Dick Allen

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 26, 2016 -> 01:21 PM) No matter what you think of the pick, this is twisted logic. Saying that the 28th pick hasn't been good rarely, so we shouldn't care about picking 28th is silly. The 2015 draft shows why the draft pool is nice. We basically got two quality draft picks in the first 10 rounds, and then had to fill it up with slot/under slot signings to fit Zangari in. Right but that was missing a 2nd and 3rd rounder. Even if they give up the pick here, they still have their normal full draft. The fact is there are overwhelming odds Fowler, 10 years from now, was a better player than the guy the team would have selected with pick #28 or what the additional draft pool would have brought. Of course it could be the other way around, but look at the bright side, their second rounder moves up a spot if they lose the comp pick.

QUOTE (scs787 @ Jan 26, 2016 -> 12:59 PM) I'm still highly intrigued by Yadiel Hernandez. He's got a career .449 OBP over in Cuba, OBP over .500 last year. That obviously won't translate over here to that extent, but as a frame of reference, Abreu had a career .456 OBP. Abreu also took a ton of intential walks which boosted that number. Looks like he might be a solid #2 and it would allow Melky to drop to balance out the lineup. Intentional walks and HBP help Abreu tremendously. He isn't a very patient hitter so the OBP doesn't really infatuate me so much without every seeing him play. There is a difference between guys being able to take pitches 2 inches off the plate and guys not swinging because the pitch was 6 inches outside.

2.3 2.2 1.4 3.2 The last 4 seasons Fowler's WAR. The 1.4 he missed a third of the season so he still is well above a 2.0 on average.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 26, 2016 -> 12:07 PM) That is exactly why I said it would take at least a decade to see a payoff. I'd say longer than that. A pitcher, fine, but a hitter? Not only do they have to figure out how to hit against competition that would be nowhere near what they would see when they signed, they would have to learn all the other nuances of the game. How many guys who played football therefore missed on some baseball time just look totally lost on a baseball diamond? I think the cost would be prohibitive as well. There is no doubt there are people in India who if baseball was what it was here over there could be stars in the major leagues, it is beyond a long shot, and something you would spent a lot of time and money trying to find out. You might as well pour that money into baseball playing countries.

QUOTE (SoCalSox @ Jan 26, 2016 -> 12:36 PM) That logic is a bit broken to me. Would you rather trade that prospect package for the 28th overall pick? Shark pitched pretty awful for them last year & they didn't reach the playoffs. At some point, we as fans have to concede that they simply "lost" that trade & move on instead of trying to make up for it. People acting like that draft slot is just some sure thing confuse me. For as many Mike Trouts, there are 3-5X as many players who simply don't work out. Drafting is a calculated risk, more-so than a FA such as Fowler, IMO. A few days ago I went back to the #28 pick from present back to 2008. Now present, you can't tell but the only player selected with the #28 pick you wouldn't trade for Fowler was Gerrit Cole, but he didn't sign. You also miss out on the expanded draft pool, but having your entire #10 pick entire draft intact still makes that OK.

QUOTE (bmags @ Jan 26, 2016 -> 12:32 PM) I don't know if it's just a pick, it's the committing to a likely-bad defensive OF with limited power. His OBP is great, but, at least with Jackson you know it's a placeholder to upgrade. With Fowler, it's committing to a pretty average OF for a long time. His power the last several seasons seems to indicate a 15 homer guy if he stays healthy. His defense isn't stellar, but it's not horrible. He gets on base, and can run. And he gets Avi off the field. It sure beats sending another top prospect or 2 away for a guy like Dickerson or Blackmon.

QUOTE (Knackattack @ Jan 26, 2016 -> 12:28 PM) So, would you be okay with trading the Shark package for 3 years of Fowler at that price? Basically that has to be the mindset behind signing a QO free agent at this point. People would have been thrilled had the Sox signed Shark to a 5 year $90 million extension last offseason. Would you rather they did that or sign Fowler for something a little higher than Span received? It's an upgrade, and the 3 years cost slightly higher than 1 year of Cespedes.

QUOTE (SoCalSox @ Jan 26, 2016 -> 12:26 PM) Fowler would make a ton of sense for this team. If he didn't have a pick attached, I feel like most fans would be pounding the table for him right now, personally. Can probably get him on a 3 year deal at $11-13M AAV. I still don't get the must some have in holding on to this pick. Considering the outrage Shark and therefore this pick wasn't traded in July, one would be led to believe it was a worthless pick. They still would have their full draft intact. You basically would be making the trade Semien et al for 1 year of Shark and 3 years of Fowler. Sure, I'd like them to keep the pick, but it isn't a killer at all.

QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Jan 26, 2016 -> 12:26 PM) You mean subpar first half, right? Yes. He was pretty horrid the first half.

QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Jan 26, 2016 -> 12:23 PM) Hayes tweeting about how Fowler would help a ton with the lineup. I think he would. He's a big on base guy. Supposedly he tweaked his swing last year during the second half and started hitting like he used to after a very subpar second half.

QUOTE (2005thxfrthmmrs @ Jan 26, 2016 -> 07:30 AM) That's why you play the games. On paper, they WERE a championship contender. Many people, including this board, thought Hoiberg was the coach they needed to solve their biggest problem, offense. Hoiberg was one of the most promising coaches in college basketball, he certainly was an ideal fit for this team. Furthermore, if Rose continued his development post injury, Nikola took the next step of being rising star in this league, and Noah could come anywhere near his DPOY form only TWO years ago, yea we would be on top of the East right now. Those "ifs" all looked pretty likely at the start of the season, and the fact that they didn't happen were out of GarPax's control. And for the record, many experts picked the Bulls to finish with the best record in the East during preseason. It's certainly easy for the butthurt fans to point blame on others when hindsight is 20/20. Skipped around the video a bit, and stopped listening after 4:47, this guy couldn't even get his facts right. Rose and Noah regaining form seemed likely? Do you own a medical marijuana card? If Hoiberg was the perfect fit for this roster, A. Why do we have posts defending the Gar/Pax hire saying the roster isn't filled with Hoiberg type players, and B. Why isn't the roster performing like an elite team? Nikola has gone backwards. Makes you really wonder if Thibs was bad for him. Perhaps he was better for him than the Mayor. Everything people critize coaches and managers for, Gar/Pax is just as guilty. They have done some good things, but if the goal is the championship, they have been far too reluctant to take chances rather than play it conservately and ride the top 3 or 4 team in the East for as long as they can. This next offseason will be huge for the Bulls. Noah and Pau probably gone, and Rose a year away. The NBA is different than baseball. The money is locked in. What you can offer is hope for a title. Not many players seemingly have felt GarPax put together a roster where they were the one player from a title run.

QUOTE (shipps @ Jan 26, 2016 -> 10:38 AM) Thats what FO seems to be banking on that from someone next year in that OF spot. But the thing that pisses me off is that when you do that 9 times out of 10 it doesnt work out for you...and those odds are probably being nice. The Sox had some success doing this in the 90s. DJ, Ellis Burks, Mike Devereaux, Danny Tartabull. Maybe they should bring back Schueler as a consultant.

It's too big of task to make non baseball players baseball players. It's not like other sports. Football, basketball, you can get a guy with a ton of talent to be decent in a few years. Baseball, no way. There aren't stories of guys who picked up baseball as 16 year olds and became big league stars.

I was going to post the same as above. If that would be the next Sox great hitter, God help us all.

QUOTE (GoSox05 @ Jan 25, 2016 -> 03:28 PM) So was Charles Woodson. They've actually done a pretty good job when they actually decide to sign free agents. It's just far and few between. I can almost name every free agent that Thompson has signed without having to look it up. They don't count Peppers as a true free agent. Of course the Packers got really good when they signed Reggie White as the type of free agent they don't like to sign anymore.

QUOTE (BigFinn @ Jan 26, 2016 -> 09:50 AM) Welcome aboard, and thanks for your post. Upgrading in the outfield is not just about improving the offense. The White Sox outfield defense was about as bad as I can remember and I go back to the days of Walt Williams, Buddy Bradford, Ken Berry, and Tommy Agee roaming the old barn in 1967. There are no "split stats" on defense. 2008 with Quentin, Griffey and Dye from left to right is about as bad as it can get.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Jan 26, 2016 -> 09:26 AM) Yeah -- all three of those players have very loud flaws. I think the Cubs know it, but honestly I think the reason a deal hasn't been done is that other teams know it, too. I think they've been trying to sell Baez as a premium prospect for years, while the rest of the league sees his value as the median of the superstar outcome and the complete failure outcome. RE: OF -- It's just going to be difficult to excuse the front office if they fail to SOMEHOW make a substantial upgrade over Avi. I think whiffing on all of those free agents was a huge mistake, because that represented several of the most effective options by far, and the prices were downright reasonable. I don't love Fowler either. Jackson is really more of a bounceback candidate than anything. The system is still weak enough that a major trade is going to have real implications on near-term depth, even if Hahn pulls another Frazier/Samardzija-style deal out of his ass. I don't know, I just don't feel great about the remaining options overall. I don't know if the prices were all that reasonable. Cespedes you would probably have to guarantee over $30 million and risk losing him for 1 season. Gordon wasn't leaving KC, and Upton, a guy I wanted, was signed by a team where money is no obstacle. If the Sox offered him 6 years $150 million, you don't really think Illich would have topped that?

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Jan 25, 2016 -> 02:16 PM) Well DA, this is an interesting quote you used of mine I saw that. I have zero idea how that happened. I wasn't trying to quote any posts.

Here's the schedule, looks like they are having photo sessions this year: http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/cws/commun...e.jsp#wristband

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Jan 25, 2016 -> 08:05 AM) Broncos defense has to go even more beastmode than they did yesterday against New England, and I dont really see how that is possible. Plus, Cam isnt a sitting duck in the pocket like Brady is, I really cant see any scenario that the Broncos win this game As a 30 year old coming off an almost 7 WAR season he settles for 3 years $75 million. If he opts out next year after being paid $27.5 million, can he get another 3 year $75 million contract as a 31 year old if he puts up a 3 WAR season? That deferral must have been huge.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jan 24, 2016 -> 04:54 PM) 1. At what point did you know that Derrick Rose wasn't going to be Derrick Rose any more? If he was still Derrick Rose, with the way Gasol is playing, Butler turning into a top 20 player, and a strong lineup around them, this would be a championship roster. 2. What can you do to rebuild when you're holding one of the worst contracts in the league, top 10 money for a player who can't get there? 3. Unfortunately we found a top 20 player late in the draft and that also made any "Rebuilding" effort extremely difficult because right there, even without Derrick Rose, the Bulls were going to have to rely on the guys they could find later in the draft. The only thing that is a legit mistake is the thing the Bulls couldn't do - Trade away Rose after that first Bulls/Heat series. If they'd done that, then youv'e got a legit rebuilding path. If you didn't do that, then you don't have cap space, you are continuing to try to put a lineup on the court that can compete around Rose if he comes back healthy, and you're consequently not getting high draft picks. If one really wants to nitpick and use hindsight, even if he had stayed healthy, Derrick Rose may not have been the best point guard in his draft class..

QUOTE (ozzfest @ Jan 24, 2016 -> 04:02 PM) So why did GarPax tell us this was a championship roster? And if they have no shot at winning...why aren't they rebuilding? This is where I agree with you. We were led to believe this was a championship caliber roster only the ogre coach was holding them back. They had to humiliate him, but still pay him $9 million to go away. Now it's wait, this isn't a championship team, we have had a lot of bad luck?

QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ Jan 22, 2016 -> 01:56 PM) Mama's Fish House. My favorite meal on our 2 week trip to the islands. My wife and went to Mama's on an evening it was pouring in Maui,we were staying in Wailea. Just as we were finishing dinner, the roof right above us sprung a leak, and got us all wet. They comped us the meal which was pretty nice.

Gar/Pax has found gems in the 20s, but I still think they should go much for the same reasons they fired Thibs, and then classlessly publicly shamed him. Many don't have a problem with Thibs being gone, they say he can't get the Bulls over the hump. Apparently Gar/Pax can't provide a roster to get over the hump. It wasn't Thibs running guys into the ground that got players hurt. The same guys, Noah, Rose, Hinrich, are still coming up injured frequently. Hoiberg has decreased Butler's playing time a whopping 30 seconds a game. And if the reason, which I don't buy, that they are struggling now is they don't have Hoiberg players, that is on Gar/Pax as well. It isn't like they just happened to hired Hoiberg. Everyone knew he was coming 20 games into last season. If it takes you 2 years to acquire 1 Hoiberg player, then you need to run a different system because it isn't going to work.

QUOTE (Saufley @ Jan 23, 2016 -> 02:04 PM) IMHO the Sox have to do something by SoxFest! I look for a busy week with at least a couple of transactions. I may be wrong and it wouldn't be the first time but. they still need to do something!! I think they will do something as well. The guys out there shouldn't take a lot of time. The more the players wait, the fewer openings, and the lower the offers at this point.