Melissa1334 Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 QUOTE (SoxAce @ Dec 15, 2009 -> 10:32 PM) I would say a better comparison to Pierre in regards to a leadoff hitter was his old teammate and pretty much a leadoff hitter his whole career.. Luis Castillo and Castillo still walks a bit more but also K's a bit more. I would take Castillo over Pierre anyday. his stats from last yr werent that bad, i wonder why they want to dump him so bad, must be a money issue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monomach Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 I would say a better comparison to Pierre in regards to a leadoff hitter was his old teammate and pretty much a leadoff hitter his whole career.. Luis Castillo and Castillo still walks a bit more but also K's a bit more. I would take Castillo over Pierre anyday. Castillo qalks a LOT more than Pierre. A real comparison would be something like Podsednik or Gathright. Or Willy Taveras. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve9347 Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 I think Pierre will bring a winning attitude to this club. I hope Kenny is thinking big for the DH (ie Dunn) if so, this team could be really dangerous if healthy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YonderLaroche Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 I'm done on this... but I'd take him over Pods, Willie Tavarez, CoCo Crisp, or any other crap leadoff guy we've tried to get. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Dec 15, 2009 -> 10:35 PM) I think Pierre will bring a winning attitude to this club. I hope Kenny is thinking big for the DH (ie Dunn) if so, this team could be really dangerous if healthy. Give me Dunn or Adrian like I said.. I'll stomach Pierre as the leadoff guy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalapse Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 QUOTE (b-Rye @ Dec 15, 2009 -> 10:31 PM) I'm just saying he's a good leadoff man that will make things happen. He's outperformed the '05 Pods his whole career and we won a world series with pods that year. He will make things happen and that will help the 2,3,4,5 hitters... Scott Podsednik was on base 35% of the time in '05, the chances of Juan Pierre approaching that are very, very poor based on his performance over the past 4 seasons. What would help the middle of the lineup the most would be seeing Juan Pierre on base an awful lot next year, unfortunately that's not all that likely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monomach Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 I'm done on this... but I'd take him over Pods, Willie Tavarez, CoCo Crisp, or any other crap leadoff guy we've tried to get. You'd take him over his statistical twins is what you're saying. Does he keep his uniform cleaner or something? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve9347 Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 QUOTE (Kalapse @ Dec 15, 2009 -> 10:37 PM) Scott Podsednik was on base 35% of the time in '05, the chances of Juan Pierre approaching that are very, very poor based on his performance over the past 4 seasons. What would help the middle of the lineup the most would be seeing Juan Pierre on base an awful lot next year, unfortunately that's not all that likely. Wasn't he on base 37% of the time last year? Doesn't he have a career OBP of 35%? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalapse Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 QUOTE (Melissa1334 @ Dec 15, 2009 -> 10:35 PM) his stats from last yr werent that bad, i wonder why they want to dump him so bad, must be a money issue He's difficult in the clubhouse and is quite overpaid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 QUOTE (monomach @ Dec 15, 2009 -> 10:35 PM) Castillo qalks a LOT more than Pierre. A real comparison would be something like Podsednik or Gathright. Or Willy Taveras. Naw Pods doesn't hit for enough average and the other two K more, though if Gathright had enough PA... I think that wouldn't be a bad comparison. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve9347 Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 QUOTE (monomach @ Dec 15, 2009 -> 10:38 PM) You'd take him over his statistical twins is what you're saying. Does he keep his uniform cleaner or something? Since when does Willy Taveras keep his OBP over .275?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YonderLaroche Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 QUOTE (monomach @ Dec 15, 2009 -> 10:38 PM) You'd take him over his statistical twins is what you're saying. Does he keep his uniform cleaner or something? LOL Tavarez/Gathright hit about .240 .275 OBP half the stolen bases, half the bunts, way less runs triples doubles and way more strikeouts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalapse Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Dec 15, 2009 -> 10:39 PM) Wasn't he on base 37% of the time last year? Doesn't he have a career OBP of 35%? 36.5% thanks to his insane May, his numbers from June through September were roughly the same as the past 4 years: .290 AVG, .330 OBP, .690 OPS. So what's more likely? He duplicates his fluky numbers from last year or he matches the numbers he put up over the 4 years going into '09? (.286/.329/.359/.688 in 2600 PA, .331 was his high OBP) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monomach Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 Here's a Dodger fan who explains some more about how Juan Pierre sucks: http://www.truebluela.com/2009/12/15/12015...ed-to-white-sox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 (edited) QUOTE (Kalapse @ Dec 15, 2009 -> 10:39 PM) He's very difficult in the clubhouse and is quite overpaid. I know he's had his little issue in the past.. but he is?! I didn't know that, I kept hearing he was a constant pro when his playing time got reduced, and didn't pout or anything about that. Edited December 16, 2009 by SoxAce Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
knightni Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 QUOTE (BigSqwert @ Dec 15, 2009 -> 11:18 PM) If Pierre could consistently hit in the .350-.360 range then no one will complain about the lack of walks. ...and he'd be inducted into the hall of fame. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monomach Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 Since when does Willy Taveras keep his OBP over .275?? LOL Tavarez/Gathright hit about .240 .275 OBP half the stolen bases, half the bunts, way less runs triples doubles and way more strikeouts. You're both cherry picking one year. If we play that game, Andruw Jones should start because he'll hit 50+ homers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalapse Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 Placido Polanco is about as close as you'll find to Pierre in terms of slash stats. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YonderLaroche Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 QUOTE (monomach @ Dec 15, 2009 -> 10:44 PM) You're both cherry picking one year. If we play that game, Andruw Jones should start because he'll hit 50+ homers. Gathrights never had a good season. Tavarez had a few decent seasons. Pierre has been consistent ever freaking year. who would u rather have than pierre at this point the sox could get? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve9347 Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 QUOTE (Kalapse @ Dec 15, 2009 -> 10:41 PM) 36.5% thanks to his insane May, his numbers from June through September were roughly the same as the past 4 years: .290 AVG, .330 OBP, .690 OPS. So what's more likely? He duplicates his fluky numbers from last year or he matches the numbers he put up over the 4 years going into '09? (.286/.329/.359/.688 in 2600 PA, .331 was his high OBP) Given regular playing time, I expect his career OBP at least for this season... 35%. Add solid steals and hide his ass in left, and I'm pretty happy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve9347 Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 QUOTE (monomach @ Dec 15, 2009 -> 10:44 PM) You're both cherry picking one year. If we play that game, Andruw Jones should start because he'll hit 50+ homers. You're completely wrong. Taveras did that LAST YEAR. Talking about his recent success and then comparing it to the Jones of 2003 makes zero sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoxAce Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 QUOTE (monomach @ Dec 15, 2009 -> 10:44 PM) You're both cherry picking one year. If we play that game, Andruw Jones should start because he'll hit 50+ homers. Uh... no they are right. I'm not a fan of Pierre like you, but c'mon, comparing him to those two is ridiculous. I can't even fault Gathright cause he's really never had 500 abs in a season (then again.. there's a reason for that) but Tavares has had OBPs of .325, .333, .367, .308, .275 and only in 07 is when he got less than 400 abs (and guess what... that was his .367 OBP year) Pierre is the much better player than those two bums. (and that is not saying much) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalapse Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Dec 15, 2009 -> 10:46 PM) Given regular playing time, I expect his career OBP at least for this season... 35%. Add solid steals and hide his ass in left, and I'm pretty happy. Why? Aside from his bizarre '09 season he hasn't done anything like that since '04 and now he's moving to a small AL ballpark where it'll be harder for any of his soft bloopers to fall and more difficult to find gaps if anything he could struggle even more than he has in recent years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monomach Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 You're completely wrong. Taveras did that LAST YEAR. Talking about his recent success and then comparing it to the Jones of 2003 makes zero sense. That's not how it works. Pierre had what was basically a career year (which is still not all that great). Obviously, these things fluctuate. Otherwise, you have to completely ignore Carlos Quentin of 2008 because by that reasoning now he sucks and should be released. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YonderLaroche Posted December 16, 2009 Share Posted December 16, 2009 (edited) QUOTE (monomach @ Dec 15, 2009 -> 10:50 PM) That's not how it works. Pierre had what was basically a career year (which is still not all that great). Obviously, these things fluctuate. Otherwise, you have to completely ignore Carlos Quentin of 2008 because by that reasoning now he sucks and should be released. A career year?? Look at his stats because every year is about the same except for a few great years in FL. CQ has only played two MLB full seasons, and he was injured last year for the most part. 2008 was on par with his healthy minor league seasons. U are a moron. Edited December 16, 2009 by b-Rye Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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