Texsox

If you think there will only be minor economic damage, you really have no idea about border life. Read some of the clips I posted. Holy Week, Christmas, etc. are huge down here. Miller International Airport has a waiting list some days, especially around back to school, for private airplane hanger space. Again, when people see Mexicans, how do they know if they are legal or illegal? When a restaurant in Philly can receive international coverage for only serving English speaking patrons, that is what foreign tourist read. It's about marketing on some of this stuff. The wall is a colossal blunder on our part. It hurts our, US, American businesses. Harms the environment, and will not solve the problem it is set out to do.

Kenny wakes up with a terrible hangover, reads the newspaper and screams "Wrong Cabrera! I wanted Miguel"

QUOTE(dmbjeff @ Nov 19, 2007 -> 11:40 AM) It's too bad KW couldn't have just thrown Uribe in on the deal and we take back some over priced useless guy of their's. Sadly, that may be what the cash is for, to pay our now utility infielder.

QUOTE(dmbjeff @ Nov 19, 2007 -> 11:29 AM) I'm also very suprised so many people here are dissing the deal. I think OCab, as he will now be known around here, is a good player and a SIGNIFICANT upgrade over Uribe. Uribe moving back to his original role in 2004 of Utility INF might be best for him. I hope they can trade him somehow though and get that 4.5 million off the books, but I'm not sure how quickly you can trade guys who you just resigned. There have been deals contingent on guys signing a new contract, so I imagine there isn't a rule. But I'm just speculating.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Nov 19, 2007 -> 11:28 AM) I know it. But even in a win-win, someone is giving money to someone else, and someone if making money on that price. It may be a win-win overall, but overall, im making money. Right, but if you are always lying and cheating people, how long will you be in business? If you are dealing with soemone who has screwed over three other people in your position, how will you treat that person? What if the person has never screwed over someone and you could trust him?

QUOTE(BigEdWalsh @ Nov 19, 2007 -> 11:27 AM) Same here. A nice upgrade at SS. And if we do sign Hunter, much stronger defensively up the middle. Up the middle includes the guy who is most in the middle, the pitcher. I agree in principle, up the middle is the most important and this is an upgrade 132 games per year.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Nov 19, 2007 -> 11:25 AM) Yes you shouldnt knowingly f*** someone over, thats basic business ethics. But also everyone is out to make good for themselves over everyone else. You'll see for yourself if you ever go into the business world. Repeat business can still be achieved while winning a deal. There is a difference between winning a deal and f***ing someone over. Be in business for 25 years and you will see it for yourself. There is this animal called a win-win.

If there is more than $1,000,000. trading hands, the commissioner will have to approve. Which he will

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Nov 19, 2007 -> 11:16 AM) Its business, ethics really dont play a huge part, you are supposed to not be retarded and do your homework. It still didnt stop Jon from being a horse though, and now our pen better be extremely good, because they are going to get alot of work this year with unproven guys in the rotation. IIRC, mlb has specific rules regarding reporting a player's physical condition. Plus, as noted, it's a small world and if you screw a couple teams, other teams will stop dealing with you.

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Nov 19, 2007 -> 10:57 AM) The Tribune says the Halos are throwing in some cash. CASH!!!! Then we did win.

QUOTE(The Critic @ Nov 19, 2007 -> 10:51 AM) Blue Monday - New Order I Don't Like Mondays - Boom Town Rats

And Jenks, the other reason they shop here, is we kiss their asses with marketing campaigns. We'd rather they spend those hundreds of millions here than San Antonio or other locations. A large share of a store's advertising budget is spent in Mexico. We also need to lure them away from Mexico businesses.

QUOTE(southsider2k5 @ Nov 19, 2007 -> 10:47 AM) Keep calling people like us racist if you like, that's fine. I don't expect anything more. Just don't expect us to stand by and be happy about anarchy in our country. I am not calling anyone racists. The focus of dialog in the US has been the problems that Mexicans has inflicted on the US. There have been protests, the Minutemen have been around the border. Very little pro-Mexico support out there. And all this is necessary, we have to address the issues. But that clearly is an anti-Mexico sentiment. Much of the focus on Mexico has all been negative. I am sorry if it appears I am labeling someone a racists. I believe it is very possible to believe a wall is desirable and not be racists. Those labels make any sort of sane discussion impossible and too emotionally charged. Would it be better if I used something like all the news about Mexico has been negative in the US?

Noooooooooooooooo

QUOTE(The Critic @ Nov 19, 2007 -> 10:46 AM) Love Song - Tesla No bonus points, Kid! Song Sung Blue - Neil Diamond

QUOTE(Kid Gleason @ Nov 19, 2007 -> 10:42 AM) Love Song - The Damned ***do I get double points??? Song of the South - John Anderson - Seminole Wind

QUOTE(Jenksismyb**** @ Nov 19, 2007 -> 10:28 AM) Where else are they going to shop? Are they going to travel a thousand miles to the south? They have no other option. They shop here for a reason - they get the best price on the goods the want/need. You think they shop in the US because they like us more? If they can buy what they want in their own country, why do they make a trek across the border? Vacations. Nice trip. Cuba is also a very popular destination as is the the Caribbean and other cities in Mexico. Why do suburbanites head to State Street at Christmas? Because they have to? Because they like you more? They could go to Woodfield. If they can buy what they want in Schaumburg, why do they drive to Chicago? Although city folks shopping in suburban malls may encounter some problems

QUOTE(Alpha Dog @ Nov 19, 2007 -> 10:03 AM) "could see a similar downturn" And they also could not. They would shop in Mexico. They would stay there." If the goods they wanted/needed were available there for a price they wanted to pay, they would have stayed there to begin with. "Any kind of fence that would interfere with that access is a real problem," McClung said. " So we have Mexicans coming into America to get water, or Americans going in to Mexico to get water? What is it? Wold the wall prevent Americans from getting access to the river, and which country is the river in anyway? (just a question, a real question, not snark) Generally, the river is split between the two. I really interesting situation is occurring in areas with oxbows forming. Some areas, as the oxbow pinches off, create places where a section of land is on the "wrong" side of the river. Perhaps more than you want to know, but fascinating to some. Prior to this, you would suddenly be owning land in Mexico or the US when the river changed courses. We have all our irrigation and drinking water coming from the river, both sides. Water rights is a huge issue here. Which country can pump out how much is carefully regulated through a series of treaties. Levels in the reservoirs in Mexico and the US are measured and verified to be certain both countries are sending their share into the Rio Grande. Presently Mexico is "in debt" several trillion acre feet of water. It's been raining on the US side more than the Mexico side. Both countries send over satellites to measure the reservoirs. All the pumps, inlets. etc. are in and near the river. The fence, as proposed, is being built away from the river, on part of the levee system, so it can be patrolled. Most of the land between the fence and the river is agriculture. The workers will need to get to that land and back. Necessitating gates of some kind or buying all the best farmland and putting those growers out of business. The fence isn't going through some wilderness areas. It is going through people's homes and businesses. Imagine if you suddenly could not get to 2/3rds of your business without going through a security checkpoint.

QUOTE(Jenksismyb**** @ Nov 19, 2007 -> 09:58 AM) Come on....how would a fence do that? If you're buying that many goods and going back across the border, you certainly didn't jump a fence to get there. You had to go through some security checkpoint. Obviously armed border guards aren't giving these people much of a "f*** you mexicans" message, otherwise they wouldn't continue to shop. I'm against the fence idea. I think it'd be a gigantic waste of money. But I'm reallly tired of the pass people want to give illegals. I'd be for a guest worker program - if those guest workers prove they've been working and prove they've been paying their share of taxes. Otherwise kick em out and let them go through the process (which should get revamped no doubt). The wall is part of this anti-Mexican sentiment that is felt very strongly in Mexico. There is some nationalistic pride at work here as well. These people choose to visit the US and spend their money. The wall says we do not want Mexicans, that armed border guards are not enough. So many have said their feelings are, you don't want us, fine, we will spend our money at home or travel elsewhere. Also realize they probably know someone who has emmigrated here, either legally or illegally. They also may have ancestors who became Americans after 1846.

QUOTE(southsideirish71 @ Nov 19, 2007 -> 09:44 AM) I find it ironic that Mexico cries foul when we talk about border security, legal immigration, and our social policies. Yet if I was an illegal in Mexico, I couldn't get a drivers license, couldn't own land, couldn't vote, and most likely would be in jail. You are missing the point. The shoppers we are talking about come here legally. They view the fence as Anti-Mexican and makes them feel like they are not wanted, even though they are very much wanted by us. The anti-Mexican sentiment is tough for people here legally, even just as tourists. How can the general public tell the difference between a family here legally and illegally? Is that the environment you would choose for a vacation?

QUOTE(southsider2k5 @ Nov 19, 2007 -> 09:32 AM) So you're in favor of a policy that will destoy a nations social benefits system? No. I'm in favor of a plan that matches US employers with the workers they need, via a guest worker system. I am in favor of a border security program that works without destroying innocent people in the process. We offer these social benefits to people who earn below a certain amount of money. Once those jobs are on the books, with legal employees, more people, not less, will be eligible for those benefits. The benefits, like student financial aid, medical, food, etc. are tied to the income from that job. So the destroy our system analogy is not that good. The only thing that keeps these jobs from causing the problems you allude to are continuing to hire illegals, which we cannot tolerate anymore. But gives great insight to why politicians in both parties have failed to act.

QUOTE(Kid Gleason @ Nov 19, 2007 -> 09:23 AM) Eyes Without A Face - The Flesheaters All The Best Cowboys Have Chinese Eyes - Pete Townsend

QUOTE(Kid Gleason @ Nov 19, 2007 -> 09:22 AM) I wouldn't call Ferret Face a "rabid warhawk". He was more of a War Chickenhawk with a bad cold. Rabid Warhawk actually makes him sound like a threat, and aside from being a BAD tank driver, I don't know if he was ever that much of a threat. I know what ya mean though. Now...Col. Flag, he was a rabid warhawk. Was that really Flag?

QUOTE(southsider2k5 @ Nov 19, 2007 -> 09:20 AM) And they have put up 12 million signs that they hate Americian law and order. That is how it is perceived. So you're in favor of an policy that will destroy a region's economy here in the US?

So because y'all up north employ illegals, it's f*** the Americans who live here? Nice policy from the "pro-government" party.