Chicago White Sox

Great stuff. I’ve been on the Joc bandwagon for quite some time due to that 138 wRC+ against RHP across the 2018 & 2019 seasons. While it would be great to have a guy like Springer who can play everyday, there is real value in adding a guy like Joc on the cheap to serve as the strong side of a RF platoon. Do you have any sense of what it might take? For whatever reason 2/$20M is the figure I’ve got in my head.

Yeah, it seemed like Stiever had a ton of helium coming off the 2019 season and would probably be cracking top 100 lists right now if COVID-19 didn’t happen. Unfortunately I’m not sure his two start stint with the Sox did much to make up for a lack of proven production in the upper minors.

Seems like the Rangers need to adjust their expectations or they will be holding him to the deadline. I’m a huge Lance Lynn, but one year of him is not worth a top 50 or this case a top 20 prospect like Vaughn.

I also don’t see the logic in trading for relievers when the relief market should be suppressed this offseason.

They have like 12 guys under control for like $143M and then a bunch of pre-arb guys, so all-in they are probably in the $150Ms from what I can gather. Add in all the other things (player benefits, minor league contracts) and they should be ~$40M shy of the competitive balance tax threshold of $210M. That’s important to note as the Angels haven’t paid a luxury-type tax since 2004 and I seriously doubt they do so this year. Pitching is what they need though and they could squeeze a $30Mish AAV in there, but it would greatly their reduce ability to improve their bullpen or add to their bench. That would also reflect a payroll increase and all we know is Moreno said the payroll will not decrease next year. One other wild card is some past beef between Bauer and the Angels pitching coach from their Indians days. Doubt that is a deal breaker for the Angels, but Bauer’s personality could be a turnoff for some clubs.

Or that CLE would have the ability to take on Keuchel’s contract.

And it’s just a nonsensical trade proposal for so many reasons.

We know we pursued him heavily at the trade deadline and are likely still pursuing him right now, so it feels like an official thread is warranted. Also, I just came across a random Bleacher Report article speculating on potential prices for Lance. For the White Sox, this is the package they came up with: Jonathan Stiever Gavin Sheets Tyler Johnson To me that’s an absolute no-brainer for us. I really like Stiever, but he’s easily the most expandable prospect who might be able to headline a trade like this. And honestly, I’d much rather trade these pieces for Lance than give up Kopech or Vaughn for Snell. What do you guys think? Are you interested in Lynn? Would you do the proposed deal? https://www.google.com/amp/s/syndication.bleacherreport.com/amp/2920427-yankees-and-the-top-landing-spots-trade-packages-for-rangers-sp-lance-lynn.amp.html

Of course it can be. The Cubs broke the curse and part of the allure is over for them. Given the shit-show that is Chicago sports right now and how likable our players are, the Sox have a chance to be the city’s team.

People who are saying he’s a top 2 catcher (and to be clear, I have not said this) are considering both his offense and defense. Some of you might not like his hitting profile, but he’s without question one of the best offensive catchers in the game. He’s also one of the best framers. Yes, there are parts of his defensive game that are below average, but I 100% believe people are overreacting to a handful of dumb plays when they make statements like this. I watched most games and shook my head a few times, but he’s not this butcher that people are making him out to be. And yes, I fully acknowledge that McCann probably calls a better game, but I don’t think that means all our pitchers despise throwing to him.

https://sabr.org/latest/lynch-pitch-framing-measures-added-to-baseball-reference-com/

The Reds are going to want legit pieces if they move Gray. I’d wager Cease, Heuer, plus another interesting piece is the least they’d consider.

I’m saying hypothetically...obviously Reinsdorf is the great equalizer and the reason I’m voicing my frustrations in the first place. It’s one thing to lose out on free agents to teams like the Yankees & Dodgers, whose revenue exceeds our own by hundreds of millions of dollars. It’s completely different when you’re talking about mid market franchises like the fucking Padres. We’re in the third biggest market, with a talented, likeable, cost-controlled core in place, whose geographic rival who has had a grip on the city for two plus decades is starting to go backwards. Now is the time to pounce, add those missing last few pieces via free agency, build yourself into a legit World Series contender, and potentially make this a White Sox city for years to come. Unfortunately for us, Jerry is a risk-adverse coward who refuses to invest in his product until he’s certain the revenue will be there to prevent any short-term losses.

Angels sure, but don’t buy the Yankees as serious pursuers. No reason we shouldn’t be able to play with the fucking Padres.

Sherman is suggesting the Mets may only add one substantial free agent this offseason. If so, it’s going to be fascinating to see which guy they prioritize. If they go with a positional player (Realmuto or Springer), I just don’t know where the obvious landing spot would be for Bauer. Seems like the Blue Jays are determined to land one of the Big Four as well, so maybe he’s Canada bound. It will be an absolute travesty if the Sox don’t even make an effort to sign him in this market, especially if the only major spender (the Mets) go in a different direction.

Not that it matters, but didn’t Eloy peak at top 5?

I 100% agree that WAR in general is a flawed stat for catchers, but ignoring parts that can actually be measured like framing makes it even worse.

You’re forgetting Eloy.

I was only causally listening to the interview, but it certainly seemed like he was implying he’d be a reliever going forward.

His 4.01 ERA masked a 5.87 FIP. Don’t get me wrong, I’m still extremely high on Cease, but he’s got a lot of work in front of him as he didn’t make much progress last year. Fastball command was terrible, his fastball lacks movement despite a high spin rate, and his secondaries are still way too inconsistent. Additionally, his curveball (his bread & butter breaking ball coming up in the minors) has regressed over the past two years and his usage of it dropped by half in 2020. The good news is he has elite velocity for a starter and hopefully by partnering with Katz he can come up with some mechanical / grip changes he can turn that pitch into a weapon again. And I’m optimistic with Cooper gone that we’ll see an increase in curveball utilization even if that’s a bit of a meme at this point.

Yup. I fully expected Keuchel to regress some, which is why a #2 starter would be ideal. I could live with Dunning & Cease opening the season as our #4 & #5 starters if we added a Bauer type at the top, but in all honesty we need guys pushing each other for spots at back. I still think a Lynn or Darvish type plus signing a guy like Richards make a ton of sense. Let Cease battle Dunning & Richards for those last two spots and if he loses out he can spend a couple months in Charlotte working on whatever changes Katz has in place for him.

Apologies, wasn’t suggesting there was anything wrong with posting it. Just kind of an off putting song from my perspective, but obviously we all have different tastes in music. Also, are you saying he has struggles with mental health? I guess I’m completely oblivious to who Les Kasper is outside of his PBP role.

I agree. And if the prices via trade are too much at the moment, then go sign two of Paxton, Kluber, & Richards and hope that one of them gives you at least #3 production next year. If not, you look to acquire a TOR starter at the deadline since we’d still have all our chips. Either way, we can’t rely on the young guys to step up into that #3 spot in 2021.

We need to add at least one legit starter to the rotation. Giolito, Keuchel, & Dunning should be locks for spots. Regarding the other five guys, Katz made it sound like Lopez will be moving to the bullpen which makes sense since he’s out of options and it’s now or never time for him. I also think Lambert’s days of starting are over based on their decision to use him the major league bullpen last year rather than rehab him in Schaumburg like Dunning. Crochet is going to be on a strict innings limit next year and would likely come out of the bullpen when he’s finally part of the major league mix. Kopech hasn’t pitched in a professional game in several years and will be on an innings limit and IMO would be better off starting off the season in Charlotte. That leaves Cease who should be able to absorb a lot of innings, but is coming off a horrible 2020 season. If we don’t add at least one legit starter, I don’t think we’re serious about competing next year.

You would not add a single starting pitcher then?