Who is the Best GM in Baseball?

[rangercal]

Note:

Bill Stoneman (angels) ,Larry Beinfest(marlins) and Terry Ryan (twins) would have been considered if they were still active.

Edited July 19, 2008 by knightni

[Steve9347]

I went with Epstein. He's currently the Championship Guru.

[rangercal]

I went with Epstein. He's currently the Championship Guru.

 

not a bad pick, he seems to mix vets with youth pretty well too.

[Balta1701]

You know, frankly, now that Schuerholz has retired...I'm not sure there's an obvious candidate for the top guy. The guys in Boston are good, but really, how hard is it to be a good GM with the #2 payroll in the league? All you have to do is out-do the Yankees. Beane is very good at winning as many years as he can at his salary level, but he's never pulled off the big prize and he spends an awful lot of time rebuilding. Shapiro had the Indians blow up in his face this year. KW had the Sox blow up in his face last year. Dombrowski's got a ton of money to play with and he's having a team blow up this year.

 

Out of that group...now that guys like Ryan, Schuerholz, Beinfest are gone...can anyone point to anyone who has a consistent, year to year record of putting together teams that consistently outplay where you think they should be based on their salary? Who never seem to have to go through a long rebuilding process?

[jackie hayes]

You know, frankly, now that Schuerholz has retired...I'm not sure there's an obvious candidate for the top guy. The guys in Boston are good, but really, how hard is it to be a good GM with the #2 payroll in the league? All you have to do is out-do the Yankees. Beane is very good at winning as many years as he can at his salary level, but he's never pulled off the big prize and he spends an awful lot of time rebuilding. Shapiro had the Indians blow up in his face this year. KW had the Sox blow up in his face last year. Dombrowski's got a ton of money to play with and he's having a team blow up this year.

 

Out of that group...now that guys like Ryan, Schuerholz, Beinfest are gone...can anyone point to anyone who has a consistent, year to year record of putting together teams that consistently outplay where you think they should be based on their salary? Who never seem to have to go through a long rebuilding process?

Ryan never went through a long rebuilding process? He took over in 1994, the Twins weren't good until 2001. The Marlins haven't had long rebuilding periods?

 

Beane is seen as always rebuilding, but it's not true that his teams have been off, then on. Before last season, they had 8 straight seasons of 87+ wins. And Epstein might have money to work with, but he's been a whiz with the draft. They've both been very good.

 

Kenny's been very good, too. I really am impressed with the scouting that has been able to single out guys like Thornton and Floyd when the numbers are...not promising. It's just the drafts that have been a problem.

[maggsmaggs]

I went Epstein. Terrific farm system in which he seems to use very well. 2 Championships in the last 4 years, too. Seems likeable, as well.

[Balta1701]

Beane is seen as always rebuilding, but it's not true that his teams have been off, then on. Before last season, they had 8 straight seasons of 87+ wins. And Epstein might have money to work with, but he's been a whiz with the draft. They've both been very good.

But here's the other thing about being a draft whiz...if your front office is also willing to go substantially over slot...becoming a draft whiz becomes a lot easier.

 

And if you're starting off at a point where you have Ortiz and Ramirez as part of your team...

[jackie hayes]

But here's the other thing about being a draft whiz...if your front office is also willing to go substantially over slot...becoming a draft whiz becomes a lot easier.

 

And if you're starting off at a point where you have Ortiz and Ramirez as part of your team...

Except they haven't been going substantially over slot...

 

This year, yes. In the past, not so much.

[witesoxfan]

Sabean not listed? I'm appalled.

[Gregory Pratt]

Dombrowski is excellent.

[daa84]

i went epstein, but frankly i think if beane had epsteins resources it would be beane....

 

i also think theo is just the face, or sort of a puppet for bill james and larry lucchino, but i still voted him because that organization does alot of things right and gets the best results

Edited July 20, 2008 by daa84

[CanOfCorn]

I went Pat Gillick...he built that 90's Blue Jays team (even though they were horrible for a long time). He built the Mariners and made them into the 116-46 team. He built up the Orioles. And he's doing a decent job with the Phillies, although I wonder if the game isn't passing him by just a little. Anyway, he got my vote.

[santo=dorf]

Dombrowski is excellent.

He's been on a cold streak and he usually gets burned on contract extensions.

[Balta1701]

I went Pat Gillick...he built that 90's Blue Jays team (even though they were horrible for a long time). He built the Mariners and made them into the 116-46 team. He built up the Orioles. And he's doing a decent job with the Phillies, although I wonder if the game isn't passing him by just a little. Anyway, he got my vote.

While yes, Gillick's moves were a part of that 115 win team...wasn't another big part of it that their 2nd baseman suddenly inflated in both physique and numbers? Can you give him credit for predicting which guys were going to start juicing big time and when?

[Texsox]

I think there should be some operational definition on "best GM". There are three key areas to consider,

 

1. Evaluation if a team's current talent
2. Plan to reach a championship caliber
3. Execution of the plan within organizational contraints

Is the GM keeping their good talent and dumping the problems. Kenny's dealing for Loiza (Part 1) and trading Loiza would be A++ examples.

 

Developing a plan. The Tigers had a three year plan and it seems as good as any in baseball.

 

Executing the plan. Again, the Tigers loaded the pieces, suffered a huge loss season as the pitchers developed, and look nasty for a while.

[DBAHO]

I would have gone Beinfest if he was there, the Marlins do a great job with their scouting and drafting each and every year, and for that team to be contending after they traded their best power hitter is quite amazing.

 

I would have said Josh Byrnes before the season, but he made a couple of bad decisions (trading Quentin and giving Byrnes that large 3 year extension) which has come back to hurt that team. He's still definitely a top 5 GM though IMHO.

 

Andrew Friedman's another guy who would be up there, but with all of the early draft picks the Rays have had, they were bound to click eventually. Still done a very good job though.

 

So I'll go with Epstein. Yes he has loads of $$$ to spend, and he's made some bad decisions (Julio Lufo 4 years $36M), but he keeps finding good players, and the Red Sox always do an excellent job at bringing in good young players that they draft and can give them excellent payroll flexibility.

[StrangeSox]

Anyone have an explanation for picking KW? Big payroll and only one playoff appearance in 8 years does scream "best GM" to me.

[westy21]

Epstien is just the face of the front office, theres many brilliant minds in that front office including Bill James.

 

Billy Beane is the best buisness man but not the smartest baseball mind.

 

I couldn't tell you who is the best GM but the Red Sox definatly have the best organization.

[Chisoxfn]

Josh Byrnes and Cashman should be on the list, imo. I also think Kevin Towers could be considered for the list (long term he's done a very good job in San Diego, even if they currently stink).

 

Based on whose on the list, I would list my order:

Epstein

Beane

Williams

 

Epstein wins because he's got two rings, has done a great job putting together a roster (using FA and player development). I realize he has more to work with than the rest of these guys but you still have to tip your cap.

 

Beane beats out Kenny because he's done so much with so little. I've long said Beane is overrated and its hard for me to put a guy this high who has not won a World Series but he has put together one hell of a run with limited resources and finds a way to consistently reload and rebuild.

 

Williams has done a very good job. However, this is heavily based on what he's done at the major league level. I believe he has a good vision for his ML roster but the minor league system has completely suffered under his helm and I could make a case for ranking Williams farther because of that.

 

Jocketty, Shapiro, and Dombrowski all rank closely with Williams.

 

 

[DBAHO]

I like what Doug Melvin has done with the Brewers also. He's put them into a real good position to win this season, and they always draft well so they can reload on the fly.

 

Excellent young group they have there obviously. The key is whether or not they can keep them all together.

[easyw]

Hard question - you have to take a number of factors into account, notably, the team's budget for talent, over which the GM has no control.

 

I'm no expert, but with my limited knowledge I'd generally agree on Beane and KW... and whomever runs the Twins. Its all about getting the biggest bang for your buck and Oakland, the White Sox and Minnesota seem to do quite well... You could probably throw Florida, Arizona and Detroit in the mix as well.

[santo=dorf]

Anyone have an explanation for picking KW? Big payroll and only one playoff appearance in 8 years does scream "best GM" to me.

It's got to be the stellar farm system

[rangercal]

It's got to be the stellar farm system

 

I voted for epstein. But I can see the love for Kenny. 1 WS trophy and only 1 season under .500. Results speak louder than unproven prospects.

Edited July 23, 2008 by rangercal

[StrangeSox]

I voted for epstein. But I can see the love for Kenny. 1 WS trophy and only 1 season under .500. Results speak louder than unproven prospects.

 

I count playoffs as results, not seasons above .500. Especially with how weak the central was for a long time. Is he horrible? No, but I really don't see how there's any way you can say he's the best.

[rangercal]

I count playoffs as results, not seasons above .500. Especially with how weak the central was for a long time. Is he horrible? No, but I really don't see how there's any way you can say he's the best.

I don't think it's Kennys fault for the Choke Jobs in '03,'04 and '06 .