blackmooncreeping

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Jan 1, 2016 -> 05:33 PM) Another idea could be, let's say the Sox signed Upton. Upton to RF, Avi to LF, Melky to DH and LaRoche on the bench with Sands to give the bench pop from both sides of the plate late in games. LaRoche also provides an option of late inning defensive replacement at 1B. I like this idea, whether it's Upton or Cespedes in theory that could work.

QUOTE (Special K @ Jan 1, 2016 -> 05:20 PM) There is no chance this will ever happen. Absolute best case scenario, .240 with 10-12 homers. I've never seen someone deteriorate offensively so quickly in all my years watching baseball but it happened with LaRoche. Even his OBP was garbage. He really is this bad now. His agent better have gotten a phenomenal Christmas gift from him. Even though I can't say I think he will bounce back, this info that he had some type of lingering hand injury that affected him throughout the year still has to play itself out. If he's as bad into May as he was in all of 2015, then you know for sure you have a lemon. We're in that weird spot of can't standing a guy due to his abysmal performance last season and the way he handcuffs the roster, but conversely having no other option than to hope he does bounce back since we are stuck with his ass.

QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Jan 1, 2016 -> 05:05 PM) Steamer projects 266/312/473 with 27 HRs and 32 2Bs. If that's a "bad" year, then sign me up. An Abreu-Cespedes-Frazier middle of the order......... ...would be sweet, and to have Laroche hit even .250 in the 6 or 7 hole would make it so much deeper.

QUOTE (ChiSoxFanMike @ Jan 1, 2016 -> 04:57 PM) http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2016/01/whit...hree-years.html Did anyone else besides me notice that Upton is mentioned just briefly in this article? It makes me wonder if he's the guy the Sox really want. QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Jan 1, 2016 -> 04:59 PM) I like the idea alot. Funny thing about this off season is that it's coming full circle. Going into the off season the Sox were said to be after Upton, then it was Gordon, then Cespedes and it would seem the Sox attention could or maybe even has turned back to Upton. If the Sox are to sign one of the three I would hope it's Upton. Given his age I think his health and performance could hold up better over the life of the contract. Upton definitely fits the younger player profile that Hahn has touted, and Sox would feel better positioned to be paying for prime production years. Obviously it's a bit more of a gamble for Cespedes and Gordon due to the age difference.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jan 1, 2016 -> 04:56 PM) I don't know if anyone has pointed this out, but if the White Sox need to "backload" a deal to take advantage of the ending of LaRoche and Danks's contracts after 2016, that makes offering an "opt out" basically worthless because the player would have given up a huge amount of money by backloading it. I would front load it then, a la Heyward, so the player gets his jack up front and basically bets on himself to earn more by opting out on the heels of 3 productive years.

QUOTE (CWSpalehoseCWS @ Jan 1, 2016 -> 04:56 PM) The only player in FA SS other than Ramirez is Desmond who is going to cost a draft pick. Not worth it IMO. Saladino's 2016 projections are not that far off from what Ramirez did last year. I would much rather see the Sox go with the internal option and allocate their resources towards other positions. I think with the additions of Frazier, Lawrie, and Avila/Navarro to Sox will be ok with Saladino in the 9 spot. The lineup is already 100x better than last year. Adding a big OF bat will only make it stronger. I agree, def don't want to give up a pick for Desmond. Or Fowler for that matter.

QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Jan 1, 2016 -> 04:54 PM) My number 1 pitching target is Edwin Jackson. He'll be extremely cheap because he's still getting paid by the Cubs. If we sign Cespedes/Gordon/Upton, then I think they bring back Alexei on a 1 year/4-6 million deal. Bench would consist of Saldino, Sanchez, Shuck and one of the catchers. Move Avi to AAA for everyday at bats or trade him for more pitching depth. That bench has no pop at all though. I'd rather start Saladino at SS and use that bench spot for someone who's got some pop if possible. I'd love to bring in Edwin Jackson, who has swingman ability as far as starting or long relief. Plus it would be sweet for him to have a good year for us while the Cubs were still paying him

QUOTE (CWSpalehoseCWS @ Jan 1, 2016 -> 04:41 PM) I really hope the Sox stay FAR away from Segura. Going after him doesn't make any sense, especially if the Sox are as high on Anderson as they appear to be. They need a stopgap at SS for 1-2 years until Anderson proves he's ready. If anything they'd be better off bringing back Ramirez rather than trading more talent for Segura - who hasn't been the same player since he lost his son two years ago. I'm perfectly content with Saladino at SS next season with some of the offseason additions the team has made. Ok, if not Segura, any other players come to mind to play SS? I'm not super familiar with who may or may not be available SS-wise. I love Saladino's glove but and not sold that he can hit as a starter--he seemed to tail off dramatically the last part of the year. Especially if we don't end up with a big bat from Gordon/Upton/Cespedes, Salad's weak hitting will potentially stand out even more.

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Jan 1, 2016 -> 04:40 PM) I agree, the Upton opt-out idea makes sense and is much more of a possibility than with Gordon/Cespedes whom seem to be looking to get locked up for the long term financial security. I like the idea of Upton and an opt-out depending on the parameters. I have been googling the big three over the last four or five days and Upton is by and large the most quite as far as rumors and speculation goes. From the little bit I've been able find, it sounds like Upton might be sitting back waiting for Cespedes and/or Gordon to sign. Without Cespedes/Gordon for competition it could force a desperate team to be more willing to give into his demands. Wonder if the Sox are in better position now to go for Upton. Offer him a 5 year deal averaging say 23 million a year, with opt-outs after the 3rd/4th/5th years. Would fit the Sox 2-3 year window and allow Upton to re-enter free agency as early as age 31 I believe.

Time will tell if the Sox are indeed moving to the back of the room when it comes to Gordon/Cespedes/Upton. While I'm not ready to throw in the towel on one of these guys quite yet, if we are out of the mix do the Sox quickly pivot to finding an answer at SS or a starting RHP? Who would you target out there if that's the case? There was some buzz earlier on Segura from Milwaukee as a younger SS option, is there a fit there? Any way we can flip Danks or Laroche to the Brewers somehow in the process? Just spitballing here...

Obviously things weren't going smoothly or we would've either signed someone already or just continued to negotiate. Trying to manipulate via the press is an old tactic, but it tells you at a minimum that the Sox feel like they've got to at least change things up to 'unstick' the situation.

QUOTE (Markbilliards @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 03:48 PM) I find this offensive. Bartolo is the ultimate physical specimen. Funniest Onion headline ever: "Bartolo Colon rolls uncontrollably down small hill"

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 03:15 PM) I don't know, his time down to 1B was over 7 seconds. Still faster than PK

QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 04:42 PM) If Melky put up his second half numbers throughout the whole season, I'd be extremely satisfied. It's about what I expected from him. If he can hit .270, with 15 bombs and around 70 rbi, then he's earning his salary. Anyone expecting more than that will be disappointed, but that's on them for having unrealistic expectations.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 02:30 PM) Isn't his average about $28 million the first 3 years? Then he could opt out. He is risking about $16 million with a chance to make a lot more. If he is great, Theo probably lets him walk, and gets 3 prime years out of him, and doesn't have to pay for the decline. I still think he is going to start hitting homers, but his defense will fall off a bit. 245 pound guys legs don't age all that well IMO. Bartolo Colon begs to differ

QUOTE (Alexeihyeess @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 02:25 PM) Contracts go up over time. Fans, particularly Cubs fans, love sentimental crap like taking less money. Heyward exploited both to his advantage which is smart. bingo

QUOTE (ptatc @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 02:11 PM) Ask Jason Heyward. He made a mistake and drank some Cubbie kool-aid, guy should have just banked the $200 million. Instead he's gonna get real familiar with the 108 years thing

QUOTE (Alexeihyeess @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 02:27 PM) Jimmy Rollins is probably tired of baseball after playing 37 games a day in 2015. heh-heh...134 gms

QUOTE (peavy44 @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 02:03 PM) what about gordon 4 years $80 million to cespedes 5 years $110 million That's a no brainer for me. Gordo, and use the saved $$ on pitching

QUOTE (ChiSoxFanMike @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 01:21 PM) Pass. I think Saladino could put up better numbers than him for much cheaper. Agreed. Rollins posted a .224 average, 13 hrs, 41 rbis, and committed 9 errors in 13334 games last year. Not sure if Saladino can hit 13 hrs, but his base running advantages more than make up for it. Not to mention the $$ difference.

QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 11:10 AM) Looking back on this trade, I still think we got the best return, but I am growing concerned that Frazier may put up 2013-like numbers for us. why...

QUOTE (dpd9189 @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 12:01 PM) Another thing to remember is Cespedes is coming off a 4 yr $36 mil deal which was a pretty good bargain for him. He wants to get paid big time and hired Jay Z's firm to represent him. Any idea of the Sox getting him on a discount probably isn't realistic. If they want him, they're going to have to spend like the big boys. Why would a guy get to free agency and then take any sort of discount from a non hometown team? Cespedes will take big $$, agreed.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 10:22 AM) If he was using the same approach and swing, yes it would be a waste. If they want to change some things up, it is worth a shot. Nelson Cruz was a failed AAAA player until he changed some things up and/or took some booster shots. Hopefully the threat of losing his job will motivate Avi to get in and then stay in shape. I'd definitely rather keep Avi around than Laroche, but he's got to really show that he mentally gets the situation. If it's just the same old Avi, I say arreviderchi

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 10:22 AM) Who would you give his at-bats exactly? I don't see anyone on the roster or in AAA that has more potential upside that LaRoche does against RHP. He very well might suck again next year, but I'd rather give him a month or two to show me he isn't completely done yet before I give Shuck or Avi more at-bats. If not, we can always release him mid-season. If we end up signing one of the big outfielders, then Melky and Avi would combined both get the majority of AB's at DH imo (one guy in RF, one guy at dh). If we don't bring in one of the big outfielders, then Laroche it is. Just not sold on a rebound, and apparently no other MLB team is either since we can't move him WITH a truck full of cash attached.

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Dec 31, 2015 -> 09:21 AM) I understand the thinking behind Avi getting everyday at bats at AAA but he has already shown he can hit AAA pitching so, IMHO, the best way for him to improve is to continue seeing MLB pitching, even if its in a platoon role. I'll be first to admit that when the Sox signed LaRoche I liked the signing but before that I was a big fan of the idea of keeping the DH spot open so it could be used as part of a rotation among the outfielders. I know its hindsight but boy the Sox sure could use that open spot now more than ever. We could see less of Avi and Melky in the outfield and yet still get them at bats. I agree, sending Avi to AAA would be a waste. I think he's either on our roster or we've traded him to acquire some sort of pitching. To overstate the obvious, Robocop Laroche is really the clog in the drain. I still think it would be worth it to basically buy him out and facilitate a trade to any team who is willing to take him on for 3 to 5 million. The lineup flexibility is worth it imo.