harfman77

The Patriots have been using a version of it for years. Parting ways with overpriced veterans and replacing them with multiple role players for the same amount. Finding little used guys like Wes Welker, taking former stars and making them into role players and extending their careers, trading down in the draft to acquire more picks at a higher overall value, and finding guys that can play multiple roles (Mike Vrabel as a TE, Troy Brown as a DB).

QUOTE (fathom @ Jan 19, 2016 -> 03:49 PM) And it's also why the Cubs being good is bad for the Sox franchise, as the casual Chicago fan right now is definitely going to spend their money on Cubs games/merchandise as opposed to the Sox. It's truly amazing how little Sox merchandise is available at the local mall as opposed to Cubs stuff. I will extend that to where I live four hours away from Chicago, though we are considered "in market" there is virtually no Sox gear at any of the local stores, while there is plenty of stuff for the Cubs, Cardinals, Twins, Yankess, and Royals in that order. The Sox fanbase has an identity problem in the city, I think mostly because they took a good deal to build the stadium in a bad spot when there were better options. And nationally the Sox fanbase is pretty small relative to that of other teams.

Cue re-location threads.

QUOTE (scs787 @ Jan 18, 2016 -> 07:02 PM) I mean he isn't lying. He's not saying they're title contenders or anything, just improved. I don't think anyone can say they aren't. I would really dispute if they are really improved. Losing Alexi will hurt more than most think. Not enough OBP guys at the top to make the power acquisition of Frazier worthwhile and I really am I not sure that Lawrie will be an upgrade of what I think Sanchez would have done this season. The rotation is not any better and the bullpen is worse. Catcher may be a wash, but the continuity that came from pitchers working with Flowers is gone which may be a negative as well. Given the further expected decline of LaRoche and Cabrera and I don't think that you can say that this team is improved. I think the Frazier acquisition was necessary just to get the team back up to their level of last season. I really hate the idea of giving up young assets, especially Montas seeing what closers have garnered on the trade market, for what at this point is at best an incremental upgrade.

QUOTE (bmags @ Jan 19, 2016 -> 10:28 AM) Have you heard this anywhere? I feel like a situation like that would leak, considering the teams involved and media around Boston. No, I have not. It was my speculation at the time when DD left given that Larry Lucchino was out as president in Boston three days earlier. Nothing to see here, just random internet speculation. But I could see the Red Sox making an approach knowing Lucchino was leaving and DD going to Ilitch to express his interest and then Ilitch "releasing him to pursue other opportunities". The phrasing of the statement from Ilitich always struck me as DD had other irons in the fire.

QUOTE (bmags @ Jan 19, 2016 -> 09:55 AM) One thing: I have to wonder why Dombrowski was sacked when this is still the behavior post DD. I am not sure he was "sacked". I think he was probably having talks with Boston and Ilitch's statement was "I've decided to release Dave from his contract in order to afford him the time to pursue other career opportunities." Then Boston sat on it for a month to avoid tampering charges and give the appearance of a thorough hiring process.

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Jan 19, 2016 -> 12:11 AM) JR is going to be 80 years old soon and isn't going to do a rebuild so the "three year window" , "rebuilding on the fly" , "retooling" stuff will continue as it has for the last 8 years or so. I really think KW and Hahn are in a tough spot and I wouldn't want their jobs. With the 120M budget they have to work with, there isn't much of a margin for error. Just one or two bad contracts can really hurt a budget like that. I was hoping for a rebuild last winter but then I realized JR's age and realized it will not happen. I really wonder if JR is getting close to selling the team. The team seems to pretty firm in making sure that all contracts are coming off the books at the end of 2019 which would lower the amount of debt that a new owner would need to take on. I could see JR selling the team in 2017-2018 range as he has said that he does't think his family should keep the team after hes gone. A low debt load coupled with the possibility of a lucrative TV deal in 2019 would be enough to get JR all he wants out of selling the team. I think JR would like to win, but its not his priority right now, he already has his ring.

CarGo makes sense in that he will be the least expensive option is younger than Cespedes, plays RF, and fits in the three year window that the Sox supposedly do not want to surpass. I imagine a package would be built around Anderson and Fulmer to get the deal done with some other pieces thrown in there.

Thats a lot more than I though Span would get and really hurts the Sox by driving the market higher. Span is a good player, but coming off a hip injury which may leave him as a completely different player is a huge risk. I thought he was a great candidate for a one year prove it deal with his hip.

At this point I think Upton is going to take a one year deal someplace, and if is going to take a one year deal, its not going to be with the Sox (thinking the Rangers). I can see the Sox still getting Cespedes on a deal structured like Heywards, frontloaded over the first three years with an opt out after that, and maybe a mutual/team option for a fifth year.

QUOTE (ChiSoxFanMike @ Dec 15, 2015 -> 02:07 PM) I want nothing to do with Jay Bruce. Absolutely nothing. He's not good. Season Home / Away BB% K% BB/K AVG OBP SLG OPS ISO BABIP wRC wRAA wOBA wRC+ 2015 Away 9.30% 22.90% 0.41 0.217 0.292 0.421 0.714 0.204 0.246 35 -2.8 0.303 89 2015 Away 5.80% 22.60% 0.26 0.233 0.285 0.448 0.733 0.215 0.257 39 -0.2 0.312 96 The difference between the two on the road last season (since if they are traded they won't be playing in Great America anymore. I don't see enough of a difference to justify giving up top tier prospects when the other is younger and can be had for a more reasonable package of prospects.

QUOTE (Jose Paniagua @ Dec 15, 2015 -> 12:05 PM) Bob Nightengale ‏@BNightengale 17s17 seconds ago The Cincinnati #Reds drawing extensive interest from AL Central teams who want Todd Frazier:#Indians, #Whitesox, #Royals.Also #Dodgers in NL I'd love to see Hahn drive the price up on Frazier for the Royals and Indians and then walk away with Jay Bruce.

I like Cespedes as an option for the Sox. I don't like how he will only play LF though. I remember a lot of the issues that led to his departure from Oakland was his unwillingness to play other positions. He would make sense on a front loaded deal with an opt out.

QUOTE (fathom @ Dec 14, 2015 -> 02:20 PM) to play devils advocate, if he didn't struggle in the 2nd half, we're talking about an MVP candidate and someone that would require Rodon to get. I've made mention of this before, but I think part of the reason he struggled in the 2nd half was due to the Reds fielding about 5 MLB caliber players and the rest being a minor league team. There wasn't a lot of emotion in their games. Yes, if he would have continued with the numbers he put up in May he would have been a MVP candidate. His track record shows consistent decline in the second half of the season for him with a .273/.341/.506 hitter in the first half and a .239/.298/.417 hitter in the second half over his career. He also has a significant shift away from Great America with a line of .270/.333/.507 with a .231 ISO at home against .244/.309/.426 with .182 ISO on the road. He has good qualities but is not going to be the savior of this team and therefore I don't think he is worth trading for. If the Sox were a guy away and needed to solidify 3B defensively and add a little pop this may make sense, but given the state of things, the Sox are better off diverting resources elsewhere.

QUOTE (spiderman @ Dec 6, 2015 -> 06:33 PM) Any concern that Frazier had a second half decline after his all-start first half? Definitely.

QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Dec 11, 2015 -> 02:57 PM) TV deals becoming ridiculous are the exact reason the Sox would never ever move. They drive everything. This isnt the 70s. Even if people aren't tuning in, the potential will always be there for them to do so, and there's no chance in hell MLB gives that up. The Sox are not going to get a competitive TV deal. Low attendance, lowest viewership of any team on a RSN. They are going to have to do something different to compete for a contract like those that you see other teams getting.

QUOTE (Harry Chappas @ Dec 11, 2015 -> 02:49 PM) If the Mets and Oakland cna exist, the White Sox can exist. This is a silly conversation. Oakland can't they have been desperately trying to move south from Oakland for years. The time is going to come, and I imagine it will be in 2019 when the media deals are up, that the Sox are going to have a really tough decision to make.

QUOTE (ptatc @ Dec 11, 2015 -> 02:36 PM) That was to an untapped market in florida, which turned out to be a dry well as not many fans seem to go. Where is the untapped market now? There are a few. Look at the regional TV markets that do not have pro sports teams as a start. Charlotte - Fox Sports Carolinas Indianapolis - Fox Sports Indiana Oklahoma City - Fox Sports Oklahoma Nashville - Fox Sports Southeast/Tennessee Salt Lake City - Root Sports Utah Portland - CSN Northwest Fastest growing cities in the US: 5. Salt Lake City 6. Raleigh, NC Based on that, I would think Charlotte, Indianapolis and SLC would be real opportunities for the Sox to relocate.

QUOTE (Dunt @ Dec 11, 2015 -> 01:27 PM) The MLB would never allow the White Sox to move away from Chicago. It's not happening. They were already let them going to move once, not sure why they would stop them now.

QUOTE (Chet Kincaid @ Dec 11, 2015 -> 12:57 PM) The White Sox are going to end up in Portland or Carolina in the next few years if they aren't careful. Watch. We're doomed. That may happen anyway and it has nothing to do with this. Once the Sox are up for a new TV deal it is going to be very interesting to see what happens. The Cubs deal will be up the same year I believe. The Sox are going to have to get an amount that will allow them to compete with what other teams are getting and to do so may have to look at another market that is not quite as saturated with content.

QUOTE (ChiSoxFanMike @ Dec 11, 2015 -> 11:36 AM) I'd like to unload Avi and LaRoche too but it really makes no sense to diminish Q's value by throwing them in. 3 controllable MLB starters and a AAA prospect that has is considered elite defensively is a pretty good return. Owens still has a chance to become a at least a 2 or 3 and possibly even a TOR guy if he gets it put together. I think we could probably get more from them, but it would be lower level guys like Montas was when we got him.

This is a good trade. I did like Erwin as a wildcard guy that could put some things together and become a legit prospect, but you can't fault the Sox for putting this deal together. I am very interested to see how Eaton and Lawrie co-exist. They are either going to be besties or mortal enemies. I imagine that will depend on how the team performs.

QUOTE (Knackattack @ Dec 11, 2015 -> 11:09 AM) 3 years from now, Heyward will be 29 years old.. and probably having the best season of his career He is probably a good bet to be 5-6 WAR for the first 6 years of the deal. Yes he will be 29, but players that rely on their athleticism as much as he does to be productive begin to decline much faster than others. These are the same arguments that were made when the Jays gave albatross contracts to Wells and Rios only to have to regret it almost immediately. According to stats and stuff, this would have been his peak season offensively. http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/hitters-no-...k-only-decline/ https://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/2015/01/...SYuK/story.html

QUOTE (Chilihead90 @ Dec 10, 2015 -> 09:28 PM) You can go ahead and double that price for Cespedes, and add a few years. I am not sure about that, there have been reports that his market hasn't developed as expected. There are a lot of teams that have come out and said they are not looking at him.

Sox trade Q + Garcia + LaRoche to Red Sox for Deven Marrero, Brock Holt, JBJ and Henry Owens Sox trade Tim Anderson, Micah Johnson and Erik Johnson to Mets for SP Zach Wheeler Sign Cespedes LF Eaton DH Cabrera 1B Abreu RF Cespedes 3B Holt 2B Lawrie C Navarro/Avila CF JBJ/Thompson SS Saladino/Sanchez/Marrero SP Sale SP Rodon SP Wheeler SP Owens SP Danks