Finding a LH/Switch hitting OFer

[Jerksticks]

I wouldn't mind getting Peavy and then flipping him at the deadline.

Let the cubs do this. I want to win damnit. Too early to concede SP18

[BlackSox13]

If we did that (and it's interesting), we'd need to trade Alexei. We've got to give some of these young IFs some room.

I do like the idea of a Vic-Dom Brown change of scenery. I actually think Brown could be pretty good.

I'm still intrigued with that FAn-Graphs list. Noesi and Danks were ranked in the top 80 starters. That's close to top 1/2, right? (30 teams x 5 starters per team). So they are average. It sure didn't feel that way.

Peavy did pretty well with the Giants, but it sure looked like he was all shot when with the Red Sox.

 

I still like my Danks bros plan better; although not as much as the Danks+Flowers for Puig idea above.

Problem with trading Alexei is none of Sanchez, Johnson, or Semien are natural short stops so the defense will surely take a hit. Its likely Sanchez and Johnson could use a bit more time in Charlotte anyway and the Sox could always trade Gillaspie to put Semien at 3B. Brown would be the DH and now the Sox just need to find a LH left fielder and the offense would be set, on paper anyway. Could shift Alexei to 2B and play Rollins at SS since his defense is better anyway. The defense up the middle ( Rollins, Ramirez, Eaton) would be very good and what's needed for a contender.

 

Keep in mind that the Phillies payroll is about tapped so if the Sox are to unload Danks on Philly, the Sox will have to take some payroll off of the Phillies.

 

Another idea would be if the Philly traded Cliff Lee, Domonic Brown and some cash to the Sox for John Danks and Tank. Unless Lee pitches 200 innings in 2015 his vesting option for 2016 will not kick in therefore making a free agent after the 2015 season so the Sox would only be on the hook for one year with Lee. Should Lee pitch 200 innings, something can be put in the trade agreement that Philly would have to kick in a few bucks towards Lee's 2016 salary.

 

Either way, if the Sox were to make a trade with Philly, the Sox would have to take some salary off of the Philly payroll. I will say that a healthy Cliff Lee would help the Sox rotation and bridge the gap to Montas/ Danish.

 

A healthy rotation of Sale, Lee, Q, Noesi, Rodon sounds pretty damn good to me.

 

Philly is desperate and the Sox have room so it could be a fit. Maybe even Lee, Brown and Rollins for John Danks, Tank and one of Semien/ Johnson/ Sanchez. I don't know if that's close, just throwing it out there.

 

 

[LDF]

I wouldn't mind getting Peavy and then flipping him at the deadline.

 

Peavy, it might be an interesting piece. the only problem, at least for me is the cost.

 

re: Philly, the cost to get Lee would be too high in prospects to make that trade. during

the trading deadline, Philly was asking for a huge rtn. I don't think they are in that much

of a dire need to trade.

[BlackSox13]

Peavy, it might be an interesting piece. the only problem, at least for me is the cost.

 

re: Philly, the cost to get Lee would be too high in prospects to make that trade. during

the trading deadline, Philly was asking for a huge rtn. I don't think they are in that much

of a dire need to trade.

The combo of Lee's age (36), 2014 injury ( only 81IP in 2014), salary ( 25M) and the Phillies being desperate to open up room in their payroll hurt Lee's value a lot. Essentially , Lee would be more along the lines of a salary dump but that doesn't mean he's worth nothing, just not as much as one might think.

 

Its been speculated that the Phillies would prefer to trade the likes of Lee, Howard, Papelbon to give their payroll some space. None of which hold the value they once did due to injury/ performance/ salary reasons.

 

Depending on the players involved coming from Philly, I don't think it would too costly prospect wise from the Sox.

Edited October 12, 2014 by StRoostifer

[lasttriptotulsa]

Your RHSP for the 2015 White Sox is starting for San Fran tonight

 

I would be all for this especially because it won't cost a draft pick.

[TheFutureIsNear]

unless it was for discipline matters. just throwing that out there. I am prob wrong.

 

edit: according to cbs sports, he is out due to a hand injury.

 

Nah I'm local to the philly area and he lost a ton of AB's when they signed Grady Sizemore. As silly as that sounds....Brown was healthy enough

[caulfield12]

No chance Philli can take on more salary without relieving some salary. Dominic Brown is goes to get a raise this year as he enters his first year of arbitration so its quite possible Philly would not mind moving him. I can see a possibility of something like John Danks and Tank for Domonic Brown and Jimmy Rollins. The Sox would move Rollins to second and bat him second which buys some development time for the Sox future 2B. Rollins should bring good defense to second as well as a LH bat, good contact and base stealing potential to the two hole in the batting order.

 

Heck, I'd be willing to send money with Danks and Tank to be sure a deal could be done, provided Philly was interested of course.

 

Fwiw, Rollins is owed 11M for 2015 and is FA after the 2015 season is over.

 

Also want to add. I would be fine with the Sox kicking the tires on Peavy. Sale, Q, Peavy, Rodon, Noesi looks better than the 2014 rotation. s***, I really like how that looks!

 

 

Why would we want Rollins exactly?

 

Because you think he'd be easier to trade than Danks?

 

Because all indications are they want to give that position to Micah Johnson at some point next season.

[BlackSox13]

Why would we want Rollins exactly?

 

Because you think he'd be easier to trade than Danks?

 

Because all indications are they want to give that position to Micah Johnson at some point next season.

Rollins is a defensive upgrade.

 

Easier to trade than Danks? Not sure what you mean by that...

 

If by indicators you Scott Merkin declaring Johnson the 2B of 2015, I'd take that with a huge grain of salt until ST is over. As I've already explained, Rollins instantly improves the defense and gives the lineup a number two hitter while allowing Johnson to improve his defense at Charlotte for one more season. Rollins is a FA at the end of 2015 so hopefully Johnson, Sanchez or even Anderson ( if he doesn't stick at SS) will be ready for the 2016 season.

[caulfield12]

Rollins is a defensive upgrade.

 

Easier to trade than Danks? Not sure what you mean by that...

 

If by indicators you Scott Merkin declaring Johnson the 2B of 2015, I'd take that with a huge grain of salt until ST is over. As I've already explained, Rollins instantly improves the defense and gives the lineup a number two hitter while allowing Johnson to improve his defense at Charlotte for one more season. Rollins is a FA at the end of 2015 so hopefully Johnson, Sanchez or even Anderson ( if he doesn't stick at SS) will be ready for the 2016 season.

 

 

I mean, that you're banking on Rolins being traded at midseason next year...or you're "all in" and keeping him for the remainder of 2015 (with accompanying moves to improve starting rotation, DH, bullpen)?

 

Basically, you believe if the team underperforms again that Rollins with 2-3 months on his contract would be a lot easier to trade than Danks with 1 year and 2-3 months, yes?

 

And in this scenario, you're moving Alexei Ramirez to 2B? Once again, to compete in 2015, or to "hold the position/s" for Micah Johnson/Semien/Sanchez one more year?

[BlackSox13]

I mean, that you're banking on Rolins being traded at midseason next year...or you're "all in" and keeping him for the remainder of 2015 (with accompanying moves to improve starting rotation, DH, bullpen)?

 

Basically, you believe if the team underperforms again that Rollins with 2-3 months on his contract would be a lot easier to trade than Danks with 1 year and 2-3 months, yes?

 

And in this scenario, you're moving Alexei Ramirez to 2B? Once again, to compete in 2015, or to "hold the position/s" for Micah Johnson/Semien/Sanchez one more year?

Good grief Caulfield. I've explained this in previous posts and am not about to rewrite again. Read the last few pages and you will know why it was brought up in the first place. Its not that difficult, really.

[caulfield12]

Good grief Caulfield. I've explained this in previous posts and am not about to rewrite again. Read the last few pages and you will know why it was brought up in the first place. Its not that difficult, really.

 

 

 

Almost every defensive metric out there has Ramirez and Rollins with similar numbers. I think it would be very disruptive to move Alexei at this point in his career, and if you're going to move Ramirez, it's devaluing him a bit heading into 2016, which theoretically would be his last season with the Sox, since we'd hold an option on him but not Rollins (unless you were then going to turn around and move Ramirez back to SS in 2016).

 

If you're doing to do anything, it would be the opposite...Rollins at 2B, with Ramirez at SS. Although you'd definitely have to talk to both players before making such a move. There's a pretty good chance (like with Michael Young) that there would be a lot of resistance to a position change from both the players and their agents, unless they were making the change for the sake of a championship or playoff caliber team.

[TheFutureIsNear]

Rollins is a defensive upgrade.

 

Easier to trade than Danks? Not sure what you mean by that...

 

If by indicators you Scott Merkin declaring Johnson the 2B of 2015, I'd take that with a huge grain of salt until ST is over. As I've already explained, Rollins instantly improves the defense and gives the lineup a number two hitter while allowing Johnson to improve his defense at Charlotte for one more season. Rollins is a FA at the end of 2015 so hopefully Johnson, Sanchez or even Anderson ( if he doesn't stick at SS) will be ready for the 2016 season.

 

 

Again, as someone who is local to the philly area and gets stuck watching a good amount of Phillies games I can assure Rollins sucks and we shouldn't want anything to do with him. Why would you want an expensive 36 year old who struggles to hit .250/3.20?? That and he is a bit of a diva, he'd probably have an attitude if he came here and played 2B and hit at the bottom of the lineup.

[BlackSox13]

You guys are missing the point in all this. 1- I said from the beginning that I was throwing s*** out there. 2- a deal was proposed by another poster that suggested both Danks brothers be sent to Philli.

 

The Phillies payroll is pretty well maxed last I read so in order for Philli to take on payroll, they would have to trade payroll as well. That's why I threw the names of Rollins and Lee into the mix. The proposed trade of John/Jordan Danks for Domonic Brown just isn't going to happen. I could see Danks and Tank as a possibility IF the Sox were willing to take on a higher salary player or two from Philli.

 

Let me stress again, just throwing s*** out there. There are better players out there to go after than Brown, I'm just entertaining the possibility is all.

[Kyyle23]

You guys are missing the point in all this. 1- I said from the beginning that I was throwing s*** out there. 2- a deal was proposed by another poster that suggested both Danks brothers be sent to Philli.

 

The Phillies payroll is pretty well maxed last I read so in order for Philli to take on payroll, they would have to trade payroll as well. That's why I threw the names of Rollins and Lee into the mix. The proposed trade of John/Jordan Danks for Domonic Brown just isn't going to happen. I could see Danks and Tank as a possibility IF the Sox were willing to take on a higher salary player or two from Philli.

 

Let me stress again, just throwing s*** out there. There are better players out there to go after than Brown, I'm just entertaining the possibility is all.

 

please explain why three more times. Use double space and college rule paper, make sure you spell check and please cite all of your sources.

 

Papers will be graded within 3 minutes of turn in

[Jerksticks]

You guys are missing the point in all this. 1- I said from the beginning that I was throwing s*** out there. 2- a deal was proposed by another poster that suggested both Danks brothers be sent to Philli.

 

The Phillies payroll is pretty well maxed last I read so in order for Philli to take on payroll, they would have to trade payroll as well. That's why I threw the names of Rollins and Lee into the mix. The proposed trade of John/Jordan Danks for Domonic Brown just isn't going to happen. I could see Danks and Tank as a possibility IF the Sox were willing to take on a higher salary player or two from Philli.

 

Let me stress again, just throwing s*** out there. There are better players out there to go after than Brown, I'm just entertaining the possibility is all.

I don't really understand how Rollins is your top target this offseason with all our other holes and weaknesses. But go ahead it's a free country. If you think Rollins is the single missing piece, preach on.

[BlackSox13]

please explain why three more times. Use double space and college rule paper, make sure you spell check and please cite all of your sources.

 

Papers will be graded within 3 minutes of turn in

Oh s***, that's funny. Good one!

I don't really understand how Rollins is your top target this offseason with all our other holes and weaknesses. But go ahead it's a free country. If you think Rollins is the single missing piece, preach on.

If you think Rollins is my top target then you don't read very well and should thinking because you're not very good at it because not once have I said Rollins is my top target, in fact he isn't.

[Jerksticks]

I was joking Rooster! ??

[Kyyle23]

Oh s***, that's funny. Good one!

 

If you think Rollins is my top target then you don't read very well and should thinking because you're not very good at it because not once have I said Rollins is my top target, in fact he isn't.

 

F+

 

Reason for Grade: Missing the joke from Jerksticks

[BlackSox13]

I was joking Rooster! ??

 

 

F+

 

Reason for Grade: Missing the joke from Jerksticks

My bad dudes. Use the emoticons or green, or something. Throw me a fricken bone here. I do appreciate the + though.

 

That said, I will do my best to improve my grade.

[TheFutureIsNear]

You guys are missing the point in all this. 1- I said from the beginning that I was throwing s*** out there. 2- a deal was proposed by another poster that suggested both Danks brothers be sent to Philli.

 

The Phillies payroll is pretty well maxed last I read so in order for Philli to take on payroll, they would have to trade payroll as well. That's why I threw the names of Rollins and Lee into the mix. The proposed trade of John/Jordan Danks for Domonic Brown just isn't going to happen. I could see Danks and Tank as a possibility IF the Sox were willing to take on a higher salary player or two from Philli.

 

Let me stress again, just throwing s*** out there. There are better players out there to go after than Brown, I'm just entertaining the possibility is all.

 

I hear you on just throwing s**** out...that's what the off season is for. Although to crush your trade just a little more I'll throw in that Rollins has a no trade clause and I don't think Chicago is where he wants to end his career.

 

When I suggested Brown I was thinking a failed prospect for failed prospect type of deal that is always popular in the MLB. Like a Dom Brown for Erik Johnson and Trayce Thompson type of deal. Idk, maybe the Phillies laugh at that deal, but it just seems to me that the organization and coach are over him and ready to move on. Or at lest I can assure you that's the fan bases mindset from listening to sports talk radio here in Philly.

[BlackSox13]

I hear you on just throwing s**** out...that's what the off season is for. Although to crush your trade just a little more I'll throw in that Rollins has a no trade clause and I don't think Chicago is where he wants to end his career.

 

When I suggested Brown I was thinking a failed prospect for failed prospect type of deal that is always popular in the MLB. Like a Dom Brown for Erik Johnson and Trayce Thompson type of deal. Idk, maybe the Phillies laugh at that deal, but it just seems to me that the organization and coach are over him and ready to move on. Or at lest I can assure you that's the fan bases mindset from listening to sports talk radio here in Philly.

I didn't know/think about Rollins NTC so your insight from living in the area is very helpful and I appreciate it. Back to the s*** throwing drawing board I guess.

 

Now your idea of failed prospects swap makes far more sense than trying to dump John Danks and his salary onto a team that's pretty much tapped at this point.

 

Im thinking that since Brown is about to hit arbitration and get raise, his 2015 salary will be closer to Tank's so maybe a Tank for Brown could be a possibility seeing how neither has lived up to expectations so far. I don't know if Philly would have interest in Tank or not? You would have a better idea than I would.

[TheFutureIsNear]

I didn't know/think about Rollins NTC so your insight from living in the area is very helpful and I appreciate it. Back to the s*** throwing drawing board I guess.

 

Now your idea of failed prospects swap makes far more sense than trying to dump John Danks and his salary onto a team that's pretty much tapped at this point.

 

Im thinking that since Brown is about to hit arbitration and get raise, his 2015 salary will be closer to Tank's so maybe a Tank for Brown could be a possibility seeing how neither has lived up to expectations so far. I don't know if Philly would have interest in Tank or not? You would have a better idea than I would.

 

Yeah people need to realize that no one actually wants Danks, we are most likely stuck with that contract.

 

I wish I could tell you what Ruben Amaro is thinking, but I'm fairly sure he doesn't even know. That team and farm system is such a mess. The only thing I could say that would make the Tank trade make sense is that the Phillies are indeed LH heavy at the top of their order, so its possible that a new face that hits RH would make some sense for them from that standpoint.

[ILMOU]

Yeah people need to realize that no one actually wants Danks, we are most likely stuck with that contract.

Agreed that it's unrealistic to expect Danks to be tradeable currently, unless it's a painful Teahen-style riddance. Hopeful that he plays his way into tradability early next season, and that RH seizes any opportunity.

[southsider2k5]

Agreed that it's unrealistic to expect Danks to be tradeable currently, unless it's a painful Teahen-style riddance. Hopeful that he plays his way into tradability early next season, and that RH seizes any opportunity.

 

The only way we trade Danks is either if the Sox pick up a ton of salary (um, lol) or bring back a bad contract in return.

 

Tell me which of those you prefer, and then I will consider a proposal containing the idea that John Danks won't be back next as "serious".

 

The Sox history shows the biggest possibility is that the Sox do exactly what is bolded above, as they have shown a history to do when a guy isn't a problem in the clubhouse in addition to sucking.

[witesoxfan]

The only way we trade Danks is either if the Sox pick up a ton of salary (um, lol) or bring back a bad contract in return.

 

Tell me which of those you prefer, and then I will consider a proposal containing the idea that John Danks won't be back next as "serious".

 

The Sox history shows the biggest possibility is that the Sox do exactly what is bolded above, as they have shown a history to do when a guy isn't a problem in the clubhouse in addition to sucking.

 

Frankly, I think a lot of this has to do with how close they believe they are to competing and if trying to reclaim value in Danks is going to justify that. I don't expect Danks to be moved, but I am on record saying that I wouldn't be surprised if they do and that I could see them eating money, even if it's selling at his lowest point. We saw precedent for Hahn doing this with Keppinger and it may be that the team is willing to eat money if they feel they have no need for player anymore. I don't see them eating $27 mill, but $10-12 mill is a possibility, and I think there are teams who would consider him for that price. The Sox do this if they feel that a 7 man starting staff of Sale, Quintana, FA, Rodon, Noesi, Bassitt, and Carroll (not necessarily in that order or in that time) will suffice.

 

I will also say that a move to LA for Ethier (with the Sox chipping in a couple of prospects, none of whom would be worth losing sleep over, and the Dodgers possibly including some money as well) makes a lot of sense if the Dodgers are ok with Danks as a 5th starter/long man.