Chisoxfn

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 11:19 AM) Pederson is a LH Todd Frazier at the plate, only he hits fewer homers. Today he is. He's also in his 2nd season in the majors and is extremely young. Oh and he plays a premium position and has all the defensive tools you'd want. I wouldn't peg him to be Mike Trout, but we know what his floor is based upon his current production, but ceiling still exists (the strikeouts clearly are an item that will likely significantly impact his ability to hit that ceiling). He's still on pace for a 4ish type WAR this year (which is a major upgrade from his rookie season...basically he's already at his rookie WAR). Basically put, a lot of people had such high expectations on this guy, that I think you forget he needs to develop. A contender isn't always patient, but I think getting Joc and/or Puig in a deal would get me excited if I were the White Sox. I see legit upside. In fact, I'd do a deal for Q centered around Urias, Puig, and Pederson. Not saying the Dodgers make that deal and others here might think I'm underselling the notion, but I think you get a pitcher who has upside plus two guys who are upgrades on the White Sox with upside as well.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 11:17 AM) That's a good point too. If they are going to rebuild, they have to have someone around to keep it interesting. And if you are giving up someone like Shields or even Robertson for that matter, I can at least see the upside of the Puig proposition. He is the type of example of a guy who could potentially benefit from a change of scenery. The Dodgers view him for what he's been and it is hard to change their perception and I think as a result he's very "tight" at this point. I think going elsewhere will help him. That isn't to say he instantly becomes the player he was the 1st two years, but that talent exists and even getting to 80% of that would be very valuable, imo.

QUOTE (StrykerSox @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 11:14 AM) I want one of two packages for Sale. Urias, De Leon, Puig, Verdugo and Calhoun OR Urias, Pederson, Verdugo and Calhoun I'm borderline on Calhoun. I was going to post this without including him at all. I would walk away very quickly from either of those scenarios.

Will it be our closer for Puig?

QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 09:49 AM) I've lost a lot of respect for him this past month. He sucks at trade evaluation The flaw in his logic is he bases things based upon surplus value and the surplus value for an unrpoven player is significantly overrated in his model as it doesn't not seem to account for "bust factor" probability and seems far more focused on ascribing a surplus value based more on the ceiling vs. anything else. As a result, you include one top 10 prospect and the "surplus" value damn near equates to Sale (which for all the reasons I said above, clearly should make damn near zero plausible sense).

QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 09:48 AM) From Dave Cameron's deadline chat today: Jimmy: Benintendi/Rodriguez/Devers/Swihart for Sale. Deal? Dave: That's a big overpay for Boston. C'mon Dave, big overpay? I wouldn't call it an overpay and I don't know that the Sox do that deal. They might. I think what pushes it over is Moncada in and Robertson in. That is the deal I think the White Sox do (not sure if the Red Sox do it though).

This seems like such a quiet deadline compared to past years (MLB related, not White Sox related).

QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 09:38 AM) Cotillo: Shields for Puig possible I'd be all over that one. Can't see the Dodgers doing it.

QUOTE (Tony @ Aug 1, 2016 -> 09:35 AM) The White Sox want Yasiel Puig if they make a deal with the Dodgers. Per Buster. The obvious question then becomes...why? Probably cause they figure there is change of scenario upside. I presume he's the 3rd or 4th piece in a package and not the headliner, but he's the piece they want. I presume Urias and DeLeon are in the deal as the top minor league talent and then Puig is the major league guy and then you are talking about another one or two prospects.

I will continue to say, I find it highly improbable that Sale is dealt now. The Sox would be taking much greater risk, most likely, dealing him now, because it is far less likely they can get young, proven MLB assets (such as a Betts) if you deal at the deadline. If you wait to the off-season, the package shifts a bit, but you also probably get yourself at least a guy or two who lower the potential "floor" of the deal. In a lot of the "rumored" deals I've seen, It would almost take every guy hitting their ceiling for the trade to have very much upside. For example, if a deal is centered around Urias, then the liklihood he even becomes something close to Sale is pretty unlikely, so to win out or even get fair, you need to get a few other guys who are solid contributors (and to have that, you need enough to make up for the typical bust rates, etc). It isn't like we have a guy with one year left, where you realize, you are talking about a shorter-duration in terms of value given up, but in Sale and Q's case, we have years of control, so the benefit of these young players "and the additional years" of control is minimized a bit as well.

QUOTE (Two-Gun Pete @ Jul 30, 2016 -> 08:51 PM) Off the top of my head, that actually may not be enough, when you add up the current & surplus value. At the same time, Boston might not need a ~2 WAR SP for the rest of this season to compete. I've been picky on what it would take, but that type of offer from Boston gets it done no problem. By the way, welcome aboard!!!

All of you f***ing stop. This is ridiculous.

QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Jul 29, 2016 -> 12:43 PM) They thought they were going to win based on some bad internal polling/unskewing, but they never stopped campaigning hard right to the end. He never really had a chance. I disagree, I think they took their foot off the gas at the time they needed to step on it. But only in another dimension and who really knows, anyway.

QUOTE (bmags @ Jul 29, 2016 -> 11:34 AM) Mitt Romney ran a Tea Party campaign when it turned out he probably could have ran as the centre-right governor he was and done a lot better. But he still probably would have lost. Yeah...I don't think Mitt ran a teaparty campaign.

QUOTE (Ezio Auditore @ Jul 29, 2016 -> 11:24 AM) Romney's campaign wasn't that bad. I'd say he was solid-starter level. It's just that Obama is better at campaigning than just about anybody in politics right now. Romeny's problem was he relied on bad information and pulled up before the thing was over. I legitimately think he could have won the election four years ago (than again, I like Mitt).

QUOTE (Ezio Auditore @ Jul 29, 2016 -> 11:06 AM) I am late to this argument but I feel like basically everyone on the right completely and maybe deliberately missed the point of Michelle Obama bringing up slavery. That wasn't a pessimistic statement at all, it was the polar opposite. She said "this house was built by slaves and now I, a descendant of African slaves, live in this house with my two black daughters, look at how far America has come in two centuries." That's a statement that has real, tangible emotional impact on black viewers, and it was bewildering to see people questioning or criticizing it afterwards (this should be common knowledge!). I got the same thing out of it (and I am on the right).

QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Jul 29, 2016 -> 08:04 AM) No update since then, shack must still be cutting his lawn LOL.

QUOTE (dmbjeff @ Jul 29, 2016 -> 12:11 PM) I'm fine packaging if it means Moncada and Benitendi together. If I am Hahn, I am not trading Sale without getting those two plus some. Case closed and if it was the off-season I'd want one of Betts / Bradley plus one of Moncada / Benitendi and their best pitching prospect. Now some of you may say I am delusional, but that is what it would take if I were the GM.

QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Jul 29, 2016 -> 11:23 AM) So Cameron says a Benintendi/Devers/1 lower level guy (or Moncada/Kopech instead for the first two), Urias/Verdugo (or Bellinger instead of Verdugo)/2 lower level guys or Gallo/Brinson/Ortiz/1 lower level guy should be enough for the Sox to want to move Sale. If Sale was traded for any of those packages, would anyone here be happy with those trades? I think they are all crap.

QUOTE (WhiteSoxLifer @ Jul 29, 2016 -> 11:19 AM) David Robertson, if traded, could get a decent haul on his own. If packaged with Sale or Q, Sox could become a top 10 farm system overnight. https://twitter.com/RobHart1980/status/759086422188064769 I largely prefer not packaging, especially in the case of Sale. I think we actually lose out in a "package" deal. On the flip side, I'd be open to it with Q and Robertson for example.

I suspect it will be the Nats or Red Sox that get Robertson.

QUOTE (Tony @ Jul 28, 2016 -> 03:51 PM) <!--quoteo(post=3407700:date=Jul 28, 2016 -> 04:44 PM:name=Chisoxfn)-->QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Jul 28, 2016 -> 04:44 PM) <!--quotec-->I actually like Newt a lot (his policies, etc). This is why I posted that. Yeah...I really don't have a problem with what he said. I get your point, but he technically was speaking facts himself. When he gets into the theory bit vs. feelings, well, hey, feelings do matter. Like I said, I would vote for Newt because in general, I feel he aligns with my policy views. I'm a Newt lover though (legitimately, I think he is one of the greatest politicians of the past 30 years). Key word being I. I don't think that clip was necessarily his finest moment as a whole, though, but again, we live in a society where the cool thing to do is take a 1 minute frame of a guy who has been in politics forever and hold it against him. PS: I think a lot of people should realize that Greg isn't that much different than a lot of the American voting public.

QUOTE (Tony @ Jul 28, 2016 -> 01:57 PM) I actually like Newt a lot (his policies, etc).

I am so happy that he is just sick (don't want him sick) but in the grand scheme way better then where I went when I see carted off.

All of this is postering. Dom tells Gammons who he can't offer to try and make it appear when he offers a couple of those guys he is making a really "strong" offer. Everything and anything done is postering this time of year.