fathom

QUOTE(CWSGuy406 @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 06:12 PM) Hey, Mr. "Carlos Pena will be our starting 1B-man next season" -- I don't want to see any predictions out of you. That was a psychic vision, not an actual prediction. I did have to laugh when he hit the walkoff against us last year though.

QUOTE(CWSGuy406 @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 06:10 PM) Oh yeah -- what does this mean for the Sox bullpen? It could be one of... a.) Haeger doesn't have a lock on that sixth bullpen spot like everybody thinks. b.) The Sox will give their "David Riske" roll to someone within the organization, such as Oneli Perez or Aardsma. Meaning the Sox won't be going after Speier. c.) The Sox go to to a seven man bullpen even though they haven't done this the past two years (I hate this option). I thought the goal this offseason was for the Sox to make their relief core dominant. At this time, I don't see the possibility for drastic upgrades from last year.

QUOTE(aboz56 @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 06:09 PM) What I find troubling is that we give up on a young guy after one bad season. You might as well copy this statement....you'll be saying it again shortly.

QUOTE(CWSGuy406 @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 06:08 PM) It's going to be tough for Cotts to duplicate his 2005 success without a second pitch. Even in his dominance during 2005, that was all with his "sneaky" fastball. He located well and got hitters to chase sometimes, but as I said, it'll be tough for him to dominate with a 91 MPH fastball, funky delivery or not. A high fastball pitcher allowing only one homer all season is one of the biggest fluke statistics I've ever seen in baseball. A name I haven't heard mentioned as a possible lefty reliever is Ron Villone, who I read earlier was a FA.

QUOTE(aboz56 @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 06:05 PM) Agree, it's way too early in the off-season for a move like this. Bottom line is they sold low on Cotts for some reason, possibly he wanted to be a starter or possibly something else that no one knows about. I don't buy this starter idea at all. Simply put, he fell out of favor with the Sox with the way he pitched the last half of the season last year, and KW knew he wouldn't be on the roster this season.

QUOTE(santo=dorf @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 06:01 PM) Think again. Aardsma is one of the hardest throwers in the game. In fact I remember John Dujaun on the Score saying he was the hardest thrower for the Cubs (AVG fast ball is around 96 MPH) and Jenks, Thornton, and MacDougall were in the top 10 as well. Maybe acquiring this Vasquez will stop people from spelling Javy's last name incorrectly. Hypocrite

Thank you Baltimore. We would have regretted giving him a 3 yr deal for 3 million plus. He really hit the wall last season, and I wouldn't trust Ozzie to use him right anyways.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 04:32 PM) And Baldelli isnt worth BMAC so theres where the problem is. Baldelli may be worth an average young guy like Rich Hill, but no way could you give up a solid starter like BMAC. Most MLB executives would take Rich Hill over McCarthy in a heartbeat.

QUOTE(CWSGuy406 @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 05:36 PM) Pretty much, this seems like a lateral move. The reliever we got back had good K numbers last year, and was 23 pitching in AA. But who knows -- last year was his first season pitching exclusively out of the 'pen. It's hard to call it a "brutal" trade as you did. I just feel like we sold Cotts at his lowest value, and thought we would include him in a bigger deal. I don't feel like we're a better team after making this deal.

QUOTE(Mr. Showtime @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 05:33 PM) Oh yeah, he's better than Tracey. Fathom, what do you think of the prospect we got? No clue about him. He has good K numbers, but so does everyone in the Cubs organization. He's a lefty though, so it's not a terrible acquisition. This gives the Cubs 3 lefties now in a division without a lot of lefty fire power. I wonder if they're going to use one of their other lefties in a trade.

QUOTE(daa84 @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 05:30 PM) i dont really get it either.....aardsma seems like another sean tracey to me, and i have no idea on vasquez.. I'll say this: Aardsma is better than Tracey. Aardsma's problem is that he overthrows. I'm just disappointed because I thought Cotts would have brought in better value than he did.

QUOTE(Mr. Showtime @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 05:28 PM) Hell no, we went through that BS last year. Hopefully Kenny has something else up his sleeve, history shows he does. Lets wait and see. Logan is very likely a better option than any of the other lefty relief crap that is on the market. Of course, Fabio Castro would be a nice option to have....but we screwed that up badly.

QUOTE(watchtower41 @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 05:22 PM) What has Cotts done to merit more in a trade?? Win a ring?? I am shocked that anybody is even interested in him, he was throwing BP all of last year. I dont think he held a lead once this entire season. ONCE. He's still a relatively young, cheap lefty reliever who is a year away from one of the best relief seasons in the league. Maybe with a better pitching coach, he'll develop something more than a 91 mph fastball and nothing else.

QUOTE(southsideirish71 @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 05:12 PM) Aardsma has a good live arm, but I dont know if I would of sent Cotts off for that. I guess the name of the game this offseason is "sell low". I'm shocked that we couldn't get more for Cotts. I've seen Aardsma pitch a lot, and he throws about 95 mph with absolutely no movement or secondary pitch. BTW, good luck to Cotts surviving those day games.

For David Aardsma....what an absolutely brutal trade by KW. I'm worried about this offseason, I really am.

Or maybe Don Cooper can earn his salary this year and teach our lefty relievers an offspeed pitch?

QUOTE(ptatc @ Nov 16, 2006 -> 03:45 AM) Possibly. I still don't trust guys who K that much in the minors to translate that succees to the majors. It's possible but I still agree with the trade that added starting pitching and the flexibility to trade one of those this year. Well, then we might as well get rid of Fields ASAP.

Big Frank about to sign with Toronto, according to ESPN.

QUOTE(ptatc @ Nov 15, 2006 -> 10:43 PM) If you are the GM you have to do what you think is the best for the team. You can't consider "what could look like the worst rade in franchise history" If you follow theat theory of only looking and worrying about how things are perceived in the past you will never be successful at anything. This doesn't mean it's not the worst trade, it just means who can't worry about it. If KW did that he would never make another move after trading for Todd Ritchie!!! Or it means that if you trade one of your best hitting prospects in decades (Young) due to having faith in another player (Anderson), you better not give up on him after one year just because your manager is an arrogant idiot.

QUOTE(Whitewashed in @ Nov 15, 2006 -> 09:34 PM) Isn't that a crappy package for the sox considering Crede's ability and Broadway? I sure as hell would expect more/ different guys for the guys were giving up. That would be an absolutely horrendous trade. If KW did that trade, he should be fired instantly. I wouldn't even trade Broadway straight up for Chone.

QUOTE(ptatc @ Nov 15, 2006 -> 07:29 PM) The Ichiro bid really backfired for Seattle. HUGE difference between Japanese hitter and pitcher though. Japanese pitchers are notorious for the incredible amount of pitches they throw early in their career, and many of them lose their velocity sooner rather than later (compared to pitchers from USA/Dominican, etc.).

QUOTE(Gene Honda Civic @ Nov 15, 2006 -> 07:07 PM) No doubt in my mind. Milledge is getting traded this off-season. And I think it will be to the White Sox. The question I have is if he can be our starting CF or LF next year?

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Nov 15, 2006 -> 03:42 PM) I fully agree. If we are going to make a move in CF, it better be a big upgrade. Anderson sucked last year, everyone knows that. However, I have a hard time believing he isn't going to improve next season(we did see flashes in the 2nd half, and realistically, it's hard to get any worse than last year) and if the #8 hitter, along with the lead-off hitter step up next year, Anderson wont be too big of an issue, at least for me. Trading Anderson, or looking for an every day CF for 2007 should not be that high on Williams list this off-season, and I dont think it is. I agree with everything you said here...except that finding a CF isn't high on his list. At this point, I'll be stunned if Anderson is our starting CF going into next season. I still think we should be looking at trying to pull off a major trade with Tampa for Crawford or for Rocco, especially with the crazy salaries so far.

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Nov 15, 2006 -> 03:33 PM) And if we were to trade Garcia for a nice package, the Vaz deal looks like a pretty good one. Anderson isn't going to get moved. It doesn't make any sense to begin with, let alone with Williams. Kenny isn't dumb enough to trade Anderson when his trade value is at an all time low. But aren't we going to have to spend a lot of money to find a new CF now? I don't blame KW for wanting to trade Anderson, as he just sucked last year. However, it would be better off if he's included in a blockbuster trade instead of just for one average to mediocre prospect.

If we turn around and trade Anderson for an average prospect, that makes the Vazquez for Young trade turn from horrible to one of the worst in the franchise's history.