chitownsportsfan

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Dec 7, 2016 -> 07:01 PM) I don't think we have to suck cause draft picks in baseball are still a major crap shoot, but I do agree we had to make the moves we are doing to infuse the talent and give us a huge head start in pushing the restart button. Plus, while the Cubs had more money to spend, we have Q/Sale/Eaton/Jones/Robertson/Frazier/Melky to leverage to off-set some of the impacts of the Cubs spending more in FA / internationally. The #1 and #2 picks are almost always solid regulars at worst and on average are stars. Sox don't just need to be mediocre, they need to SUCK. Getting one of the top two picks the next two years is critical. Sign Albers and Latos asap.

Not sure why Harper isn't happy he'll be gone from Washington when he's a FA it seems, this helps their team now.

QUOTE (kitekrazy @ Dec 7, 2016 -> 06:55 PM) I guess this means we get to see more Avi Garcia. who cares, it's a rebuilding year and you need 25 men on the roster. Worst case he sucks and he gets DFA in July. Best case he actually turns into a 2-3 WAR starter and he's part of the rebuild. He never should have been trotted out their last year when they were trying to contend, now it doesn't matter and in fact because he's still got a non zero chance of not being a pumpkin they should trot him out there. If he helps them lose, who cares. If he helps them win, great. Either way it's fine.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Dec 7, 2016 -> 06:51 PM) No, it isn't. We still haven't fixed the main problem in this franchise. You just compared this offseason to the previous half decade of half measures. We'll have to agree to disagree on this one. This isn't anything like what they have been doing. This isn't bringing back Paulie for one more rodeo or trading for the corpse of Griffey or Youkilus.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Dec 7, 2016 -> 06:48 PM) We needed position players. We needed to target those types of players. Some pitching is fine. Almost all pitching is terrible. That is our problem now. How is that fixing anything? I mean apparently the plan is to keep doing the exact same thing we have been doing, but it is great because it will be new players doing it? Blah. I hate this so much. Uh, this is a 180 from that.

QUOTE (TaylorStSox @ Dec 7, 2016 -> 06:48 PM) I watched around 10 entire games last year because I couldn't stand to watch a franchise with no balls and no direction. I promise to attend 15 games this year to support a franchise that's not scared to take some risks to compete for the long haul. For sure, I'll be going to the games in Seattle this year after skipping out for the first time last year. The games are usually in July and August, would love to see Kopech and Yoan when they come!

QUOTE (South Sider @ Dec 7, 2016 -> 06:45 PM) Oh, you know what.. you're right. You just convinced me. Actually, you should keep responding to every Sox fan who loves this deal. You'll change all of our minds eventually. At best they got two superstars, 6+ WAR players, in Basabe and Moncada. Basabe will probably never pan out but his upside in a best case scenario is massive.

It's funny when armchair GM commentators on Fangraphs talk about players just using last season's fWAR. So many use fWAR to project, which you should never do. Eaton is not a 6 WAR true talent player. If he was, he'd be a superstar. As is he's a good player but most of his value is in RF and he's now moving back to CF. I"ll be surprised if he puts up much more than 3 fWAR this season, not without a big jump in his slash line anyways.

QUOTE (kwolf68 @ Dec 7, 2016 -> 06:36 PM) I believe he's still alive. Dude, you don't need to argue with me about things. I love the direction. Moncada is a beast. I am 100% fine with both trades, even though I am not over the moon about players 3 and 4 we got for Sale. But 1 and 2 could be ridiculously good. someone else mentioned the sox haven't gotten any position players. I just found it odd that two posts so close together forget to mention Yoan!

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 7, 2016 -> 06:34 PM) If you're scared about dropping to 15,000 tickets a game from 20,000 tickets a game and your ballpark holds 38,000 - you are not thinking this through. If you're scared about your tv ratings dropping and your TV ratings are 30th/30 teams, you are not thinking correctly. Yea it's at the point where things can't really go lower, and if they do, it doesn't really even matter to the bottom line.

QUOTE (kwolf68 @ Dec 7, 2016 -> 06:31 PM) I get that and lets be clear prospects are just that...prospects. Even if they were position players. What Hahn did was get max value for Eaton and got at least equal value for Sale. True, no position prospects are really involved, but the bounty they got for Eaton was simply too good to pass up. I suspect the Sox are going to add some position players to the pipeline as well. The games are not over. Shoot, this is the most excited Ive been about the Sox in a long time and hell I loved Sale and Eaton, but we gotta rebuild this ship. I figure about the time the Blackhawks are a bottom feeder the White Sox will be back rolling. With the Bears who the hell knows about them. Is Yoan Moncada, the #1 overall prospect in baseball, who plays 2B, dead? Last time I checked he's now a White Sox.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Dec 7, 2016 -> 06:24 PM) If this fails to the point where you are trading Rodon, you might as well contract this franchise. I already hate this. There is literally no reason to watch this team for years. Dude I'm as excited as I've been in years. To me it feels like the early 90s again. Sox are loading up on young talent and if they can get a few studs out of like they did then it will set them up for a great run in the next decade. I get that you're disappointing to see favorites go but ripping the bandaid off has long been overdue on this roster.

QUOTE (CWSpalehoseCWS @ Dec 7, 2016 -> 06:21 PM) Gotta say, this trade is impressive. Feels like an overpay on the Nats with both Giolito and Lopez. Eaton I think played a little above his head this year, and while I'll miss him, I see why the Sox moved him. I gotta say I find it funny that Drake's two biggest supporters are now both off the team. I'm sure it played less than a 1% role, but it is ironic. He played well over his head. Eaton is a nice player. He's also injury prone and coming off what is almost certainly his career year. He's on the wrong side of 27 now and the Sox just cashed him in at the perfect time IMO.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Dec 7, 2016 -> 06:21 PM) Our direction so far is to hope that we can get to the same point that we just were. All pitching, no hitting. That is a f***ing terrible direction. Huh? If they really want they have massive chips left in Q and Rodon to trade for position players. This is what a rebuild looks like you get the most value you can, regardless of position, and sort it out later.

So if the majority of the red sox nation reaction to sale was "fair value" the majority of Nats nation on their forums seems to be "are you f***ing kidding me". Hahn is doing work.

Sox are doing well. The system just moved into the top 10, let's see if we can move it into the top 3 with a Q trade.

Eaton is not a 6 WAR true talent player. He's about 3-4, still a great player but I can pretty much guarantee last year was his career year defensively.

Wow. Selling high on Eaton. WOW

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Dec 7, 2016 -> 12:51 PM) Trading a guy who is an ace with 4 years of cost control left seems like a pretty risky proposition. I'm open to it, but Q is probably the last of all the guys I'd move. I'd move Eaton, Melky, Robertson, Jones, and Abreu first (again depending on value). I'm with you here. Better get a great haul if you're going to trade him.

Deadpool was an alright movie but after hearing a million times how great it was before I saw it it was a let down. Soft bias of low expectations for superhero movies.

Well, FWIW, Boston Internet seems to think it was a fair trade or an overpay. Lots of worries about Sale's health and pitching in Fenway. I'm starting to think it makes sense to keep Q, unless they get a similar package for him.

QUOTE (Real @ Dec 6, 2016 -> 10:20 PM) watched very little baseball last year. mainly radio and at bat app feeds Sanchez was a HUGE story. I was checked out and couldn't help but see his name everywhere. He put up some Ruthian like numbers for about 50 games, and it was for the Yankees so of course it got magnified every more.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 6, 2016 -> 11:31 PM) And I find it rather disgusting that you can't avoid making it personal the moment someone disagrees with you and takes a different opinion of available information. I made a point about baseball. You could disagree with it without going after me personally. I put DA on ignore a year ago and every time I unignore one of his posts (about once every 10 or so he posts) I regret it. Sorry to talk s*** about him but he is what he is and that's a White Sox sycophant.

QUOTE (BigHurt3515 @ Dec 6, 2016 -> 09:26 PM) Well no lol. Avi has had plenty of chances, Navarez has not I'm just saying if you're really committing to a rebuild then it makes sense to apply that same logic to guys like Avi. Same with Saladino, same with Sanchez. Yes Avi has failed but unless they have someone he's blocking (and they don't) then you just trot him out there and hope for the best. If they were contending (like last Winter's moves indicated) then it would be stupid (like it was last year with Avi) but they aren't, things change. There's no downside to letting Avi trot out there for 300 more PA if he's not blocking anybody.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 6, 2016 -> 09:21 PM) I think long term you try to develop Collins. Flowers came a long way defensively in the Sox system. Until they are trying to compete, I don't think it is imperative they find a long term guy. When they are ready to win, it should mean they can carry an offensively challenged guy back there, so you find a veteran pitch framer who calls a good game. Catchers are hard to find, hard to develop, have a bust rate, but some come out of nowhere. I would hate the Sox not get big time value somewhere else and get smoked takimg on a mediocre catcher. As you said yourself, the chances Collins pans out are very slim. Maybe 1/10 as a catcher. It would behoove them to find someone in one of these trades that is much closer to MLB level or already at MLB level. Won't be cheap, for all the reasons you listed, but if they are rebuilding getting a solid catcher should be a high priority.