blackmooncreeping

QUOTE (glangon @ Jan 8, 2016 -> 02:23 PM) Cargo for La Roche and Adams. We get Cargo, get salary relief on La Roche, they get a good prospect in Adams and we free up some money to get Fister or Lexi. Sox would probably have to include some $$ to help offset Laroche imo. I'd rather not free up money to spend on Lexi or Fister; I think I'd rather go with Saladino and use the money on a better RHP option than Fister if possible.

QUOTE (Sockin @ Jan 8, 2016 -> 02:02 PM) I think there's no way the Sox would give up Anderson or Fulmer unless the Rockies would eat a significant chunk of Carlos' salary. Even then, no thanks. I value Anderson and Fulmer more than any potential difference in $$.

QUOTE (Sockin @ Jan 8, 2016 -> 01:58 PM) Chris Cotillo ‏ Source: Padres in active discussions with Alexei Ramirez but "no deal yet". @MLBBruceLevine mentioned. https://twitter.com/ChrisCotillo/status/685550691075637250 If Lexi goes to SD, where does that leave Desmond? He might be left without a chair and be forced to entertain a shorter deal. At 25+ errors and a lost draft pick, I don't think the Sox should touch him.

QUOTE (ptatc @ Jan 8, 2016 -> 01:56 PM) Agreed. Working all of the lines to lower the prices. Sox and Cards, and probably a few other clubs, sitting and waiting for the price to go down. Stl seems like a real good fit for CarGo if they can wait the Rockies out.

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Jan 8, 2016 -> 01:09 PM) Just guessing but I think the Sox have moved on since Colorado asked for Q in return. That's the rumor anyway... Doesn't hurt to circle back and see if the price has dropped I guess...

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Jan 8, 2016 -> 12:48 PM) White Sox + Tigers + Nationals + #mysteryteam Nats are going to be a tough competitor on the big OF's imo. They've got the cash and the willingness to spend it, and I wouldn't doubt them moving Harper to CF if they can bring in Cespedes or Upton for a corner spot.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Jan 8, 2016 -> 12:44 PM) Option 4 = Sign Upton, keep Saladino, find another starter. Either way it makes it hard to see Alexei returning here. I'd rather spend the $$ on pitching.

QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Jan 8, 2016 -> 11:45 AM) Angels getting him would be huge for us. Yes. That the Angels (and WAS) are even in on these guys makes it seem like they are only in on YC/JU if the price comes back to their neighborhood. Definitely the case with the Angels imo.

QUOTE (Jose Paniagua @ Jan 8, 2016 -> 11:32 AM) Ken Rosenthal ‏@Ken_Rosenthal 39s39 seconds ago Sources: #Padres still talking to SS Alexei Ramirez, as first reported by @MLBBruceLevine. Would require shorter term than Desmond. If SD signs Lexi, where does that leave Desmond option-wise? Maybe to the Sox, and then we sign a FA outfielder not named Cespedes that doesn't require a pick ? If we could recoup the lost pick for Desmond after 2016, maybe...?

QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Jan 8, 2016 -> 11:24 AM) I can see some being a bit surprised at the number of years, but what were people expecting Span to sign for? If he was a FA last year he would have been in line for a huge payday, and the injury this year suppressed his cost, but the upside he has when healthy means it wasn't going to suppress it down THAT much. The guaranteed years is what surprised me for sure, not really the AAV

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Jan 8, 2016 -> 11:17 AM) The system doesn't work that way anymore. If a team with a late 1st rounder signs Fowler, they lose the pick. However, the Cubs would then forfeit that selection "in the comp round) because they signed 2 free agents with QO's. Got it; Sox would still lose pick, it just doesn't go directly to Cubs.

QUOTE (WhiteSoxLifer @ Jan 8, 2016 -> 11:19 AM) If Sox get Cespedes then sign Desmond to a yr deal they only give up on pick this year and can recoup the pick next year from desmond. That would require a significant bump up in payroll, yes?

QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Jan 8, 2016 -> 11:03 AM) Meh, with the Giants out they have less leverage now, that has a much bigger impact. And $10-11 million is really not that much, at least not enough to really move the needle, I wasn't expecting Span to sign for $6-8 million per year. Hope so. It's an argument you can bet the remaining FA's will make, but it remains to be seen if it works at all.

QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Jan 8, 2016 -> 10:56 AM) Effective CF might be stretching it, he's not a very good defender. Yes, all secondary options have warts for sure, part of the package. Would Sox better off leaving Eaton in CF and putting Fowler in a corner spot?

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Jan 8, 2016 -> 11:05 AM) The Cubs won't be getting a pick for Fowler because they signed 2 QO free agents. I wouldn't give up a pick for Dexter Fowler. I'm pretty sure Sox won't give up a pick unless it's for Upton So what happens to the team that signs Fowler, assuming it isn't the cubs? Do they still lose a pick, and if so, to whom?

QUOTE (bmags @ Jan 8, 2016 -> 11:01 AM) I don't think it's necessarily a good thing. 1 year deals may bring a lot of teams out of the woodwork and pay them at a price we can't afford. It's a really smart move by upton's agent, I don't think he actually will go 1 year but it's a way to create some bidding of services. Probably right. If Upton can get a fat 1 year deal, he can probably get a fat 2 year deal as well. Bid up the AAV and jump back into the market a year before the deep class hits.

QUOTE (ptatc @ Jan 8, 2016 -> 10:59 AM) Everyone was so pissed at RH for sticking to his plan of no deals longer then 3 years and convinced that the sox had no chance. Now the agents are going to the other extrme .RH is going to try to work the giving up a pick angle to bring the offer up from 1 year to suit the team better. It may not work but RH is really working the market well with few teams involved. This is my hope, and if Passan is right at all on Upton and possibly taking a 1 year deal then the market may indeed come back to Hahn & Co. It's going to either be "Hahn has BALLS OF STEEL" after he correctly reads the market and lands YC, or "Hahn is such a friggin idiot" if we dance around for a month+ and end up whiffing. Feast or famine, comes with the territory of being a GM.

QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Jan 8, 2016 -> 10:52 AM) I don't see this as driving the market higher at all. Span when healthy has been a 3-4 WAR player, and he still put up 1.4 WAR in just 61 games last year. $31 million over 3 years is a drop in the bucket to most MLB teams these days, and even if he just repeats last year's production he'll easily live up to that contract. It's got to drive it up in some regard imo, or at very least it doesn't help the Sox position. Any healthy FA outfielder now makes the obvious argument that if Span gets that much guaranteed in $$ and years, then I deserve more as in theory I give you a more dependable chance at success.

Posted this in the Cespedes thread previously but thought it might warrant a separate thread; feel free to move if needed. I really don't want to give up the pick for him, especially to the Cubs, but Fowler is an intriguing fit as a secondary option after YC/JU. It's not as splashy, but he could play an effective CF and it would allow us to move Eaton to LF and put Melky in the DH spot. And I think most importantly, Fowler would fit perfectly in the 2 hole and provide the Sox with 2 guys at the top who get on base at a good clip in front of the heart of the order. And Sliding Melky down to 5th or 6th in the lineup is a better spot for his bat to produce imo. Having said all that, I of course prefer Cespedes

QUOTE (IowaSoxFan @ Jan 8, 2016 -> 10:43 AM) Thats a lot more than I though Span would get and really hurts the Sox by driving the market higher. Span is a good player, but coming off a hip injury which may leave him as a completely different player is a huge risk. I thought he was a great candidate for a one year prove it deal with his hip. QUOTE (Jose Paniagua @ Jan 8, 2016 -> 10:45 AM) It helps the Sox by removing an OF buyer. In a weird way a case can be made that it kind of does both, and we'll just have to wait and see which scenario ends up having more weight/impact

QUOTE (IowaSoxFan @ Jan 8, 2016 -> 10:39 AM) At this point I think Upton is going to take a one year deal someplace, and if is going to take a one year deal, its not going to be with the Sox (thinking the Rangers). I can see the Sox still getting Cespedes on a deal structured like Heywards, frontloaded over the first three years with an opt out after that, and maybe a mutual/team option for a fifth year. The opt out after 3 years isn't going to work as that leaves him entering what is projected to be a very deep FA pool at that point. It's gotta have an opt out after the 2nd year imo to get them interested.

QUOTE (Lillian @ Jan 8, 2016 -> 10:22 AM) I'm sorry. I didn't mean to infer that you didn't "get" economics. However, I think you missed the point that this idea includes an opt out, after the first year. It is essentially what you are suggesting, with a little added security for the player, who has two guaranteed years, at a very generous salary, with the privilege to opt out, if he can do better. Thank you. Makes perfect sense in a depressed market, if that's indeed where we are at. Of course each guy wants max years and dollars, but you can't sign a contract that isn't there. Hell, both should prefer a shorter deal if all they are finding is 3 year offers that end in a FA class that is projected to be very deep.

I really don't want to give up the pick for him, especially to the Cubs, but Fowler is an intriguing fit as a secondary option after YC/JU. It's not as splashy, but he could play an effective CF and it would allow us to move Eaton to LF and put Melky in the DH spot. And I think most importantly, Fowler would fit perfectly in the 2 hole and provide the Sox with 2 guys at the top of the order who get on base at a good clip in front of the heart of the order. And Sliding Melky down to 5th or 6th in the lineup is a better spot for his bat to produce imo. Having said all that, I prefer Cespedes

QUOTE (bigruss22 @ Jan 8, 2016 -> 10:02 AM) And doesn't work for either of them, so what was the point of that? SO you are in the negotiating rooms now? There are published thoughts on Upton possibly on the brink of taking a 1 year deal. For multiple reasons posted on this board it could make perfect sense if they are finding a depressed market this time around--and that seems to be the case.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 8, 2016 -> 09:53 AM) On a one year deal, I would imagine you can find a more competitive team to sign with, starting with a team like the Tigers. I personally don't think the Tigers are a lock to be better than the Sox next year, and the Cell is a better hitters park to post #'s in.