steveno89 Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 QUOTE (Alexeihyeess @ Jul 31, 2017 -> 02:33 PM) Injury risk is a major, major factor. Handedness matters too. Gray is to Quintana as Quintana is to Sale. Similar in ways, but ultimately you know which player you'd rather have. Keeping Adams/Torres/Frazier was key for the Yankees. Adams should be ready to slide into a rotation spot soon, if not by next spring training. They can sign Harper after 2018 and be totally set to contend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveno89 Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 QUOTE (Quin @ Jul 31, 2017 -> 02:38 PM) The winner of the 2017 Trade Market is Rick Hahn On paper? Yes. Remains to be seen which of these prospects pan out for us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 QUOTE (Alexeihyeess @ Jul 31, 2017 -> 02:33 PM) Injury risk is a major, major factor. Handedness matters too. Gray is to Quintana as Quintana is to Sale. Similar in ways, but ultimately you know which player you'd rather have. Sure but you are using the certainty of knowing the outcome now and applying it retroactively. It seemed like Quintana should fetch similar value to sale given contract and output, but the market indicators was he was a major drop off. There were teams like the Astros who just did not seem interested at all in Q. Q was lumped together in the same teams with Gray, who despite his weaker performance didn't garner the same freakout. These trades established the nice tier between them, but it was not obvious prior to Quintana being dealt that he would net significantly more than Gray. It seemed like they'd be playing in the same pool of players, but that wasn't the case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quin Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 QUOTE (steveno89 @ Jul 31, 2017 -> 03:39 PM) On paper? Yes. Remains to be seen which of these prospects pan out for us. Just the fact that he was able to get the returns he did in what has become a buyer's market. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveno89 Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 QUOTE (Quin @ Jul 31, 2017 -> 02:41 PM) Just the fact that he was able to get the returns he did in what has become a buyer's market. True^ I'm a bit surprised that the Astros did not make a bigger splash than they have. They have the best record in the AL, and the farm system to get big deals done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rowand44 Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 (edited) QUOTE (Quin @ Jul 31, 2017 -> 02:41 PM) Just the fact that he was able to get the returns he did in what has become a buyer's market. Executive of the year with like the worst team ever assembled right now. I'm not totally serious obviously but he's had a hell of a year on paper. As Steven said though, it remains to be seen if these guys are as good as we all hope. Edited July 31, 2017 by Rowand44 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bighurt574 Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 Interesting deal for Oakland. Lots of risk with the injuries, and they're buying low, but they basically got 3 top-100 quality prospects (when healthy). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BaconOnAStick Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 Sure but you are using the certainty of knowing the outcome now and applying it retroactively. It seemed like Quintana should fetch similar value to sale given contract and output, but the market indicators was he was a major drop off. There were teams like the Astros who just did not seem interested at all in Q. Q was lumped together in the same teams with Gray, who despite his weaker performance didn't garner the same freakout. These trades established the nice tier between them, but it was not obvious prior to Quintana being dealt that he would net significantly more than Gray. It seemed like they'd be playing in the same pool of players, but that wasn't the case. I think its just a case of one buyer, the Cubs, deciding they were going to go all out to maximize their window while everyone else remained kind of gun-shy when it came to dealing their best prospects. Once the Cubs were willing to part with Jimenez it became a matter of which team had the best asset to give up, and it just so happened that the White Sox had that asset. That said, I'd rather have Kaprielian and Fowler (injuries be damned!) than Cease, Rose and Flete. Oakland did very well for themselves in getting a quantity of players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eminor3rd Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 Ton of upside, ton of risk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 QUOTE (Rowand44 @ Jul 31, 2017 -> 02:46 PM) Executive of the year with like the worst team ever assembled right now. I'm not totally serious obviously but he's had a hell of a year on paper. As Steven said though, it remains to be seen if these guys are as good as we all hope. It kinda sorta incredibly annoys me that the org would go so big on these risky assets and then put 1st year retired players in charge of their teams in the minors. And a pretty green guy in charge of player dev. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 QUOTE (steveno89 @ Jul 31, 2017 -> 02:45 PM) True^ I'm a bit surprised that the Astros did not make a bigger splash than they have. They have the best record in the AL, and the farm system to get big deals done. The Astros are a peculiar franchise. They have a unique valuation system for players and supposedly when a deal doesn't add up, they absolutely don't go any further. If there was any franchise that I would expect to strike out at the break, it was them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 QUOTE (Alexeihyeess @ Jul 31, 2017 -> 02:50 PM) I think its just a case of one buyer, the Cubs, deciding they were going to go all out to maximize their window while everyone else remained kind of gun-shy when it came to dealing their best prospects. Once the Cubs were willing to part with Jimenez it became a matter of which team had the best asset to give up, and it just so happened that the White Sox had that asset. That said, I'd rather have Kaprielian and Fowler (injuries be damned!) than Cease, Rose and Flete. Oakland did very well for themselves in getting a quantity of players. Eloy Jimenez IS the deal here. The Yankees were never willing to put a top flight guy on the line. Unless they were going to offer Gleybar Torres, the Yankees weren't going to offer a better deal that included Kaprelian and Fowler. Even then, personally I'd rather have the Jimenez fronted deal Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveno89 Posted July 31, 2017 Share Posted July 31, 2017 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 31, 2017 -> 04:13 PM) Eloy Jimenez IS the deal here. The Yankees were never willing to put a top flight guy on the line. Unless they were going to offer Gleybar Torres, the Yankees weren't going to offer a better deal that included Kaprelian and Fowler. Even then, personally I'd rather have the Jimenez fronted deal Yankees would have to include Frazier + Adams + one additional quality piece to realistically have beaten the Cubs offer, which was never on the table. Jimenez is a better prospect than Frazier in my opinion. I'm surprised the Astros did not go all in on Quintana. It would have meant surrendering Tucker + Whitley + another solid piece though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soxforlife05 Posted August 2, 2017 Share Posted August 2, 2017 QUOTE (steveno89 @ Jul 31, 2017 -> 02:14 PM) I feel the Yankees did very well in this deal. They did not get coaxed into dealing Torres/Frazier/Adams/Sheffield, and surrendered 2 injured prospects and 1 who's stock has been slipping in Mateo. Jimenez is a significantly better prospect than anyone in this deal, and an argument could be made for Cease being a better prospect now as well. A's failed to leverage Gray into a truly elite prospect, so I currently consider this to be a failure on their part. I can agree the Q deal was much better than this one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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