Can someone please explain how service time works.  Let's take Luis Robert for example. What is the difference between the following 3 scenarios with service time....

1. Luis Robert comes up end of this year

2. Luis Robert starts the year on opening day next year

3. Luis Robert is not called up until May 1st next year.....

 

Thanks 

3 minutes ago, 2Deep said:

Can someone please explain how service time works.  Let's take Luis Robert for example. What is the difference between the following 3 scenarios with service time....

1. Luis Robert comes up end of this year

2. Luis Robert starts the year on opening day next year

3. Luis Robert is not called up until May 1st next year.....

 

Thanks 

1 and 2 no difference. 3 we get him an extra year. 

2 hours ago, Buehrle>Wood said:

1 and 2 no difference. 3 we get him an extra year. 

Thank you 

10 hours ago, 2Deep said:

Thank you 

It's a no brainer.  He signs an extension and comes up now or we see him next May.

27 minutes ago, poppysox said:

It's a no brainer.  He signs an extension and comes up now or we see him next May.

He has no incentive to sign an extension, he already got a $26 million signing bonus

46 minutes ago, joejoedairy said:

He has no incentive to sign an extension, he already got a $26 million signing bonus

The FO has no incentive to bring him up until next May.

I think we plan to contend next year then you bite the bullet and bring him up this year and have him ready to go as your CF at the start of 2020

6 minutes ago, 2Deep said:

I think we plan to contend next year then you bite the bullet and bring him up this year and have him ready to go as your CF at the start of 2020

Absolutely not. The Sox are not going to sniff the playoffs in 2019, why would they burn a season of contractual control? Robert will be up with the mlb club mid-late April 2020. 

1 hour ago, joejoedairy said:

He has no incentive to sign an extension, he already got a $26 million signing bonus

I would say 8-10 years of financial security that greatly exceeds his 26 million dollars is quite an incentive.  There are no guarantees for himself that everything works out perfectly, if the Sox wave a big contract in his face it would be super dumb to say no only because he already made money 

1 minute ago, Kyyle23 said:

I would say 8-10 years of financial security that greatly exceeds his 26 million dollars is quite an incentive.  There are no guarantees for himself that everything works out perfectly, if the Sox wave a big contract in his face it would be super dumb to say no only because he already made money 

If you're going to sign him to a 10  year, $150 million extension right now, that's fine. Giving up a  year of free agency to sign an 8 year deal that only guarantees him an extra $30 million, that's not worth talking about for a player like him.

2 minutes ago, Kyyle23 said:

I would say 8-10 years of financial security that greatly exceeds his 26 million dollars is quite an incentive.  There are no guarantees for himself that everything works out perfectly, if the Sox wave a big contract in his face it would be super dumb to say no only because he already made money 

Yes and we see players like mike trout not wanting to deal with that process despite being incredibly close to cashing in.

Also I think Robert will be amicable seeing as how the Sox let him play in DSL year 1 to maximize his earnings. I know that may have been an incentive to sign, but still was something Sox did. 

5 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

If you're going to sign him to a 10  year, $150 million extension right now, that's fine. Giving up a  year of free agency to sign an 8 year deal that only guarantees him an extra $30 million, that's not worth talking about for a player like him.

Well when you present two polar opposite contracts, one that is way over the top and one that is borderline insulting, of course the team and the player wouldn't pick either.   It's almost like the Gm could negotiate something that works for the both of them and gets the player to the majors earlier than the service time dictates

10 minutes ago, Kyyle23 said:

Well when you present two polar opposite contracts, one that is way over the top and one that is borderline insulting, of course the team and the player wouldn't pick either.   It's almost like the Gm could negotiate something that works for the both of them and gets the player to the majors earlier than the service time dictates

Dude, you literally just called the contract that Eloy Jiminez signed to come up from the minor leagues "Borderline insulting" and you're wondering why I'm saying Robert wouldn't sign the kind of extension that would bring him up from the minor leagues early?

35 minutes ago, 2Deep said:

I think we plan to contend next year then you bite the bullet and bring him up this year and have him ready to go as your CF at the start of 2020

If that was the case, I think he'd be in the big leagues by now.  No reason to lose patience in the 11th hour. 

11 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

Dude, you literally just called the contract that Eloy Jiminez signed to come up from the minor leagues "Borderline insulting" and you're wondering why I'm saying Robert wouldn't sign the kind of extension that would bring him up from the minor leagues early?

Dude we aren't talking about the same players with the same deficiencies and the same circumstances, now are we?   So while you always consider one size fits all, and BECAUSE THEY DID IT WITH ELOY IT MUST BE DONE THE SAME WAY WITH ROBERT, I look at it that Robert is a way more well rounded player that deserves more and will get more, but not 15 per year for 10 years without sniffing the majors.

they aren't the same player, they don't present the same value.  You admitted as much when you said "that's not worth talking about for a player like him"

1 hour ago, Kyyle23 said:

Dude we aren't talking about the same players with the same deficiencies and the same circumstances, now are we?   So while you always consider one size fits all, and BECAUSE THEY DID IT WITH ELOY IT MUST BE DONE THE SAME WAY WITH ROBERT, I look at it that Robert is a way more well rounded player that deserves more and will get more, but not 15 per year for 10 years without sniffing the majors.

they aren't the same player, they don't present the same value.  You admitted as much when you said "that's not worth talking about for a player like him"

Sox will likely inquire about a potential extension in the offseason, and if Robert's camp isn't interested then the Sox say screw it and secure seven years of control. 

I'm not worried about what happens after seven more years at this stage, just secure the extra year. 

2 minutes ago, steveno89 said:

Sox will likely inquire about a potential extension in the offseason, and if Robert's camp isn't interested then the Sox say screw it and secure seven years of control. 

I'm not worried about what happens after seven more years at this stage, just secure the extra year. 

I agree, I'm not saying bring him up at all costs because who cares.  I want that control also, I want to know that we won't be getting into the arb wars that make everyone mad at each other.

i just hope that they are negotiating with him, trying to make it work so he can get his feet wet this season and be ready to rock and roll next season 

Robert will be up probably after Super 2 deadline passes next year.  Jerry needs to save his money.

1 minute ago, bjm676 said:

Robert will be up probably after Super 2 deadline passes next year.  Jerry needs to save his money.

Not at this rate. Some will cry owner's are being cheap, but the reality is that it would be bad business to sacrifice a year in what is likely Robert's prime for a few meaningless at bats in the lost 2019 season. 

Robert will be up spring 2020, just enjoy the ride. 

3 hours ago, Kyyle23 said:

Dude we aren't talking about the same players with the same deficiencies and the same circumstances, now are we?   So while you always consider one size fits all, and BECAUSE THEY DID IT WITH ELOY IT MUST BE DONE THE SAME WAY WITH ROBERT, I look at it that Robert is a way more well rounded player that deserves more and will get more, but not 15 per year for 10 years without sniffing the majors.

they aren't the same player, they don't present the same value.  You admitted as much when you said "that's not worth talking about for a player like him"

Simple question in reply.

Do you think that Jerry Reinsdorf is willing to break brand new ground on a contract format for this player?

3 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

Simple question in reply.

Do you think that Jerry Reinsdorf is willing to break brand new ground on a contract format for this player?

Simple reply.  Yes.  They haven't treated every player the same, Beckham, Sale, Eloy, Kopech, Cease, Collins, Anderson, Moncada, all have been brought up at different times with different service time qualifications and some have signed extensions and some have waited and signed extensions and some have moved on and all of them have been under Hahn/Williams/Reinsdorf

one size does not fit all

Just now, Kyyle23 said:

Simple reply.  Yes.  They haven't treated every player the same, Beckham, Sale, Eloy, Kopech, Cease, Collins, Anderson, Moncada, all have been brought up at different times with different service time qualifications and some have signed extensions and some have waited and signed extensions and all of them have been under Hahn/Williams/Reinsdorf

one size does not fit all

Not one of them has signed an "unprecedented" contract of the sort you're talking. Eloy's deal was right in line with Anderson and with that guy from the Phillies who was signed before he came up. You're talking for Robert about having to do a dramatically large guarantee in order to get him to sign - you said so yourself that the guarantee given to Eloy was "Insulting". 

Reinsdorf is not going to establish the precedent that he'll guarantee a guy his entire arbitration salary in order to buy out 1 year. 

1 minute ago, Balta1701 said:

Not one of them has signed an "unprecedented" contract of the sort you're talking. Eloy's deal was right in line with Anderson and with that guy from the Phillies who was signed before he came up. You're talking for Robert about having to do a dramatically large guarantee in order to get him to sign - you said so yourself that the guarantee given to Eloy was "Insulting". 

Reinsdorf is not going to establish the precedent that he'll guarantee a guy his entire arbitration salary in order to buy out 1 year. 

You brought up the dramatically large guarantee, not me. I said they could negotiate to make everyone happy an that didn't work for you because that just doesn't work for a player of his caliber, clearly 10/150 is the only way to do this by Balta rules.  

Again, my original point was if the player can guarantee the next 8-10 years financially of his career, it would be dumb for him to deny it BECAUSE HE ALREADY MADE TWENTY SIX MILLION DOLLARS.   But you go ahead and spin it however you want

Just now, Kyyle23 said:

You brought up the dramatically large guarantee, not me. I said they could negotiate to make everyone happy an that didn't work for you because that just doesn't work for a player of his caliber, clearly 10/150 is the only way to do this by Balta rules.  

Again, my original point was if the player can guarantee the next 8-10 years financially of his career, it would be dumb for him to deny it BECAUSE HE ALREADY MADE TWENTY SIX MILLION DOLLARS.   But you go ahead and spin it however you want

How on Earth do you guarantee 8-10 years financially without a dramatically large guarantee?

3 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

How on Earth do you guarantee 8-10 years financially without a dramatically large guarantee?

Well if he signs an extension for 8-10 years, then his next 8-10 years are guaranteed.  That's how that works.