110.

So many "that's the last straw" moments to choose from for Sox fans under Jerry's ownership - the mid/late 80s bottoming out and threat to move to Florida, JR being a ring leader for the '94 strike as the Sox were serious pennant contenders, the White Flag trade, so many "unlikeable" teams over the last 15 years, and finally totally reaching rock bottom with 121 losses. Whew - we've put up with a lot despite the 2005 glory. It's no wonder the bad guys on the North Side of town are as dominant in the Chicago market as ever. I'd say I totally tuned out the Sox around '86 to '88. But, by mid-1989, I did start getting excited again with the young core of talent they were putting together. Again I tuned them out after the '97 WF trade coming on the heels of the '94 strike. But again by mid 99 I was getting excited again by young talent like Maggs and CLee. Yeah, hindsight is 20/20, but I see no end in sight and no exciting new core coming now. IMO, I just have to wait until ownership is finally passed from Jerry to Justin Ishbia. Until then, I have little to no reason to be optimistic.

If the Ishbias intend to build a privately financed ballpark at the 78 for the team they are buying, I suppose we'll find out about it soon enough. And yes, I'd imagine the city and Related Midwest would be thrilled to have 2 privately financed stadiums built on that site. If their plan for owning the Sox is to get a new long-term lease at the current stadium, I don't expect to hear any discussion about that anytime soon since there are still 4 years to go before the current lease ends - and 4 years until Jerry's option to sell kicks in. They're not going to negotiate a new lease now in the press.

We're still here, but I believe that this is the conclusion that many, many Sox fans have come to at this point and that they've stopped paying any attention to the team altogether.

Agreed. At this point it'll all be about whether the new owners want to pay up for a new stadium. With a framework for a sale to the Ishbias in place, the current park's lease being up at the same time that Jerry's option to sell kicks in, and his expressed desire to have a new ballpark, I would imagine franchise sale price is intertwined with the whole ballpark situation going forward. I don't expect to hear about the stadium situation anytime soon....though the Fire announcement might spur the Sox into action if the Ishbias indeed want a new ballpark (I have no idea if they do or not).