Kalapse

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Mar 13, 2009 -> 05:01 PM) I think Ozzie cares more what BA does against a quality pitcher in Chris Young than everyone who has come since then. I know if Viciedo hit a homer off David Price or Chris Young, it would be looked at much differently than one off Eckstrom. Van Benscrotum??? LOL I also think that BA needs to prove that he can actually put up a better than 650 OPS playing against tough RHPers. All of those late at-bats were hand-picked to face mostly lefties. How many are in that sample size anyway??? It can't be that many, usually he was a defensive (not offensive) replacement in games. It's spring f***ing training. Balta is right about the quality of pitcher, you tried to argue about clutch situations which don't exist in exhibition games. He had 27 AB in C&L situations last year and 87 in games when there was a 1 R margin and he hit .272/.314/.494/.808. What's the spring sample size looking like?

QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Mar 13, 2009 -> 04:53 PM) Do we think the Sox are showcasing McDougal for a trade or does he have what it takes to make this team out of ST and contribute? They're just throwing him out there hoping he figures it out. No one is going to trade for him. Best case scenario is he kicks ass at Charlotte for the first 3 months of the season and the Sox are able to move him for garbage at the deadline and save themselves 2 months worth of salary and his buyout. At this point you're just hoping to dump his salary at mid season, that's what it's come to.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Mar 13, 2009 -> 04:57 PM) The problem with that line of thinking is that Egbert is the 9th starter on the team right now, assuming he's ahead of Broadway. Obviously, Owens and Anderson are struggling. The manager acknowledges/ed it...and the door's open for ANYONE as far as KW and Ozzie are concerned. I would have no problem taking Beckham, although then you're penalizing Getz and Nix and eliminating any chance to get a return on them via trade if neither has the opportunity to demonstrate anything during the regular season. Our best future line-up most certainly has Beckham at the top (first or second) of the order. There's a gaping hole in the back of the bullpen, someone needs to win that spot and if we're going off who's earned it with their spring performance it's Jack Egbert. No one is going to trade for Jayson (DFA) Nix and Chris Getz is the future utility player of this ballclub, both have been thoroughly outplayed by Gordon Beckham this spring, the job should be his.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Mar 13, 2009 -> 04:52 PM) I do think the situations in the games....who is pitching....what's the score, etc., are part of the thinking process, yes. Anyone can swing hard and hit the ball occasionally (see Uribe, Juan), but what does he do when they really need him and the score's tight? It's spring f***ing training. There are no "clutch" moments, the games are all exhibitions and populated by single A crap by the late innings. Balta has a decent argument about the quality of pitcher he's facing but give me a break, when the "score's tight"? Brian hit .296 in Close and Late situations last year, you know, during real games and put up a mid .700 OPS in tie ballgames. His OPS got progressively better as the score got tighter last season. What he does in clutch spring opportunities is irrelevant.

QUOTE (JorgeFabregas @ Mar 13, 2009 -> 04:47 PM) He was ok last year on the bench. .700 OPS--not too bad for a defensive CF. He was the same player as Dewayne Wise last season only right handed, younger, infinitely better defensively and slower. Nothing has changed between now and then.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Mar 13, 2009 -> 04:44 PM) At least to start the season, yes, if the season started right now I'd take Wise and Lillibridge and start it as a platoon. They are simply playing better than the other options. Fields singles to start the inning. 3/4 for Joshua today. Anderson up again. Someone slap him and tell him to wake up. So are you taking the players who are playing the best right now (apparently 7 singles, a 1/10 BB/K and no playing time in CF is good) or the players who make the team the best it can be? So if the season started today you'd honestly be comfortable giving Lillibridge significant playing time in CF? Seriously? Then you're going with the players who "deserve" to make the team based on their spring performance because there's nothing about Brent Lillibridge that leads me to believe he'll contribute to the major league club this year. If Brent Lillibridge is on your team then I hope Jack Egbert and Gordon Beckham are as well.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Mar 13, 2009 -> 04:39 PM) If Brian Anderson can not get his swing together, he will not fit the "best talent to help the team win" criteria. He will help this team more if he goes down to AAA and gets his swing together. So who are the 2 major league centerfielders on the roster? Wise and who? Can't be Owens, even if Brian's swing is pure s*** he still brings more to the table than Owens. Lillibridge? The infielder who's proven nothing above A ball and hasn't played CF in regular season game in 4 years?

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Mar 13, 2009 -> 04:35 PM) If he can't get his swing in gear then he doesn't deserve to be there. And I say that as one of his fans the last few years. Then the question becomes; do you construct your rosters with the best combination of talent to help your team win or with the players who "deserve" to play based on their spring performance?

QUOTE (SoxAce @ Mar 13, 2009 -> 04:32 PM) I'm telling you it's his job to lose... and so far.. rightfully so. That's if you believe in Spring Training competitions.

Lillibridge hasn't even played CF since college and even then he split time between that and SS. How can someone be considered a plus defender at a tough position that he a.) hasn't played in 4 years and b.) never played full time?

Lillibridge is also leading the team in Ks with 10. That's a 1/10 BB/K.

QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Mar 13, 2009 -> 04:01 PM) Can Gavin actually hit? Or was this anomolous? He's 2 for 45 when it actually matters.

QUOTE (scenario @ Mar 13, 2009 -> 12:30 AM) Wise starting the year in CF and leading off does not mean he will stay in the lineup if he plays poorly. It only means that the Sox would bring Wise north with the team and cut Owens loose. And then if Wise doesn't do the job early in the year, the Sox will elevate someone else to leadoff. Eh. Why put someone in a role in which they're bound to fail? That guy who's second in line for the leadoff spot, likely Getz or Beckham, well he's more qualified for the job RIGHT NOW. That's why it's silly. Sure you can always take the job away from him in May when he's getting on base at a .280 clip but why potentially sacrifice games when you don't have to? If Anderson were 4 years older, a little faster and 7 for 17 on the Spring would we really be talking about him as a potential leadoff hitter? Wise and Anderson are VERY similar hitters.

QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Mar 12, 2009 -> 11:59 PM) And, of course, the Bill James disciple pops up when it comes to over-analyzing or straight up inventing meaningless stats. Maybe somebody outta get word to KW to sell high on CQ because some stat dork suggests his HR total from a year ago scream fluke because when he hit them they all didn't literally leave the ballpark. lol. Pathetic. And what they make doesn't mean squat. That's like me saying Peter Vecsey is a legitimate NBA columnist/analyst because he's made a fortune over the years when he pretty much does nothing outside inventing/fabricating trades that never come close to happening. I'm not saying all these 'stats' are totally useless. But "just enough" HR is 40-year old virgin territory. Wow, aren't you're flustered. You know nothing about me, don't act like you do. The real question is, where does all your hostility come from? Since we apparently know so much about each other I'm guessing it's an inferiority complex. I don't know what some guy at NSBB posted, I don't read that site. Can't say that I agree with a "just enough" theory either but I'd also never just dismiss something like it off hand. Can't say that I'm not a wee bit concerned by the amount of HR Quentin just got over the wall last year and how his possible loss of power from his wrist injury could cost him some this year. I don't really think that has anything to with stats, that's as close to a case of "eyeballing" as you're going to find. Is there even any statistical analysis involved? Anyone who goes back and watches all of his homeruns from last year could see that probably the majority of them just cleared the fence and make a rash judgment. Hell this sounds closer to something Steve Stone would say than Satan James. You like to rip and degrade people who spend significant time analyzing the numbers of the game, calling them nerdy and insinuating that they don't get enough pussy, probably because they're too busy tapping away at a calculator in their parent's basement. These same people make lots and lots of money doing what they do, a lot of them graduate from Ivy League Universities and get hired by Professional Baseball Organizations as consultants. If you don't think that most every front office has a few of these people influencing their moves then you're mistaken. Obviously someone thinks it's all worth a damn even if they are no talent hacks like Peter Vecsey (a man who works in the entertainment business, I'm not sure his inane blabber directly influences the multi-million dollar deals of a muli-billion dollar industry). Personally I like this side of the game, if someone has a theory on why something is, I love to hear it. In school I was never very good at math so I appreciate these people doing the work for me and I gotta say, after a few years of reading up on a lot of that nerdy crap I think I've actually learned a few things about mathematics and statistics, it's a nice side effect. The funny thing is; I don't know half as much about sabermetrics or advanced statistical analysis as you think I do. I just happen to know a little more than most people on here. I'm a f***ing novice.

QUOTE (ScottyDo @ Mar 12, 2009 -> 09:06 PM) Why? What does he bring that Wise doesn't? Wise runs better, and as far as I know that's the only thing Owens could potentially do right (although doubts have been cast on that, too) I'd say Owens would also get on base more frequently and aside from Wise's 9 for 9 in SB last season the two of them have had similar success on the basepaths during their careers with Owens being a much higher volume stealer.

Of course he is. 17 AB is more than enough to prove Wise has put his 12 year minor league career in the past and is now a good baseball player. So he puts up a sub .300 OBP in the leadoff spot, so what? He might steal some bases and hit 12 HR while costing the team maybe 12 runs in centerfield.

QUOTE (Chet Lemon @ Mar 12, 2009 -> 08:02 PM) I have never cared for Wise, but hasn't he been getting the job done this spring? I haven't had much time to watch, but at this point, I would give the CF and leadoff job to Wise (until a better fit takes the job from him) and give Beckham the 2B job (again, until someone else takes it from him). A 12 year veteran career minor leaguer doesn't magically become good thanks to 17 March at bats. He's never shown the ability to be a competent major league regular let alone a leadoff hitter, 4 games worth of meaningless AB shouldn't earn him a job. He's a good baserunner with plus speed, a career .309 minor league OBP, below average defensive ability and a horrible BB/K ratio everywhere he's been, sounds like a bench player to me.

QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Mar 12, 2009 -> 03:51 PM) What the hell is a "just enough" HR or a "lucky" HR? They've got stat categories for this now? I swear some of these turbo nerds need to go outside and get some punani or something. Or get paid 6 figures to analyze numbers.

QUOTE (MexSoxFan#1 @ Mar 12, 2009 -> 02:15 PM) I was wondering if Nick Punto,Frank Cotolonatto and hitting coach Mike Piazza,who were born in the USA can represent Italy because of their Italian heritage,why isn't Carlos Quentin,Matt Garza,Andre Ethier,Evan Longoria,Eric Chavez,Joel Zumaya etc., not representing Mexico since they have Mexican heritage?That would be a pretty strong team IMO...the WBC has been interesting. Well for one, the bolded were all injured last year with 3/4 of them being KEY members of their ballclubs. Their team's aren't going to give them to go ahead to play strenuous baseball in early March. Oh and Quentin was on the preliminary USA roster before withdrawing his name.

QUOTE (fathom @ Mar 12, 2009 -> 05:00 PM) I've realized that I'm a bigger fan of DWise than a lot of people on here. There's nothing there to like. He's a good baserunner and pretty fast but that's all he's got going for him. I'd rather not have a below average defender with a .309 career minor league OBP anywhere in my lineup regardless of his baserunning prowess. He's never shown any sort of consistency against RHP in his career, there's no reason for me to believe he's going to start hitting them now.

QUOTE (jphat007 @ Mar 12, 2009 -> 04:56 PM) Has Wise had any patience in any of his stops before playing with us last year? No. He's always had an awful BB/K ratio and a below average Pit/Pa. This is why I hate Spring Training competitions. Wise getting hot for a few weeks in March doesn't make him a better baseball player, he has a pretty long track record of sucking. He's not just going to change his ways at age 31. Wise saw almost 1000 pitches between '02 and '04 and posted a well below average pit/pa.

QUOTE (jphat007 @ Mar 12, 2009 -> 04:48 PM) what other options are there? (assuming Owens has sucked his way out of the spot). Beckham at 2b leading off? (I dont think they are going to bring Beckham until later so they don't start his arb clock) Getz at 2b leading off? One of those with Wise/BA platooning in CF batting 9? I'm thinking that Wise leading off in CF with Getz batting 9th. I just dont think they want Getz leading off, nor Beckham for multiple reasons, one of which listed above. As for the bolded: The Sox don't play that game. If he's ready to go by Opening Day he's gong to make the team, they're not going to send him down for 2 weeks just to postpone his arb clock, that's a loser's mentality and not something KW believes in. The part in red, yes. The last part is probably what they'd go with if the season started today which is a damn shame since DeWayne Wise is one of the last guys I'd want at the top of my lineup and not at all what Kenny Williams described today.

QUOTE (RockRaines @ Mar 12, 2009 -> 04:41 PM) Ozzie and Kenny came out today and said that speed doesnt matter to them for a leadoff hitter. I made that post before I read that article (which I posted in the Owens thread). I still think if Wise continues to hit .350+ in the spring he's going to be the leadoff man on Opening Day.

Kenny Williams is no dummy. http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseb...0,2560763.story

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Mar 12, 2009 -> 03:03 PM) I'm pretty sure that Owens patented teh 4-3 putout. He does it way more often than Jim Thome does. I took a look at the numbers. Owens goes has gone 4-3 in a little less than 1/3 of his total major league PA. Last year Thome went 4-3 less than 1/5 of the time.