caulfield12

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 1, 2015 -> 11:11 AM) Everyone see what Samardzija brought back to the Cubs last year? The #7 prospect on the BP list before 2014 as the key part? Compared to Samardzija at the time of that trade, Quintana is: Cheaper Under team control for 4 more seasons at an affordable rate Younger Left Handed (nice bonus) More consistent Has put up better seasons than Samardzija ever did. I'm on board for trading everything and then trading everything again and then trading the scraps from that...but if you don't get "Elite prospects" back for him (note the plural) then you don't trade him. That's why I think the two proposals I have are reasonable. One top pitching prospect (Zimmer/Manaea/Finnegan) SS replacement, top positional prospect in Mondesi, Jr. Dyson to upgrade outfield defense/speed/baserunning Starling for upside/sweetener/change of scenery Or Duffy/Mondesi....two positions filled for the price of one, could also include Dyson/Colon/Starling as final piece. The Royals are unlikely to give up the more proven/expensive Escobar, although you could certainly try...they're clearly not ready to turn SS over to him, preferring he replace Infante for now. Those might not be what we could have gotten this offseason...his value has come back down to earth just a bit.

QUOTE (SCCWS @ Jul 1, 2015 -> 11:13 AM) FWIW--I heard an interesting comment two years ago during a Boston/White Sox game in Boston. The White Sox were having a bad game defensively. Jerry Remy, the Boston color man, said the White Sox do very limited infield work for a road team before a game. He thought they needed to change that watching them fumble around that day. And yet his recurring argument when there's another lapse in the defense is they've already practiced it 100 times and he's tired of talking about it/beating a dead horse. Yet somehow one doesn't ever get the idea they're overpracticing....one of many allegations made against Sandberg, too much drilling, too long on the field for practicing, too many reps, too much in the way of fundamentals/situational execution on offense and defense.

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Jul 1, 2015 -> 11:00 AM) ummmmm wat Since it's getting so tiresome arguing that Ventura should be replaced and logic doesn't work, might as well use reverse logic to see if that makes any difference.

QUOTE (SCCWS @ Jul 1, 2015 -> 11:05 AM) I don't like a package that highlights Mondesi for Q. The Sox need to get 1 prime position player back either a C-SS-CF. Mondesi is KC's number 1 prospect but he is average in AA. So we are trading to hope he plays well in AAA next year. I think the Sox have to get a AAA or ML player who is putting up solid numbers as the first piece in a package. Now I would take him for Shark but I doubt KC does it. In my opinion, just as important is getting the right younger pitcher back from those three options. KC knows with their defense and bullpen, he's going to be a huge stabilizing addition and be comfortable with the veteran Volquez and hopefully another mentor (completely opposite personalities) to Ventura.

Then he should have simply written....by war, he's a top five lefty in all of mlb since 2012, ahead of both Bumgarner and Cubs' "ace" Jon Lester. The price is going to be a helluva lot higher than a Samardjiza rental...almost to the point where it becomes prohibitive, as Sale and Quintana rank along with Sal Perez as three of the five best contracts in the game for younger players.

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Jul 1, 2015 -> 10:43 AM) What he doesn't say is what the Royals should give up. Let me guess: the org's 6th and 7th prospects, with some Rios thrown in. Jason Frasor/Ryan Madson, Paulo Orlando or Dyson and Christian Colon. Maybe they'll throw in Medlen or Hochevar, lol.

I would sit down with Cooper and go over Zimmer/Manaea/Finnegan. Choose one. Next, Mondesi, Jr. Finally, Dyson or Bubba Starling...leaning towards Dyson, would try for both. Wouldn't really want Colon as we already have seemingly five potential utility infielders. Or Duffy and Mondesi, Jr., for Quintana. Change of scenery deal for both pitchers. Coop can fix him, etc. I'm just not sure with Odorizzi and now Montgomery in Seattle they'll so easily part with more young pitching prospects. We'll see.

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Jul 1, 2015 -> 09:54 AM) Quintana conversation starts with Mondesi + at least 1 of Manaea or Zimmer. It at least makes sense but for one major problem...Mondesi Jr., is going to be their eventual replacement for Infante at 2b. For the White Sox, he would play SS. And that's still arguably one player short....it needs to be someone with more offensive upside than Christian Colon, too. If Dyson could hit well enough, I would stick him in CF, move Eaton to LF and Cabrera to RF with Avi as DH and LaRoche gone. We'd get younger and more atletic...with Micah and Mondesi, Dyson and Eaton, the main concerns would be getting more offense from third and catcher. Just not sure Dyson's defense at USCF can offset his lack of pop. It would be like Juan Lagares Lite.

They're much better off hoping Duffy can return to 2014 form than trading away half of their farm system.

They already have 9 starters. With Ventura as manager instead of Yost, they would have four more victories.... At any rate... So here's a player who projects to be the same as Jeff Samardzija but without the sticker price of the name. Now, Quintana obviously has longer team control than Shark (who's a free agent in a few months) so you'd have to cough up a bit more for Quintana. Dumb ass. That last sentence wipes out the whole article.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Jul 1, 2015 -> 09:22 AM) Remember when RV was such a breath of fresh air in his first season? How all the extra infield practice made a fundamentally sound team? What happened? Did he get worse on purpose? Or was he really the cause of the improvement in the first place? If not, how can we be so sure he's the problem now? He isn't. We are dramatically overachieving. Too bad there's no sabre stat for good/sound managerial decision making.

Which is more likely, Terry Francona will be in the HoF for managing, or Robin Ventura? Wait, I know. If Robin had the same teams as LaRussa, Torre and Cox, he would surely be without peer in managerial renown compared to that formidable triumvirate. If you go by pythagorean (hello Phil Rogers), he is the best manager in the AL and Bob Melvin is far and away the worst (+5 vs -10). Gibbons in TOR would be second worst (-7). Mattingly is the worst at -4 in the NL, and Magician Joe Maddon is only at +1 with all those lucky or fluke wins. Buck Showalter, -3, not such a genius. Lloyd McClendon, +3, another candidate for an extension. Give everyone contract extensions with all that overachieving!!! If Ventura gets away to another team much closer to home, surely he will take the Angels to the World Series and beyond.

QUOTE (Swingandalongonetoleft @ Jul 1, 2015 -> 08:48 AM) Their grounds crew uses a mixture of leftover champagne from past championship celebrations, Voss + tears collected from fans of all the teams they eliminate in postseason play to achieve the most luscious, emerald hued grass in all of baseball. Dodger Blue tears....

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 1, 2015 -> 08:22 AM) How many games do you think the Sox would be ahead of the Indians if they were able to trade managers? 15? 20? It's funny, I read on here the Sox have no future. Almost all their players suck, their prospects suck, their payroll is maxed out...Yet, I also read where apparently if someone else was managing, none of this would be true. Ummm...should we have a poll with nine other managers along with Robin and you can see how few besides yourself (Greg will pick Ozzie) would have the best record since 2012 if they had been managing the same exact White Sox rosters from that point until July 1st, 2015? Tell us who you think would have a worse record and why? Sandberg? Ozzie? Who else? Buddy Bell? Joey Cora? Jim Fregosi? Davey Johnson? Valentine? Washington? Remember, Francona also has White Sox ties, back to the Barons' team with Michael Jordan two decades ago. 2-4 games per season is the difference between making the playoffs and just missing out most years.

http://www.latimes.com/sports/angels/la-sp...0701-story.html Now it looks like DiPoto is out as GM instead...crazy.

That about sums up the 2014-15 White Sox....Leury and Dan Jennings. Family members?

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/angels-offici...&soc_trk=ma Looks like Scioscia might soon be available...

http://espn.go.com/los-angeles/mlb/story/_...poto-again-odds Fight between DiPoto, Scioscia and Pujols over coaches and players not following advanced stats from scouts/front office

QUOTE (LDF @ Jun 30, 2015 -> 04:36 PM) the burdensome problem i have issue with, it i would like to think Sea had a better GM. Mariners fans are still living in the past glory days of Griffey, Jr., the Big Unit, Buhner, Edgar and Ichiro...1993-2003. They're still blaming ownership for trading away Adam Jones. There's no love for Jack Z, they haven't reached the playoffs under any of his numerous plans (for 2-3 years, he was obsessed with OF defense, guys like Endy Chavez and F. Gutierrez). I would be surprised if he's even GM next year. Willie Bloomquist would definitely be surprised.

QUOTE (LDF @ Jun 30, 2015 -> 04:14 PM) nice work in assembling all this info. oh, btw....... but i don't agree. That's where pitching is incredibly difficult to project. Last August or early September, you could have argued Felix, Iwakuma, Paxton, T.Walker and Chris Young (Comeback Player of Year who they let go to KC) was one of the best in the game, and could/should be a building block. 9 months later, Iwakuma has disappeared almost (will be a FA like Samardzija), and Walker/Paxton went through typical albeit perhaps unexpected growing pains. They're close in the same sense we are...they have some very nice pieces, but they're not competing for the moment and their window is already closing in on them as Cano, Cruz and Felix all age.

The Mariners comp is a pretty good one... Held onto aging star players too long (Ichiro is the best example) without getting anything back in return. Got desperate and dealt their best prospect (Adam Jones) for an absolute bust in Bedard. Developed a pitching staff in Hernandez, Iwakuma, Paxton, Walker that looked playoff ready...with Paxton/Walker representing Rodon and Fulmer. Almost all of their young prospects busted (Smoak, Montero, Zunino and Ackley are both getting there, Ackley in particular)... Filled in with free agent half measures like Logan Morrison, Corey Hart, Kendrys Morales (see White Sox 2011-2015). They have come up with Seager and Adam Jones, much better than anything we've managed on the position side. On the other hand, they have the Seattle market all to themselves, a better stadium (albeit not a good one for offense) and the early benefit of the $100-125 million added television/broadcast rights windfalls that we might not even receive in 2019. They have done better with FA's (Cano last year, Cruz this year) but also missed a lot (see list above, and Adrian Beltre for most of his M's career). The false positive from last year, competing until the final week...pushed them into the Cruz deal this year, which will really start to weigh down the payroll, along with Felix and Cano.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jun 30, 2015 -> 09:37 AM) So the White Sox situation is hopeless. They will never win. Isn't this the Royals model that you want the Sox to adopt? Suck Royally for 30 years, sneak into the WC get lucky during the WC game, get to the WS, lose, and suddenly your way is the right way. Isn't that preferable to now pretending Robin Ventura was 2012 AL Manager of the Year and that we actually made the playoffs that season? Should we just throw out the results from the field and argue the Sox should have won in 1994, 2003, 2006, 2008 (Quentin hamate was unlucky), 2010 and 2012? Weren't we just as lucky Hahn's kid lucked out on the coin toss, or it would be a full decade since the last White Sox playoff appearance? That doesn't count? Sometimes...teams make their own luck. It's sports. Even the 2005 White Sox had about at least eight or nine lucky things occur for them to win...every possible break went their way.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jun 30, 2015 -> 09:09 AM) Do people forget Ozzie quit on the team? Who was the manager for many of the This. Team. Is. Dead. posts. It didn't used to be blamed on the manager. Now it is. That was Greg Walker...and, if Ventura had actually led the 2012 team to the playoffs and World Series, he would have essentially bought himself another 5-6 years of good will from the fans. Now we're going on 2.5 years with just a liitle light at the end of the tunnel (Rodon, Fulmer, Anderson)..and no hint of a second playoff appearance (2008 for Ozzie) or 90 win team in sight. Finally, every team in the division is better positioned for the next 2-3 seasons...other than the Tigers, who still will possess the ability to outspend us by 25-30% as long as Illitch is alive. And, for as long as they retain David Price, they've got a gambler's chance.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jun 30, 2015 -> 08:51 AM) If it is all about the bottom line, cleaning house now isn't going to do anything but cost them money. They would be paying another manager, and or GM, or Exec VP, and fans aren't going to watch this team because Ozzie Guillen or whoever, is in the dugout. The White Sox aren't going to fire anyone because that is what DeLuca wants, or Haugh wants, or Caulfield wants. Not if it was Skinner, McEwing, Bell or Capra. As you'll notice in Philly (MacPhail, Amaro and Gillick) and Arizona, those organizations weren't afraid to spend Bonifacio/Downs/Paulino/Keppinger/Belisario money on recent in-season changes in leadership much more important than the 23rd-25th players on the roster. The White Sox, close to a billion dollar franchise, are suddenly concerned about saving a few bucks when they were recently willing to spend $125-135 million on Tanaka?

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jun 30, 2015 -> 08:51 AM) If it is all about the bottom line, cleaning house now isn't going to do anything but cost them money. They would be paying another manager, and or GM, or Exec VP, and fans aren't going to watch this team because Ozzie Guillen or whoever, is in the dugout. The White Sox aren't going to fire anyone because that is what DeLuca wants, or Haugh wants, or Caulfield wants. It's sports. Every situation like this reaches a "critical mass," to the point where the daily questions/secon-guessing and barrage of columns create a big enough distraction that it's counter-productive to the organizational goal of creating and fostering a winning atmosphere. If the White Sox stubbornly attempt to prove everyone wrong, they're just going to end up turning off even more fans.