Steve9347 Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Jun 19, 2009 -> 02:51 PM) Do the Cards need a medicore thirdbaseman? I wish Josh Fields were even close to mediocre. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justBLAZE Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Jun 19, 2009 -> 02:50 PM) Questions I would ask are: Where does he play? Who does he replace? He is a good story as far as his hitting is concerned, but I wonder why Rosenthal is evening mentioning Rick Ankiel? He plays LF/CF with Q shut down for the year and Podsednik being the leadoff man, we DFA Wise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JPN366 Posted June 19, 2009 Author Share Posted June 19, 2009 QUOTE (tommy @ Jun 19, 2009 -> 02:55 PM) He plays LF/CF with Q shut down for the year and Podsednik being the leadoff man, we DFA Wise. Wise is the roster vampire, it won't happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Special K Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 QUOTE (tommy @ Jun 19, 2009 -> 02:33 PM) What do we give up for him? At the very most, i'd be willing to put together a Quentin/Beckham package for Ankiel, and I'd be willing to pick up whatever is left on their contracts too. But that's it. 2009 StL 4 HR .307 .417 .724 .245 No thanks, BA is having a great year as he gets more PT. Once Quentin gets back, we're going to have too many outfileders as well. And no, i'm not looking to replace his stick with JD's when he leaves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 (edited) QUOTE (Special K @ Jun 19, 2009 -> 03:01 PM) At the very most, i'd be willing to put together a Quentin/Beckham package for Ankiel, and I'd be willing to pick up whatever is left on their contracts too. But that's it. 2009 StL 4 HR .307 .417 .724 .245 No thanks, BA is having a great year as he gets more PT. Once Quentin gets back, we're going to have too many outfileders as well. And no, i'm not looking to replace his stick with JD's when he leaves. A great year? You're kidding, right? And Ankiel, even in a year in which he's been injured, is still putting up comparable/better numbers than Brian. As I posted earlier, if you combine his 2007/2008 seasons, which come out to a full season worth of games (167 games to be exact), you get .270/36/110. Brian couldn't put up those numbers over a full season if his life (and the existence of mankind for that matter) depended on it. Edited June 19, 2009 by Jordan4life Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HoosierSox Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 QUOTE (Special K @ Jun 19, 2009 -> 03:01 PM) At the very most, i'd be willing to put together a Quentin/Beckham package for Ankiel, and I'd be willing to pick up whatever is left on their contracts too. But that's it. Quentin/Beckam for Ankiel.Lol. That would be a horrible deal for the sox. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjbabins Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 I think Ankiel is a Boras client....that's probably gonna work against us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 Ankiel has a great arm, but Anderson's range is better in center field. Ankiel's UZR before this season was always negative. His lowest was last year at -5, meaning he cost his team 5 runs in the field. Anderson's is barely above average, believe it or not. He has incredible range in right and left, but not so much in center. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 QUOTE (chw42 @ Jun 19, 2009 -> 03:15 PM) Ankiel has a great arm, but Anderson's range is better in center field. Ankiel's UZR before this season was always negative. His lowest was last year at -5, meaning he cost his team 5 runs in the field. Anderson's is barely above average, believe it or not. He has incredible range in right and left, but not so much in center. -5? Wow. I only get to see him when they play the Cubs. He always play a pretty damn good CF when I get a chance to watch him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 (edited) QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Jun 19, 2009 -> 03:17 PM) -5? Wow. I only get to see him when they play the Cubs. He always play a pretty damn good CF when I get a chance to watch him. I was quite surprised too considering that accounts his arm strength into it. I was also quite surprised that BA's UZR wasn't better. He actually had a horrible UZR back in 2006 and 2007. Here's what's sort of funny. Jerry Owens, even with his crappy ass arm, had a UZR/150 of 12.8. That's really, really good. Dewayne Wise is better defensively in center than Brian Anderson, according to UZR. He's well above average in left and above average in center. Scott Podsednik is actually an above average left fielder. His career mark UZR in left is 1.4. Just don't put him in center field, he's real bad. Rob Mackowiak was indeed terrible in center. He had a UZR of -5.6 in 2006 as a CF. Put that over a span of 150 games and it's -16.2. It also appears that Aaron Rowand has lost a couple of steps after crashing into the wall in Philadelphia back in 2006. He had a -21 last year in terms of Plus/Minus in San Francisco when he accumulated a +31 from 2004-2006. Rowand had a UZR of -6.1 in San Francisco last season. Looks like the large outfield is making A-Row look bad. And for those of you who said that BA is a better center field than Rowand - UZR says you're wrong. I guess saber stats make sense a lot. But they make me scratch my head at times. Edited June 19, 2009 by chw42 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rangercal Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 QUOTE (HoosierSox @ Jun 19, 2009 -> 04:09 PM) Quentin/Beckam for Ankiel.Lol. That would be a horrible deal for the sox. He was Kidding. I hope he was Kidding about BA having a great year too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 QUOTE (rangercal @ Jun 19, 2009 -> 03:33 PM) He was Kidding. I hope he was Kidding about BA having a great year too. I don't know. Sounds like some honest words. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reddy Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 QUOTE (Special K @ Jun 19, 2009 -> 03:01 PM) At the very most, i'd be willing to put together a Quentin/Beckham package for Ankiel, and I'd be willing to pick up whatever is left on their contracts too. But that's it. I guess that's where the "special" in Special K comes from huh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Special K Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 QUOTE (Reddy @ Jun 19, 2009 -> 03:45 PM) I guess that's where the "special" in Special K comes from huh? Alright. Fine. I'd throw in Poreda too along with Beckham and Quentin to get Ankiel. But that is absolutely it, I wouldn't want to mortgage our future for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rangercal Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 QUOTE (Reddy @ Jun 19, 2009 -> 04:45 PM) I guess that's where the "special" in Special K comes from huh? you didn't read the rest of his post? ahh... Forget it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justBLAZE Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 QUOTE (Special K @ Jun 19, 2009 -> 04:06 PM) Alright. Fine. I'd throw in Poreda too along with Beckham and Quentin to get Ankiel. But that is absolutely it, I wouldn't want to mortgage our future for him. Lay off the rocks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearSox Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 I'd love to get Ankiel. He's a very solid defender with a strong arm and can play any of the 3 OF spots, has enough pop to play in a corner spot, and has good speed. If we get him and feel we can sign for another 2-3 years fairly cheap, he'd give us another option in CF and we wouldn't have to rush Danks if he isn't ready. You put him in CF for this year and go from there. Perhaps maybe something like Brian Anderson and a pitching prospect would get the deal done. They could use BA as a 4th OF and defensive replacement. Also, maybe they'd even be interested in Fields, their other 3B aren't doing much better and Wallace has been struggling at AAA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Special K Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 QUOTE (rangercal @ Jun 19, 2009 -> 04:06 PM) you didn't read the rest of his post? ahh... Forget it. Obviously that post was a joke for those of you with a great sense of sarcasm. In all honesty though, BA is starting to come around. He had a solid Cubs series, and I think as he gets more playing time he will only improve. My thoughts on Ankiel are this... He had a real good last year, but you can't combine numbers the guy had from one season with another and say he's great, or go ahead and combine Field's numbers from '07 with this year, and you're looking at a guy whose hit 25 home runs... obviously that is not very indicative of how he has been playing. With that being said, I would rather keep what we've got going now, rather than mixing it up and waiting for Ozzie to figure out what works, b/c it seems to take him a while to do that, i.e. D-Wise leading off and starting. We've also been playing better lately, and i think once it stays warm, these old men on our squad will start heating up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chisoxfn Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 QUOTE (chw42 @ Jun 19, 2009 -> 01:31 PM) I was quite surprised too considering that accounts his arm strength into it. I was also quite surprised that BA's UZR wasn't better. He actually had a horrible UZR back in 2006 and 2007. Here's what's sort of funny. Jerry Owens, even with his crappy ass arm, had a UZR/150 of 12.8. That's really, really good. Dewayne Wise is better defensively in center than Brian Anderson, according to UZR. He's well above average in left and above average in center. Scott Podsednik is actually an above average left fielder. His career mark UZR in left is 1.4. Just don't put him in center field, he's real bad. Rob Mackowiak was indeed terrible in center. He had a UZR of -5.6 in 2006 as a CF. Put that over a span of 150 games and it's -16.2. It also appears that Aaron Rowand has lost a couple of steps after crashing into the wall in Philadelphia back in 2006. He had a -21 last year in terms of Plus/Minus in San Francisco when he accumulated a +31 from 2004-2006. Rowand had a UZR of -6.1 in San Francisco last season. Looks like the large outfield is making A-Row look bad. And for those of you who said that BA is a better center field than Rowand - UZR says you're wrong. I guess saber stats make sense a lot. But they make me scratch my head at times. That tells me that UZR is a garbage stat or one that needs other data to become valuable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jenksycat Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 QUOTE (chw42 @ Jun 19, 2009 -> 03:31 PM) Jerry Owens, even with his crappy ass arm, had a UZR/150 of 12.8. That's really, really good. Dewayne Wise is better defensively in center than Brian Anderson, according to UZR. He's well above average in left and above average in center. All I need to read to know that it is a completely worthless stat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted June 19, 2009 Share Posted June 19, 2009 QUOTE (Jenksy Cat @ Jun 19, 2009 -> 05:06 PM) All I need to read to know that it is a completely worthless stat. Jerry Owens has very good range in the outfield. He was a +11 in Plus/Minus in 2007 in center field, which made him one of the leaders that year among all center fielders. So it's not only UZR saying he's a good outfielder. Sabermetric defensive stats make sense a lot of the time. Sure, we all think that Brian Anderson is god in center field (including myself), but are we there to watch every single play of every single team other than the White Sox? Obviously, no. That's how Plus/Minus is calculated. They watch every single play of the season and give players a rating. UZR is somewhat similar, it just has a lot of different variables in it. Most of the time, UZR and Plus/Minus correlate a lot. I like to think that Plus/Minus is a great system and if it's a great system and UZR usually shows the same results, then UZR is also a trustworthy stat. I would use Plus/Minus more often, but UZR updates every day. I need to pay to see Plus/Minus and it comes out after the season is pretty much over. If you're wondering what factors go into UZR - look here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knightni Posted June 20, 2009 Share Posted June 20, 2009 Offer to send Linebrink back to the NL. Tell him it's easier there. Linebrink for Ankiel anyone? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearSox Posted June 20, 2009 Share Posted June 20, 2009 QUOTE (knightni @ Jun 19, 2009 -> 07:23 PM) Offer to send Linebrink back to the NL. Tell him it's easier there. Linebrink for Ankiel anyone? If they took on the rest of Linebrink's contract, hell yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BearSox Posted June 20, 2009 Share Posted June 20, 2009 QUOTE (chw42 @ Jun 19, 2009 -> 05:28 PM) Jerry Owens has very good range in the outfield. He was a +11 in Plus/Minus in 2007 in center field, which made him one of the leaders that year among all center fielders. So it's not only UZR saying he's a good outfielder. Sabermetric defensive stats make sense a lot of the time. Sure, we all think that Brian Anderson is god in center field (including myself), but are we there to watch every single play of every single team other than the White Sox? Obviously, no. That's how Plus/Minus is calculated. They watch every single play of the season and give players a rating. UZR is somewhat similar, it just has a lot of different variables in it. Most of the time, UZR and Plus/Minus correlate a lot. I like to think that Plus/Minus is a great system and if it's a great system and UZR usually shows the same results, then UZR is also a trustworthy stat. I would use Plus/Minus more often, but UZR updates every day. I need to pay to see Plus/Minus and it comes out after the season is pretty much over. If you're wondering what factors go into UZR - look here. Jerry Owens was one of the worst defensive outfielders I've seen, and no stat is gonna convince me other wise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted June 20, 2009 Share Posted June 20, 2009 (edited) QUOTE (BearSox @ Jun 19, 2009 -> 07:47 PM) Jerry Owens was one of the worst defensive outfielders I've seen, and no stat is gonna convince me other wise. I said the exact same thing when I first saw the stat of Plus/Minus the very first time. It does have its flaws, but it's a lot less flawed than a lot of other defensive stats out there. Because seriously, what other stat are you going to use to prove that somebody good is on defense? Are you just going to tell the other person you're having a discussion with that I watch him everyday and he sucks? Trust me, I've tried that. But numbers ultimately tell the truth. http://www.fieldingbible.com/ - There's an overview of how they calculate the numbers and how they can prove that it does indeed work. Edited June 20, 2009 by chw42 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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