Texsox

Community service should be viewed as a positive thing and people should give freely instead of being "sentenced" to it.

http://www.engadget.com/2006/04/20/miller-...cans-next-year/ With links to other cool beer tech

QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Apr 20, 2006 -> 02:06 PM) Some cities have retained character better than others. Phoenix, aside from the adobe house look, looks just like a suburb of LA, so I don't think it has done much that way. This is one of the reasons I am so proud to be a Chicagoan - the city still has a great local flavor, literally and figuratively. That's a great point. It is the suburbs that have become The United States of Generica.

Somehow we've been neutering Presidents for a couple decades. I think Katrina did him in. This should have been a (no pun intended) high water mark of his second term, and he totally fumbled the PR and then the government fumbled the response. I was expecting another "bull horn" moment. An alter speech for the ages. A rallying of the American spirit in the face of a natural disaster. Perhaps I was expecting too much, but he seriously missed the PR moment of his second term. If he had rode in on his horse, comforted the masses, he'd have seized the momentum to carry him through. This also would have given him more political capital to spend on some of his policies. But we've cut off the last two presidents at the nuts.

QUOTE(Soxy @ Apr 20, 2006 -> 10:16 AM) Mustnotmakejokemustnotmakejoke. . . I don't get it :rolly

QUOTE(FlaSoxxJim @ Apr 20, 2006 -> 11:56 AM) At the same time, there is something exciting about the synthesis of very different cuisines into something new. Creole and cajun cuisines, tapas, even so-called New American cuisine are all more than the sum of their parts. Not that indiginous cuisines shoudl not be respected and preserved. But being catch-as-can by nature, they may not have all the right components to make them world class. Comfort food versus high epicurean culture, I guess. Agreed. When I was travelling weekly for work, it became "this is Wednesday and I'm hot, it must be Phoenix" who could tell by the Friday's next to the Applebees next to the Starbuck next to the Denny's all next to the LaQuinta.

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Apr 20, 2006 -> 12:00 PM) Phrases you don't expect to hear from your Congressperson: "I think you're an ass hole" I was thinking no big deal, someone on her staff is in trouble, then got to this I guess she'll be reading those things before sending them

QUOTE(YASNY @ Apr 20, 2006 -> 11:43 AM) It's not about whether or not they can screw up. I'll admit right here that they can. I'm talking about the cartoon portrayal of Bush as a dunce. With the liberal media, he's either a dunce or he's so diabolical as to be Hitleresque. And with the conservative media he's god-like, omniscient, with the ability to see WMD where there are none, and Clinton was a walking hard-on who didn't predict the future and stop Bin Laden.

QUOTE(YASNY @ Apr 20, 2006 -> 11:32 AM) Wait. Are suggesting that Bush should select someone that doesn't have the same political point of view? I mean ... Come On! How did he find someone with all the media bias

QUOTE(Controlled Chaos @ Apr 20, 2006 -> 01:25 PM) Free education. Free health care. Why have your baby in Mexico when you can sneak over here and have it in a good hospital and have your child be a US citizen? There will always be incentives to come to the US. I am against that policy. It is crippling hospitals on the border. That, and so many uninsured people. But you don't have to sneak. You can be a student, you can schedule a vacation, you can be on a shopping trip, you can join our military. (Most people don't know you do not have to be a citizen to serve in our military). If you die, you receive immediate citizenship, but not if you just have your legs blown off or something like that. Both countries actually enforce two borders. To allow a free ecnomic exchange, both countries allow access to the border region. For example, you can take a trip about 20 miles into Mexico without any paperwork. Jump across, go to dinner, do some shopping, get a haircut, and then tell the customs or immigration agent you are an American and back you go. It is almost as easy for Mexicans in the US. North of me, about 30 miles is the Falfurrias Checkpoint. There non US Citizens will have to have papers showing they are allowed into the US. Between here and there, Mexican Nationals are legal to shop, visit museums, etc. And if you should happen to have a baby when you are here, instant dual citizenship. But so far initiatives to change that US Law and not have automatic citizenship has stalled. I pray there is always in incentive to come to America. We are the greatest country on this planet. There isn't much of an incentive to move to Tanzania, but let's all hope there is always in incentive to move to the US.

QUOTE(Controlled Chaos @ Apr 20, 2006 -> 01:09 PM) We will always need border security. Be it fence, high tech, or personel. Believing that Mexicans won't try to come here illegally cause they can get on a guest worker waiting list is a pipe dream. But if no jobs are waiting for them because businesses can hire all the legal workers they need, there will be less of an incentive to sneak across. Currently, if the reports are to be believed, most of the workers have jobs waiting for them. I don't think anyone is saying throw open the border and let anyone across. But spending hundreds of billions of dollars on a 3,000 mile 5 stage fence, with all the electronic surveillance equipment isn't worth it for the problem it solves. Workers need jobs, our companies needed workers, the government's role is to make certain that doesn't happen at any cost? Nope, doesn't work for me. Workers need jobs, our companies needed workers, the government's role is to make certain those workers that enter this country are not criminals, have means of supporting themselves once they are here, disease free, and I'm certain a couple other things I'm forgetting. That works for me. To think that Americans will not rob banks because they could get jobs is a pipe dream also, but we wouldn't put up with barbed wire around all our banks. So say no to the fence and say yes to better port security, better identity verification systems for everyone from employers to creditors, citizenship programs that reward good behavior and hard work. And against most Democrat's opinion also say yes to a National ID card.

QUOTE(NUKE_CLEVELAND @ Apr 20, 2006 -> 12:59 PM) The fact that we have to import people in here to work high tech jobs is our own fault and the fault of our crappy education system. Tex we totally agree on the need for a guest worker system. Got it. But there are still going to be people who try to get in here illegally and that is what has to be addressed. That would be true if unemployment was at a much higher level. We are importing workers across the board and outsourcing. So I don't think it is a crappy education system. Plus, if the system was that crappy, we'd have all the lawnmen and farm hands we'd need. Yes, there will still be some that try and sneak in. Then we have to address how much it is worth to stop them. $100 billion to stop 1,000 people? Maybe not. And can we remember tourism, medical, and educational systems bring in so many people that terrorists don't need to sneak in. They can buy their way in the front door. We are talking about stopping desperate, mostly illiterate, workers, with this fence. Too much money for too little benefit.

QUOTE(NUKE_CLEVELAND @ Apr 20, 2006 -> 12:49 PM) HELLO TEX. Thats what we're trying to do is match employers with people and do it LEGALLY. I never said the fence is a cure-all but match that up with cracking down on companies who hire them and thats a powerful 1-2 punch to fight the problem. We can match that up legally, and not spend billions annually on a fence and it's maintenance. The problem, if we should even call it that, is we have more jobs than people to work them. We issue thousands and thousands of H1B tech Visas every year. When Microsoft needs progammers, they lobby Washington and more Visas are planned. When the local farmer needs 900 people to pick and pack his crop for 2 months, he doesn't have that pull in Washington. He winds up employing workers without documentation at worst, or with fake documentation at the almost worst. At the core, needing workers and not having them has fueled this problem. Employers aren't creating jobs for illegals. This isn't some charity thing. Let's address the issue of importing workers when we need them in a controlled and safe manner. When that happens, we won't need a fence.

If we are going to spend billions of dollars on securing our borders, let's spend it on securing the freight that comes in here. On one side is the economic pressure to clear containers as quickly as possible and on the other is the security concerns of not being able to physically check each and every container. Perhaps the threat of a WMD getting smuggled in should be a higher concern than an illiterate farm worker trying to feed his family by sneaking into the country. But hey that's just me agreeing with Bush and Reagan, and we know what a GOPerhead I am. If it wasn't for the damn liberal media bringing up all this fence and illegal stuff, we would have just went with Bush's proposal for a guest worker program or another amnesty like Reagan.

QUOTE(NUKE_CLEVELAND @ Apr 20, 2006 -> 12:17 PM) EAST Germany put up the Berlin wall to keep people from leaving an oppressive communist regime. The purpose of this is to stop people from invading our country which, by the way, is a wholly legitimate purpose. People from invading our country? Wouldn't it be better to come up with a policy that matches the employer with the worker who is invading? You act like we have armies at our border. We have poor huddled masses looking for jobs and across the river are employers willing to hire them. To keep that from happening, we need to spend billions on dollars.

QUOTE(Controlled Chaos @ Apr 20, 2006 -> 11:52 AM) What's the opposition to a fence?? I know this addresses only part 1 of the problem. I just want to hear the negatives to it. billions of dollars to contruct, and it probably would not keep illegals out. The borders are thousands of miles long. It would be too costly to build and control and for what benefit? Terrorists can come in on tourist visas. Tourism is still a huge industry and we don't want to stop that. A guest worker program that would fill the demands we have for unskilled labor would eliminate the incentive for individuals to sneak across to find work. Most employers wouldn't want to hire them if legal workers were available. We also benefit from cross border economies. We have thousands of workers here that live on the US side and work in Mexico at the maquilla plants. They pay taxes and shop on the US side. Instead of moving a plant to China and losing all the jobs, we retain the managerial and only lose the manual labor, low skilled and low wage jobs. It also keeps those jobs in Mexico and helps ease the immigration problem. Likewise, this area thrives on consumers from northern Mexico who spend hundreds of millions of dollars in our stores and vacationing. LaPlaza Mall is one of the countries busiest and most stores are in their top 5 in sales per square foot for their chains. That is almost all Mexican Nationals. We say illegal is illegal, but we always balance the cost of enforcement against the cost of the crime. For example we invest Z dollars to fight speeding. We could eliminate speeding by spending $Zx1000, but it just isn't worth it. Businesses know they could eliminate shoplifting by requiring all customers to empty their pockets and be x-rayed on their way in and out of the store. But the loss in business outweighs the loss in product. And would you want to live near that wall? You could make your home more secure by installing bars on the windows, have an armed guard outside your door, etc. but that detracts from your quality of life.

QUOTE(NUKE_CLEVELAND @ Apr 20, 2006 -> 11:12 AM) BRAVO!!!!!!!!!!! http://www.cnn.com/2006/LAW/04/20/immigrat...aids/index.html This is how its done!!!!!!! FINALLY SOMEONE GETS IT!!!!! I'm with you Nuke, this company clearly knew about the problem and ignored it. These are the ones that ignored the law and should be punished. But that isn't the solution we need. because it it was, we'd be chanting 1,000 Down 11,999,000 to GO!!!!!!!!!!!!!! And that, we've all agreed is too expensive and probably not possible.

QUOTE(southsider2k5 @ Apr 20, 2006 -> 11:19 AM) Throw this on top of something like jail time for complicit execs and $50,000 fine per illegal employee and you have your answer for stopping illegal immigration. And toss in a solution to who does these jobs, restart the closed businesses, build the jails, open more courts, and you have really solved the problem. Would you jail the execs at the top? The HR manager? Their immediate supervisor? Those are the individuals that should be jailed, then deported. This person fooled banks and everyone else. Some here would then also prosecute the employer for also being fooled by the paperwork, because that would stop illegal immigration.

One of the loses that comes with a mobile society is local flavors. Chili, at its root, is a meat dish spiced with local ingrediants. In Texas we have many chili peppers growing wild, along with wild onions, and spices. So a chili emerged using those ingrediants. As people mix and bring with them "exotic" spices and dishes, the world becomes more of a melting pot, with each area more and more like every other area until Paris, TX and Cairo, IL become Paris, France and Cairo Egypt and vice versa.

QUOTE(LosMediasBlancas @ Apr 20, 2006 -> 10:48 AM) anyone else's hayfever and allergies kick in this week? Come on and visit me, allergy hell. That stuff is year round, or so it seems.

BTW, illegals cook the best chili with peppers and stuff they gather on their trip

QUOTE(Soxy @ Apr 20, 2006 -> 10:48 AM) So, I'm guessing I can't get a good vegetarian chilli in Texas? Yes, you can get some great vegetarian chili in Texas. It just will not be Texas Chili. It will be chili in Texas. BTW, the reliance on the peppers and spices to make the chili helps a good vegetarian chili, not taking anything away. A tomato based, processed spice, bean filled chili is yuck, but a carefully crafted pot of chilis and I guess beans or tofu, is wonderful. Welcome to Texas, Y'all come anytime.

QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Apr 20, 2006 -> 10:55 AM) I'd like to point out that when I suggested we don't enforce Pub Intox laws in bars, you used the exact opposite of this argument - that we cannot pick and choose the laws we enforce. Which is why we need to find a public policy that works. The laws need to be changed, to work for America. We do need to enforce the law, and find the proper disposition to the case. I believe the proper disposition is not trying to deport millions of workers and cripple some industry segments. The proper disposition is accept in, via some amnesty or guest worker program, those that have been living here and being good citizens, and deporting those that have broken other laws in addition to our immigration laws.

QUOTE(southsider2k5 @ Apr 20, 2006 -> 10:51 AM) Like I have said through out this whole thread... The big picture is to solve this problem once and for all. Making every single illegal alien here a citizen doesn't solve a damned thing for the United States in the long run, and neither does expelling them all. We still have porous borders, 12 million illegals here, half a million more illegals showing up a year, and no reason for them to stop coming. We need to plug that hole right there, and make it so that there is no incentive to come into the United States illegally, and this program doesn't even begin to do so. You can argue the fine points, and ask me as many questions as you want, but it all comes down to that answer right there. It does begin, but doesn't do enough.

QUOTE(southsider2k5 @ Apr 20, 2006 -> 10:44 AM) Breaking multiple laws doesn't make you a criminal? Now that's funny. Of course you are correct, it makes you a criminal. But we have always used judgement in how we enforce the laws. Governors and Presidents have broad powers to offer clemency or pardons. Many have said that rounding them up and deporting them isn't an option, As a society, we are agreeing to leave these "criminals" walking around. I see a difference between employing "criminals" who we have decided can be walking around free and employing "criminals" that we feel should be locked up. Am I missing something?