hi8is

QUOTE (Lip Man 1 @ Jul 18, 2016 -> 10:19 PM) And this my friends is why pitch counts are ruining baseball. No justification, none... for pulling Sale unless he was hurt in some way. Sale is like Jack McDowell was with that 'bulldog' mentality, the odds are very good he wanted to finish the game and possibly throw his second career one-hitter. Are we having fun yet? Mark This team is just awful. In the past three games - you've had two games, TWO - where the starters went 16 innings giving up a COMBINED 3 hits, ZERO runs.... And NO WINS TO SHOW FOR IT????? Absolutely INEXCUSABLE. Fire Robin. Can KW. Sell anyone not named Anderson, Fulmer, Eaton, and Or keep Sale / Q / Shields / Fulmer / Rodon / Abreu / Eaton / Anderson in tact and build to compete in 2018. Still fire Robin and KW. 2017 is a wash no matter what they do. We're s*** up a creek and it's because they've been trying to compete and "retool" since 2013. It doesn't f***ing work. Sell the farm and hope to compete around 2020... Or spend like crazy and try to compete in 2018. Both directions involve a lot of pain but it's been 4 years of poor in between choices that put us here. f***ing disgusted.

QUOTE (the_Xsport @ Jul 17, 2016 -> 07:01 PM) Really, there are two contingencies they should take based on where they're at in two weeks. ONEIf they're less than 4.5 out and 55-50 (Going 10-4 over final 14), then you definitely BUY That's a convincing run and puts them in a good spot to maybe snag a wildcard appearance. Anything can happen in the playoffs, especially with their pitching. If they have a 82-85 win season, you trade for a guy like Carlos Gonzalez this offseason (unconvinced he's moved at the deadline) and go all in for 2017. If the White Sox hover around .500 in 2017, even if you're just a couple games under, you do a massive fire sale. A purge of sorts. TWO If the White Sox are 7-8 games back and around 5 games under .500 (They very well could be considering this stretch) then you undergo a major sell off. Deal Todd Frazier to the Mets for an arm. Maybe Zack Wheeler can be had. He's coming off Tommy John Surgery, but him and a lotto ticket is something I'd do for Frazier in a heartbeat. It's in the division, but Melky Cabrera would look awfully nice in an Indians uniform. A headliner around Top 10-15 range for Melky makes some sense. I'd personally target LHP Rob Kaminsky. Duke and Robertson could both be dangled. In fact, it would make sense to call the Cubs on David Robertson. Eloy Jiminez is an up and coming outfielder in the Cubs system, an oft-rumored guy that could be used for a reliever. Pay down some of Robertson's deal and getting the #7 Cub prospect seems doable. Cubs would control D-Rob for 2 more years, plus the rest of 2016. He'll come cheaper than Andrew Miller or Aroldis Chapman. The Cubs and White Sox aren't adverse to making deals. On Sale and Quintana, I've finally come to terms with the best way to handle the pair. You'll never get fair value for Quintana GMs obviously aren't as skewed to name value as fans but it's a tough sell to your fanbase to trade top chips for a 1-A. Although, I personally feel Q has reached top-tier at this point; just below the superstar echelon. First, why do the White Sox have to trade one of these two arms? Well after 2017, a year Chicago is unlikely to see the playoffs, the White Sox are potentially losing Frazier, Melky, and Lawrie anyway. That leaves them with new holes to fill for 2018 in 3B, 2B, OF. Meanwhile, who knows who has taken the reigns in CF. That's another hole, along with DH and C. So it's the 2017 offseason and you have 2/3rds of your line up to fill and there's a dearth of free agents on the 2017 market. The farm system has more fruit by that point, but not the depth or middle tier of prospects that can get you 4-5 replacement level to above average position players. So if 2018 doesn't work because again, not only are Eaton/Sale/Q/Abreu a couple years older, but they're also insulated even less than they are now for the aforementioned reasons. So you have one year of Chris Sale left and then the championship window clock really runs out. That's why I'm dealing Chris Sale in the 2016 offseason. I think you run him by Boston for foundations like Moncada/Benintendi or Bregman/Reed from Houston. Now I think it makes sense to keep Quintana. He's controlled through 2020 and will fit very nicely at the top of the rotation supporting this revamped line up. Combine this with burgeoning prospects like Collins, Anderson, and Fulmer and this looks like a real window that could open as soon as 2018: 1. CF Adam Eaton (L) 2. SS Tim Anderson ® 3. 2B Yoan Moncada (S) 5. LF Andrew Benintendi ® 6. C Zack Collins (L)* 7. DH Jose Abreu ® 8. 3B Trey Michaelczewski (S) 9. RF Eloy Jiminez ® *Collins' bat should be ready in 2018. His glove may take a bit longer. If that's the case, stick him at 1B. Caveats are that Trey and Adam Engel (Mid-tier starter or 4th OF) may not make it through the system, although I like both players. If so, there will be plenty of money off the books to at least temporarily plug these holes. Rotation: Jose Quintana (L) Carlos Rodon (L) Carson Fulmer ® Zack Wheeler ® Spencer Adams ® Alec Hansen has a world of upside. Certainly a high risk, low-hit prospect but has front of the rotation stuff if he can hone in the command. Maybe by 2018 or 2019 that's the case. Here's the plus side. The 2018-2019 FA class is historically stacked. Not smart to bet on it because there will be flux in injuries, extensions, and performance but this young core will be very cost-controlled. In fact, so cost-controlled that if Reinsdorf actually wanted to open the pocketbooks for a Jose Fernandez or Manny Machado, it would work financially. Overall, that's just one direction they could go in. Of course, trade returns are never guaranteed. One of Moncada or Benintendi could very well bust, but this is merely a template. Let your minds run wild with your own targets. You're missing a 1B / 4 hitter in your lineup. I said the same thought process with some different names coming back - some of the same names, about 3 weeks ago. I'm on your train man. It's tough not to think of a 2017 rotation like this thou: Sale Q Shields Rodon Fulmer

Sell. I already made a detailed post listing who I would target. Everyone expect Rodon, Anderson, Fulmer, and Eaton should be on the block between now and the end of the offseason.

Nice to be at Fulmer's debut. He looked fantastic. No rookie nerves - mound presence as advertised.

Any Calofornia Soxtalk members going to be at the game today?

QUOTE (CaliSoxFanViaSWside @ Jul 17, 2016 -> 09:16 AM) I applaud your conviction on the matter but when you do something like that it goes against all conventional wisdom no matter what Frazier had done all game.It's only the right call if Saladino actually gets the run in and even if he does you have to take into consideration what a move like that is saying to Frazier and the rest of the clubhouse.. I can confidently say no manager makes that move because if it doesn't work you look like a damn fool. You have to roll with your best players in those situations because you will lose the respect of every one of your players except Saladino . Since Frazier has more power it means he is more likely to hit a long fly ball or even a HR than Saladino. Even Saladino would probably be asking why the hell are you pinch hitting me for Frazier and would be feeling tremendous pressure to come through. Also Fraziers K rate is only slightly higher than Saladino's if how I calculated K% (K's divided by plate appearances) is correct. And failure means not only looking like a damn fool but you also probably make national headlines for looking like a damn fool and maybe being accused of intentionally trying to lose which gets you fired. As a fan it's easy to say you would've done it but you really wouldn't even ever become a manager to be in that situation if you ever pulled a stunt like that previously. National headlines? That's just as ludicrous as me wanting to PH for Fraizer! Cheers brother

QUOTE (CaliSoxFanViaSWside @ Jul 17, 2016 -> 01:18 AM) You honestly think anyone would pinch hit Saladino for Frazier ? It might make sense on some level knowing Frazier batting average with men in scoring position but no one pinch hits for a #5 hitter with a bench scrub ever. It's almost as bad for calling for Abreu to bunt. I know it's not "practical" but I also know that there's a lot of good logic behind it. I didn't for a second actually think it was going to happen - but I felt at the time that was the right move to make to manufacture the tying run. In that situation, on that night, with 3 horrid at bats already in the books... It was very likely Frazier was gonna K. Runners on 1st and 3rd with one out in the 9th - 1 run game. Fast dude on third too. You don't need a flipping strike out. Fraizer looked AWFUL against Shoemaker all night. He was consistently down 0-2. He was consistently going out of the zone for strike three at embarrising levels. It wasn't a conventional call but it was the right one.

Let's put it this way... When the pinch ran Saladino for Melky in the 9th - I was pissed. Why? Because I wanted a contact hitter like Saladino up there for Frazier in that situation.

QUOTE (Rowand44 @ Jul 15, 2016 -> 05:29 PM) He'll probably be in Birmingham tomorrow.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 15, 2016 -> 12:03 PM) The next time a 34 year old breaks out in the major leagues, let me know. You're killing my dreams, Dick.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 15, 2016 -> 12:26 AM) Personal or personnel? Not quite sure I understand the "personal reasons" for why he wouldn't be starting but would be coming out of the pen instead... I wanted to go to the game Sunday and see him debut as a starter.

Bummed out that he isn't getting the start Sunday for personal reasons but understand the rationality of it. Go get em Fulmer!

Can it be tomorrow already please so that the Sox can come out guns blazing for another 23-10 run? They need to collectively kiss out asses and fire on all cylinders again.

QUOTE (oldsox @ Jul 14, 2016 -> 03:47 PM) Bosox got Pomerantz from Padres. Wow. Like the deal for both sides. This is the trade that gets the winds blowing.

QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Jul 14, 2016 -> 12:36 PM) He also reported that the Sox and Cespedes finalized a contract in December I truly believe that Cespedes was the sox 1A plan and were very close to getting him.

QUOTE (bmags @ Jul 13, 2016 -> 05:46 PM) I didn't see a single game that rutherford/lewis played, I just liked the idea of either. But collins is nice too. It'll be interesting to see how they all pan out. Going into the draft I didn't think Lewis was possible. My board at the time was: 1.) Ray 2.) Rutherford 3.) Dunn 4.) Collins When Lewis was still around I wanted him picked.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 13, 2016 -> 07:11 PM) Rehab as in rehab assignment. Not a problem with addiction. Ha - the stereotype bug bites again.

QUOTE (ChiSoxFanMike @ Jul 13, 2016 -> 07:00 PM) It's not his struggles with addiction, it's the fact that he posted about it for the ENTIRE WORLD to see on social media. That just isn't a smart choice. Yea - impusitivity and high risk behaviors are obviously also a part of the struggle. I mean - what other personality type gets massive amounts of ink tattooed? Not many.

QUOTE (ChiSoxFanMike @ Jul 13, 2016 -> 04:41 PM) Lawrie is also the guy that tweeted that he was going to rehab several years ago, so I don't think he's the sharpest tool in the shed. Struggles with addiction have absolutely nothing to do with being unintelligent. In fact, the same centers of the brain involved in the addictive process prior to relapse are the same exact locations accessed by top level executives in the business world. Try again. http://www.cracked.com/article_19174_5-une...ligence_p5.html

This thread has turned into Wah Wah Wah Wah Wah Wah Wah - Wah Wah Wah - Wah Wah - Wah Wah Wah Wah Wah. Peanuts style.

QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Jul 11, 2016 -> 09:54 AM) I bet he makes the next start for Rodon,n then moves to the bullpen. That would be exciting.

QUOTE (Scoots @ Jul 11, 2016 -> 08:40 AM) http://www.csnchicago.com/chicago-white-so...wo-futures-game Struck out 2 in the futures game...projecting more as a reliever. With the Sox hurting for relief, maybe this is the time to bring him up? I honestly would hate to see them trade away talent for relief pitching from another team unless that relief is under control for a few years. Looks like Fulmer though isn't going to be a starter, according to his own words in this article anyway. Thoughts? Should they keep him down there a little longer or bring him up now? I don't think his quotes indicate he's being moved to the bullpen. Interviewer: "could you pitch in a bullpen?" Fulmer: "yea, sure." Interviewer: "would you pitch in the bullpen to help the white sox this year?" Fulmer: "yea, sure." If the line of questioning went another way, you would have seen: Interviewer: "Do you believe you can start in the majors at a high level?" Fulmer: "yea, sure."

QUOTE (soxforlife05 @ Jul 10, 2016 -> 11:27 PM) I don't think they ever had any intention of signing one of the big 3 outfielders. The only way was if they accepted the Sox lowball offer. We won't know for sure but insiders here said the offers were real. One being higher that an accepted offer ( Gordon ). We certainly know they didn't want to sign one of the big 3 AND trade for Bruce. But that lineup sure would have been tits.

For conversation sake: Jose Abreu - .258 Todd Frazier - .145 Melky - .293 Lawrie - .284 Avi - .333 Shuck - .208 Navaro - .234 Eaton - .239 Anderson - .278 Jackson - .364

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Jul 10, 2016 -> 11:13 PM) Curious about Cargo. Now I know his road splits are worse but he'd be coming to a very hitter friendly park. Not as good as Colorado but it's good. He would've hit bombs this weekend at the Cell. I'd much rather have him than Bruce. .306