South Side Fireworks Man

QUOTE(fathom @ Jun 13, 2007 -> 10:58 PM) The Yanks would never give up Cano in a deal, as his replacement wouldn't match him in terms of production or age (contract). People are really overestimating how much we could get for players. I agree with you. I hope we're proven wrong, however.

I doubt if the Yankees would do it, but if the Sox can get Cano and Cabrera along with a top pitching prospect for Buehrle and Iguchi I would do it in a second even though I wish the Sox would re-sign Buehrle.

QUOTE(Kalapse @ Jun 13, 2007 -> 09:24 PM) Can you name me a single ace pitcher (he's going to be making ~$100M that's Ace money) as downright crazy and classless as Carlos Zambrano? You're right about that part, but I'd still be willing to take a chance on him because of his talent and his age. I think he's going to mature, especially if he can get away from the Cubs. Maybe being around a guy like Buehrle can help and I think Ozzie will have more success handling his fellow countryman. Ironic as it may seem, I also think working with A.J. would benefit him. It sure would be interesting, anyway. Again, my interest in signing him is predecated on him pitching well for the rest of the season proving he does not have a physical problem with his arm.

QUOTE(Kalapse @ Jun 13, 2007 -> 09:09 PM) Yes Zambrano has proven his durability with the 6-7 MPH drop in velocity he's experiencing this season. It seems that a lot of pitcher's velocities have dropped this season, with Verlander being an exception rather than the rule. Maybe it's the lack of amphetamines/steroids. He pitched well the other night and is usually a slow starter. We'll see how he finishes up the year. Of course if he doesn't pitch well for the rest of the season and looks as if he has some type of physical issue you're not going to give him big money. Zambrano has always been something of a head case, but I think getting him out of that organization and into a better environment will do wonders for him. He has just turned 26. Edit: And anyone who beats the s*** out of Michael Barrett can't be all bad.

I would make two big FA signings for 2008: Mark Buehrle and Carlos Zambrano. Although this would go against the White Sox' long standing policy for pitchers, they are both still young and so far have proven to be durable workhorses, and you build championships around starting pitching. This would allow the Sox to trade Contreras and have a starting rotation of Buehrle, Zambrano, Garland, Danks, and Vazquez. Looks good to me. On the offensive side build the lineup around Thome DH fourth and Konerko 1B fifth. Keep Fields at 3B and A.J. at Catcher. The other five positions are what Kenny will have to fill with younger players obtained in trades or maybe mid tier FA's like Aaron Rowand. In the pen, build around Jenks and Logan. Maybe a couple of our highly touted starting pitching prospects can come up and help in the pen or be used in trades to obtain bullpen help along with position players needed. It's going to be an interesting offseason.

QUOTE(whitesoxfan101 @ Jun 11, 2007 -> 11:12 PM) Our organization is, AT BEST, in an equal position now as it was when he took over. IMO it's worse off than it was then, and that was 6 years ago. If that isn't a damning statement about his job performance, I don't know what is. Piss and moan, piss and moan. The World Series Title counts for nothing with you. Of course you know so much you could have done a much better job than Kenny. QUOTE(Soxbadger @ Jun 11, 2007 -> 11:51 PM) People on this board are AT BEST half as smart as they used to be. You spout on this board like you are a god, as if you have some sort of insight that no one else in the world has. But honestly you know nothing about the Sox, nothing about being a Sox fan, and show absolutely no loyalty towards your team. Williams won a championship. Not one of us on this board had ever seen that prior to KW being hired, and many of us may never see it again after. If KW was not our GM it is pretty likely that we do not win the 2005 World Series. And maybe it was a fluke, who even cares, the point is, WE WON THE WORLD SERIES. No one can ever take away the parade, the singing on Wacker, any of the moments that every real Sox fan got to live. So Im going to give him the benefit of the doubt, they won 90 games last year, why dont you check how many times they won 90 games in back to back seasons before KW. And Vazquez is a good pitcher, cant win games when no one is scoring runs. Id say Vaz will likely have the lowest era of any Sox pitcher this year. What a terrible player.

QUOTE(whitesoxfan101 @ Jun 11, 2007 -> 09:40 PM) -See if the bullpen can be the worst of all time. fathom posts a thoughtful positive post and you respond with that.

QUOTE(santo=dorf @ Jun 11, 2007 -> 09:27 PM) I watched the game, and it was a small joke towards your obsessiveness about our middle of the lineup. Even if I was looking exclusively at stat sheets, I would've seen he wasn't in the lineup. Speaking of stats, have you found any to support your case or are you still relying on others to do your work?

QUOTE(santo=dorf @ Jun 11, 2007 -> 09:00 PM) Thome didn't even get on base tonight! Thome didn't play tonight. Pay attention to the games, don't just bury your head in the stat sheets.

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Jun 11, 2007 -> 08:50 PM) I didn't watch the whole game, but I didn't see Vaz get "lit up" any time during this game.... Vazquez pitched pretty well tonight but once again the Sox offense, particularly the guys who were expected to carry the team, did absolutely nothing.

QUOTE(whitesoxfan101 @ Jun 10, 2007 -> 03:35 PM) I love ignorant meathead fans. I bet you wish the Bears woulda started Kyle Orton too. I love whiners who resort to personal attacks when they disagree with someone. For the record, I never wanted Kyle Orton to start, so you lose your bet. But that has nothing to do with White Sox baseball, which I thought this forum was about. All I asked was how many Go-ahead RBI's Thome had. I don't know the answer so I thought one of the stat heads here could inform me. What a mistake I made asking a question about White Sox baseball here, I guess. And although you're response seems irrelevant and really doesn't deserve a response by me, if you've inferred somehow that I don't want Thome in the Sox' starting lineup you're sadly mistaken. In fact I hope he starts some of the games in NL parks. I always said he's a good hitter but I just don't think he has come through in the clutch as much as he is expected to. And I didn't single him out either. In my post I mentioned the middle of the Sox order has not produced and I named the middle of the order: Konerko, Dye and Thome. These three are being paid to carry the offense and right now it's nearly the worst offense in baseball. Right away some here overreacted that I mentioned Thome. I guess he's been driving in a lot of clutch runs late in close games that somehow I'm not remembering. But there is no disputing that the offense has been the major reason the Sox are off to a poor start. Now go whine and call names all you want.

QUOTE(caulfield12 @ Jun 10, 2007 -> 01:53 PM) That sums up Andy Gonzalez...warning track power, not much speed. Well, in his first two AB's today he hit the ball solidly twice, got one hit and scored a run. That's better than most of the Sox veterans lately.

QUOTE(Dick Allen @ Jun 10, 2007 -> 01:38 PM) I'd rather have him put the ball in play. The SS might bobble it, or throw it away. Either way, Fields and Dye both failed with a runner in scoring position. The only difference is Fields is here from AAA because of an injury, and Dye is supposed to be one of our main cogs in the offense. Iguchi is getting slower.

QUOTE(rafacosta @ Jun 10, 2007 -> 01:34 PM) He K'd...is this not worse than GO? The GO to the shortstop isn't any better and can actually be worse than a K with a guy on 2B.

Toby Hall fitting right in, LOL!

QUOTE(fathom @ Jun 10, 2007 -> 01:33 PM) Pretty impressive speed by Terrero. I'm all for giving him the chance to start the rest of this year. I agree.

Oh, for a wild pitch right here!

Terrero and Carlos Lee coming through big for our Sox!!!

Well, at least Fields didn't do any worse than Dye.

Here comes our prospect Fields. C'mon Josh, show 'em how it's done.

Paulie comes through with a double! Time for Dye to step up. Dye fails.....yet again.

QUOTE(caulfield12 @ Jun 10, 2007 -> 01:22 PM) This is already a long season...I guess it can't get much worse. I suffered through the 1970 season. Believe me, it can get worse! Buehrle with a no-no after two innings. Six up, six down.

Nice job, Andy. Thome needs to give us a lift right here. Softly hit. We need our Captain to pick it up right now. Picked off. Typical 2007 Sox inning.

Can someone look up and post how many game winning hits or RBI's to take the lead Thome has? Maybe that would convince me that I'm wrong if he's near the top in those categories. In 2005, Carl Everett led the league most of the year in driving in runs to take the lead. That's why he was nicknamed "The Chauffer" by DJ. That's what I mean by "clutch", not OBP or OPS.

QUOTE(vandy125 @ Jun 10, 2007 -> 12:50 PM) Can't anyone just admit that they are wrong? Goodness. I cannot even fathom to understand how you would say that Thome has been bad. If you are looking for times when someone fails, you are going to find it. Especially in hitting a baseball. Stop looking at one or two situations that he may have failed and look at his whole body of work. Where did I say Thome has been "bad"? I said he, along with Konerko and Dye haven't carried this team like they are supposed to. When was the last time Thome got a clutch hit late in the game before yesterday? People on this board constantly whine and b**** when Uribe fouls off a cookie, or Cintron strikes out with men on base, but if the guys who are expected to carry the bulk of the offense would come through no one would notice the eighth or ninth place hitters coming up short. This forum is full of whiners, quitters and eternal pessimists that almost never say anything positive or optimistic. I'm not among them. But when I point out that the middle of the offense has been the major problem, and Thome, although his numbers are good hasn't stepped up and carried this team, people take major offense. I guess the general consensus the is the whole team sucks except Thome, who can do no wrong. In summary, here's my point: I just want to see Thome come through like he did yesterday more often. If he does, the Sox will start winning some games again.