Just for kicks....

[WHITESOXRANDY]

We know the Sox want to trade Crede but apparently no one is willing to give up much for him until they know he's healthy.

 

Just for fun I'd like to take guesses at what the Sox might be able to get should Crede appear perfectly healthy and have an excellent spring training by early March. What's the most the Sox could get ?

 

Could they get a young starting pitcher from San Francisco such as Lowry or Cain ? I imagine that he'd be worth the most to a team that has a relationship with Boras and feels that they have a good chance to sign him long term. The Phillies ? The Angels ?

[jasonxctf]

1 AAA prospect and 1 AA prospect

 

he's only signed for 1 yr. Why would we get more for him than Freddy G?

[Steve9347]

Could they get a young starting pitcher from San Francisco such as Lowry or Cain ?

We don't have the resources on our team to get Matt Cain. Crede alone wouldnt even be close.

 

A Floyd/Crede for Cain or Danks/Crede for Cain would be gorgeous, but it'd never happen.

Edited January 18, 2008 by Steve9347

[eickevinmorris]

Fields/Jenks might not net Cain.

 

Jesus Christ.

[WHITESOXRANDY]

What would we want from the Phillies ? They have no outfield depth anymore or starting pitching depth. Minor leaguers Carlos Carrasco RHP and Jason Donald SS ? That sounds pretty good to me.

 

You guys are missing the point of the thread. I'm asking for your hopes of what specific players the Sox could get for him should be prove healthy with good play not what it would take to get Matt Cain.

Edited January 18, 2008 by WHITESOXRANDY

[BearSox]

I'd take a couple C prospects just to get some bodies for the farm.

[Balta1701]

What would we want from the Phillies ? They have no outfield depth anymore or starting pitching depth. Minor leaguers Carlos Carrasco RHP and Jason Donald SS ? That sounds pretty good to me.

 

You guys are missing the point of the thread. I'm asking for your hopes of what specific players the Sox could get for him should be prove healthy with good play not what it would take to get Matt Cain.

The specific types of players we could get for Crede in ST if he were completely healthy? I think we might get something similar to what we got for Mack and Iguchi last year. Some A level relief pitcher with a 1/50 shot at making the big leagues. Because even if we're convinced Joe is completely healthy, he's still owed $5 million, he's still a FA at the end of the year which means he's a 1 year stop gap at best, and he's coming off a surgery where no one knows how long his back will actually hold up. As far as any other team is concerned, he might well play ST, play the first game of the year, throw his back out again, and have his career be over.

 

We might, if we were lucky, be able to get something similar to what we did with Borchard...find a team that's about to lose a guy who's out of options and trade for that guy.

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

The specific types of players we could get for Crede in ST if he were completely healthy? I think we might get something similar to what we got for Mack and Iguchi last year. Some A level relief pitcher with a 1/50 shot at making the big leagues. Because even if we're convinced Joe is completely healthy, he's still owed $5 million, he's still a FA at the end of the year which means he's a 1 year stop gap at best, and he's coming off a surgery where no one knows how long his back will actually hold up. As far as any other team is concerned, he might well play ST, play the first game of the year, throw his back out again, and have his career be over.

 

We might, if we were lucky, be able to get something similar to what we did with Borchard...find a team that's about to lose a guy who's out of options and trade for that guy.

I think you're really undervaluing him. The reason Mack and Iguchi weren't worth anything is because both were basically going to be backups with contracts similar to starters, they only had a half year left (except for Mack who had an option which SD had to buyout IIRC), and neither brought compensation.

 

Crede at his position is much better than either of those guys, and he's at a very reasonable price if he's healthy. He can still qualify for compensation, so the Sox should get something decent for him. We're not getting a stud, but we might be able to luck into another Gio or something, i.e. a young prospect with upside coming off a bad year, and a bench player or something.

 

I still like the idea of some kind of Crede-for-Willits or Santana swap, or something like that. The Angels are good trading partners for Crede. What could SF or PHI offer, and who else would be out there?

 

Edit: Of course, this is all assuming Crede is healthy in ST. If he's not, we'll be dumping him for nothing AND paying part of his salary or taking on another bad contract in return.

Edited January 18, 2008 by Kenny Hates Prospects

[santo=dorf]

..salary relief and a C-ball prospect.

 

I feel the trade winds a-blowin'......

[Gbubbs]

Capuano?

[almagest]

Teams know we have two MLB-ready third basemen, so they're not going to give us much. Maybe one B prospect is about the best we could do, since they know if Crede has a decent year and walks, the draft pick they would get would make up for the prospect they traded. I think the smartest thing to do would be to trade Crede near the end of spring training, if he's healthy and is playing reasonably well. By that time, some third basemen will be hurt, or some team will realize the guy they thought could fill the position can't, and Crede will be more valuable since he'd likely be the only decent 3B available at that point.

 

Ideally, if he's playing well, you wait until the trade deadline to move him, since even a half-year of Crede would be worth more at that point to a contender. Unfortunately, we can't do this since we'd be wasting Fields on the bench or in AAA.

 

Of course, if he's hurt or produces like he did from '03-'05, we'll get absolutely nothing for him.

[Vance Law]

A C-prospect, B if we're lucky. If we're super lucky, some team's 3rd baseman gets attacked by a shark and there's more demand for him. You've got a guy coming off major surgery, who therefore has a high risk of injury, even if he looks great and healthy in ST. He is a one year rental. He costs $5 million. Now how many teams LEGITIMATELY might be interested in him? The Giants, and to a lesser degree, the Phillies. That's it, baring any injuries. Go ahead look at all of the teams. Look how many have better third basemen or young guys coming up. Look how many teams don't have the payroll, are not competing in 2008, or who do not have the MO to go get a $5 mil one year rental. Injury risk, one-year rental, $5 mil, very good defense but a league average bat (if healthy), and everyone knows we are desperate to unload him. Nobody buys that Fields is going back to AAA, if Williams at least gets someone to take his salary.

[Reddy]

Capuano?

 

Cap would get blown up in the cell - plus i doubt they'd make the trade anyway.

[Balta1701]

Cap would get blown up in the cell - plus i doubt they'd make the trade anyway.

They might if we threw in something else we were considering ridding ourselves of (MMac, for example).

[kageman129]

I'm definitely not good at predicting trades, however I hope we can bring back some good prospects for him. I mean, teams know that he can produce, if not as well as '06, they know what he brought in the postseason and with his D. When healthy he is good. I would like to see them trade Crede for at least 2 decent prospects.

 

I like the idea of getting Willits, but I doubt they could get that. Like others have said, maybe some A-ball or AA-ball players with possible upside. We just need to rid ourselves of Crede to make room for Fields. I can't wait to for the season, good or bad, I need to see some White Sox baseball!

Edited January 19, 2008 by kageman129

[WHITESOXRANDY]

Well, I have to believe that KW would've dumped Crede by now if he thought all he will be able to get for him healthy is a C prospect. He's obviously holding onto him and posturing that Fields might start the season at Charlotte because he believes that once he proves his health that he's going to get something good that's worth waiting for.

 

And, I believe that KW is basing this on conversations that he's had with other GM's. So, I have to and want to believe that the Sox can get a lot more for a guy who was on the verge of becoming an All-Star thirdbaseman before his back went out. If he's healthy, I think the Sox can get either a player that can be a contributor to this year's team or two very good prospects. I'd be stunned if they couldn't get Willits plus another player from the Angels.

 

I think the real question will be how many teams will need a thirdbaseman by mid-March. I don't believe for one second that Crede will be on the opeing day Sox roster.

[Texsox]

Sometimes not making a trade is the best trade. Personally, I'd like to see Crede resigned. I would not mind the IF corners covered for the next three seasons with Crede and Konerko.

[YASNY]

Sometimes not making a trade is the best trade. Personally, I'd like to see Crede resigned. I would not mind the IF corners covered for the next three seasons with Crede and Konerko.

 

I'd love that scenario to play out, but sadly, I think it's a pipe dream.

[maggliopipe]

I'm so pissed that they've painted themselves into a corner where they're going to be straight up giving away a fan favorite, gold glove caliber, clutch-hitting homegrown talent (not to mention my favorite player). I know it's a combination of management, injury, the emergence of Fields, and Crede's representation that it's gotten to this point, but it just sickens me that another team is going to get this for giving up a small pile of crap.

 

Since they gave up on the Fields in LF experiment last year, they're pretty limited with options. What I'd like to see happen is Joe proves himself healthy in spring training, then you TRY to work out a longer term extension. If he bites, see what you can get for Fields which is hopefully some young pitching.

[YASNY]

I'm so pissed that they've painted themselves into a corner where they're going to be straight up giving away a fan favorite, gold glove caliber, clutch-hitting homegrown talent (not to mention my favorite player). I know it's a combination of management, injury, the emergence of Fields, and Crede's representation that it's gotten to this point, but it just sickens me that another team is going to get this for giving up a small pile of crap.

 

Since they gave up on the Fields in LF experiment last year, they're pretty limited with options. What I'd like to see happen is Joe proves himself healthy in spring training, then you TRY to work out a longer term extension. If he bites, see what you can get for Fields which is hopefully some young pitching.

 

I am a huge Joe Crede fan, but given Feild's potential and the money differential for the next few years, Josh Fields makes more sense than Joe Crede.

[sircaffey]

I'm so pissed that they've painted themselves into a corner where they're going to be straight up giving away a fan favorite, gold glove caliber, clutch-hitting homegrown talent (not to mention my favorite player). I know it's a combination of management, injury, the emergence of Fields, and Crede's representation that it's gotten to this point, but it just sickens me that another team is going to get this for giving up a small pile of crap.

 

Since they gave up on the Fields in LF experiment last year, they're pretty limited with options. What I'd like to see happen is Joe proves himself healthy in spring training, then you TRY to work out a longer term extension. If he bites, see what you can get for Fields which is hopefully some young pitching.

 

Giving Joe Crede a long term contract extension in Spring Training would be a very very risky move. One I think would be a big mistake.

[santo=dorf]

I'm so pissed that they've painted themselves into a corner where they're going to be straight up giving away a fan favorite, gold glove caliber, clutch-hitting homegrown talent (not to mention my favorite player). I know it's a combination of management, injury, the emergence of Fields, and Crede's representation that it's gotten to this point, but it just sickens me that another team is going to get this for giving up a small pile of crap.

 

Since they gave up on the Fields in LF experiment last year, they're pretty limited with options. What I'd like to see happen is Joe proves himself healthy in spring training, then you TRY to work out a longer term extension. If he bites, see what you can get for Fields which is hopefully some young pitching.

So give a guy a big reward after he shows some signs of life in a month and a half of exhibition? Not too mention his reward isn't that high, he is coming off of back surgery, and he has a talented, younger, healthier, cheaper replacement to take over his job.

 

 

[Texsox]

I am a huge Joe Crede fan, but given Feild's potential and the money differential for the next few years, Josh Fields makes more sense than Joe Crede.

 

yep, cheap with potential.

 

Think of the marketing

 

These guys are Cheap!

They *may* be All-Stars ~~ Stay Tuned!

You Want All-Stars? Buy a Pair of Converse!

 

It's going to be a great day in baseball when nobody will sign a develped player. It will be a bunch of AAAA guys running around.

[Kenny Hates Prospects]

yep, cheap with potential.

 

Think of the marketing

 

These guys are Cheap!

They *may* be All-Stars ~~ Stay Tuned!

You Want All-Stars? Buy a Pair of Converse!

 

It's going to be a great day in baseball when nobody will sign a develped player. It will be a bunch of AAAA guys running around.

It'll be a sad day when our organization would rather toss a truckload of money at a veteran in the last year of his contract who is coming off major back surgery than play a stud prospect with 40HR potential.

 

Actually, nevermind. Any chance we can send Quentin to Triple A and sign Erstad to play the OF in his place? That would be a good move. He plays good D when he's working.

[maggliopipe]

So give a guy a big reward after he shows some signs of life in a month and a half of exhibition? Not too mention his reward isn't that high, he is coming off of back surgery, and he has a talented, younger, healthier, cheaper replacement to take over his job.

 

Granted, of course it's a risk. I'm saying you TRY to sign him to something reasonable... ya know, at least make an effort. If he and Boras aren't going to agree to something along the lines of a 3yr/$21-24mil (just throwing some numbers out) then you have to very reluctantly deal him for a bag of balls.

 

And you're not losing Fields for nothing, you try to deal him for a nice young SP. Say, a guy not coming off a major injury who is talented, young, healthier and cheaper than Bartolo Colon. I'd feel a lot better about the whole thing if I didn't value defense so strongly.