cwsox

the Cheat rightly brought the pivotal role of women in the 90s to mind thanks T.C. because you corrected us all nuke mentioned Verve Pipe's The Freshman

what about Mariotti's collected works makes you think he can read?

I won't argue with you but December is more fun to sing... in the right circumstances...

The best song of the 1990s was December by Collective Soul think about it (at least the guys)

true Breakfast at Tiffanys Deep Blue something You say that we've got nothing in common No common ground to start from And we're falling apart You'll say the world has come between us But I know you just don't care (chorous) An I said, "What about Breakfast at Tiffany's" She said, "I think I remember the film and as I recall, I think, we both kinda liked it." And I said, "Well, that's one thing we got." I see you - The only one who knew me And now your eyes see through me I guess I was wrong So what now? It's plain to see we're over And I hate when things are over When so much is left undone

say the lyrics out loud and make that claim again. Listen to the music again and argue that it is not the dictonary definition of treacle. Wonderwall was a wonderful solo album by George Harrison. ""I want to make you my wonderwall" is the most stupid line of the 90s and a desecration of everything sacred. Other than Goo Goo Dolls almost as stupid line that "don't it make you sad that life is more than who you are."

this is baggio's other posted review and have to ask him the source diffeent critics will see it different February 24, 2004 -- MANY of mankind's most beautiful and ennobling artistic achievements depict or were inspired by the crucifixion. Mel Gibson's "Passion," though well-acted, technically impressive and initially moving, is for the most part not beautiful and certainly not ennobling. Indeed, it is overwrought, sadistic way beyond the point of overkill, and oddly, spiritually dry given its subject. But then, unlike the great Passions of the past, it is a product of a distinctly perverted sensibility. In Gibson's crudely effective, blood-soaked epic "Braveheart," there was little compassion or feeling - but a great deal of savage brutality culminating in one of the torture scenes that Gibson has relished as an actor. In "Passion," the relish for pain and bloody cruelty that has marked his career as both a director and an actor - a relish that would almost be sensual in the hands of a less vulgar artist - boils over into a full-blown fetish. The relentless whippings, beatings and scourgings (the latter is barely mentioned in the Gospels but takes up a whole reel of film) start early and then intensify, in slow-motion and close-up, with the impact of each blow amped up like in "Rocky." Eventually, "Passion" becomes a kind of pornographic catalog of Christ's suffering. And like pornography, it's initially powerful but eventually becomes numbing. This would matter less if there was much else in the film besides blows and slashes accompanied by gasps of pain and ribbons of blood. (The procession to Calvary is a kind of orgy of savagery.) What distinguishes the film from the long tradition of gruesome martyrology in religious art is its lack of any sense of the meaning or reason for Christ's sacrifice. The message of Jesus' death is all but drowned in Gibson's morbid enthusiasm for shots of metal tearing flesh, as if Christ was crucified so that Gibson - along with his hard-working make-up and sound people - could indulge his obsession with torture. The narrative begins in the Garden of Gethsemane (which looks like a German forest) with the arrest of Jesus (Jim Caviezel) and some of the disciples hiding out from the Temple authorities and ends with the Resurrection. (The arrest takes place after a brutal fight that uses so much slow motion and so many heavily amplified blows that it feels like you're watching a Hong Kong action movie.) Some episodes from before then are shown in flashback, including moments from the Last Supper. Though I'm not a Christian, I could see why many would find "Passion" moving if - and it's a big if - they could get past the gratuitous violence. Nor do I believe it will provoke pogroms, if only because the film is probably too slow to work as rabble-rousing propaganda, whatever the intentions of its maker. Gibson's "Passion" generally sticks to the Gospels in the details of its narrative but, like the medieval Passion Plays it resembles, it cherry-picks among them so as to make the Jewish (as opposed to the Roman) role in Christ's death as dark as possible. This is mostly a matter of little details: For instance, Barabbas, the criminal who is set free by thoughtful Roman governor Pontius Pilate (Hristo Naumov Shopov) in place of Jesus, is depicted here as a crazed one-eyed murderer rather than a mere thief or bandit. More reprehensibly - and this is where Gibson does seem motivated by anti-Semitic prejudice - the inexplicably, bottomlessly malevolent Jewish priests and crowds who call for his death are portrayed almost to a man by stereotypically Jewish-looking actors with large hooked noses, while all the good characters are not, like Pilate and the sympathetic Roman soldier Abenader (Fabior Sartor). There is also a creepy anti-Semitic edge in the scene in which Judas and the high priest appear to haggle over 13 pieces of silver. There are some decent #### scattered about - one of the priests protests against Jesus' railroading and women in the crowd weep when he passes them - but several Romans, including some of the soldiers who brutalize Jesus, are shown as being moved by his suffering in way that isn't true of the ####. After Jesus' second or third brutalizing, the film seems to suggest not just that goodness corresponds with good looks, and badness with ugliness, but that you can tell what lurks in people's hearts by their teeth. All the really horrible people in the film are snaggletoothed, while all the good people - Jesus, the apostles, Pilate and his wife - are blessed with a full set of pearly whites. For a film that is so clearly intended to be true to the period (hence the dialogue in Aramaic and Latin) there are weird, wrong details, like the bread at the Last Supper which looks like an Italian loaf, not unleavened "matzoh" as it would have been. And for a sense of the real power relations between Romans and ####, this "Passion" gives the high priests and a small crowd of people in Jerusalem much more influence on their Roman overlords like Pilate (in real life a brutal tyrant) than they could possibly have exercised. "Monty Python's Life of Brian" offers a more accurate guide. The film also feels strangely cramped. This is partly a result of the relentless close-ups of a fantastically bloodied Jesus and his agonized disciples and partly because the crowds and locations are surprisingly small. During the film's few quiet moments, Caviezel, a handsome actor (best-known for his role in "The Thin Red Line"), suggests spiritual power as well as any actor who has played Jesus on the big screen, but he spends most of his screen time in almost mute agony. THE PASSION OF THE CHRIST Overwrought, sadistic.

however CK the script has been circulating for a year many who object have seen it in pre screenings the second review baggio posted on whitesox.com went to the heart of the antisemitic twist in the movie i will grant some will see the movie and not see the antisemitic stuff but others will

sorry Bob, you are not a church goer the ads that the churches have been flooded with and the marketing campaign for the film used in the stuff sent to churches makes the claim it is exactly what the Gospel's say which is why so many churches have sold his tickets for his movie which is why they used a purported quote from the pope (which the Vatican denies) that "it is what it is." You can parse that all to hell Bob, and argue what the meaning of "is" is, but I have seen plenty of the way this has been marketed to churches which is one reason it angers me so. I differ with Ebert on some of his comments - thought it was an insightful review and there are plenty out that that see it as antiSemitic, Bob - baggio being open minded posted one of those yesterday at whitesox.com along with the Ebert review

baggio, why not post both of those reviews here?

those lines may have moved Kass and may move others - from the point of viuew of a movie being an interpretation, that is fine one thing that bothers me greatly is that this movie passes itself off as exactly from the Gospels the movie line spoken to Caiaphas is not anywhere in Scriputre the line from the Last Supper was not said in the Last Supper narrative and there is no record of Caiphas being on calvary mocking Jesus that day anyway that I can recall at all this movie is Mel Gibson's version and it passes itself off as totally from the Gosepls and it is not Ebert's review is very interesting - he likes the movie to give it a thumbs up but his review is most interesting -

note, I edited that post -- that was not a back handed thing at all and I deeply regret that it might have looked that way McCain was unique in that he survived of the Keating 5 by plunging himself into campaign fiance reform and most people have judged him as sincere on that

the article begins with saying that "unwittingly" help was given that the money was returned, and that there was no way Kerry could have known the source of the money when he got it but returned it when he learned where here is the problem? John McCain was one of the Keating 5 and no one has called him a scumbag (note: this is not directed to ss2k4 - just to people calling them all scumbags in general - to an extent they ahve to be because of the system - in some Cheney cases he has been a scumbag and in some it was just politics as needs to be practiced - depends on what the particulars are) the scandal is the huge amounts of moneys that need to be raised to fund these campaigns - the Kerry/Weld race was extraordinary in both sides were pumping in money I am rather sure that almost if not every Senator has taken in something they later returned andintroduced someoneone to someone "unwittingly" and wishes they hadn't - part of the game, that's the sad part.

I agree. Brenden Frazer was perfect for that role and it was an excellent episode

it is very possible to have never used steroids, work very hard, move fat into muscle and change the body proportions (off the stomach, into chest, shoulders, arms, things and calves) and look all diffferent and certainly slimmer and only have lost 4 pounds. It is possible. It is what I have done the last two months, I am mad that all I have lost is 4 pounds but the three inches off the stomach and the extra bulk on the upper arms and shoulders - look way slimmer but hardly any weight changed so if I can do it, Giambi can do it

I do not think Cheat is allowed to take a break - Cheat, what everyone said goes for me a great deal - you will be sorely missed do what you gotta do and come on back to the Cheat!

what everyone else said

oh why am I posting this... under Roe v Wade third trimester abortions have always been severely limited. That has never been changed. Once again Congress has passed a bill which legislates a particular medical procedure done rarely, done almost exclusively in the second trimester when the life of the woman is at risk (and Congress simply declared in its bill that the woman's life is never at risk - go ahead and read the thing). The only difference is that this law was signed and not passed by overriding a veto. This law is as unconstitutional as its predecessors, which have all been tossed by the Supreme Court for not having an exception for the life of the women (hence Congress declaring the woman's life is never at risk so therefore there needs be no exception for the same). I wish I were making up this stupidity. But it is true and I didn't vote for anyone involved in this grandstanding. That this law is unconstitutional is evidenced by it being instantly enjoined in a number of federal courts the moment it took effect. The splendor of the current administration is that to defend this (unconstitutional) law, they are issuing subpoenas for the private medical records of every patient who has had an abortion by any of the doctors who filed the constitutional challenge to the law. So much for the conservatives acting on a belief in the privacy of a woman's medical records - this is a new federal threat, if you challenge us, we will expose your patients private records to the world in open court. The issue of the subpoenas is before several federal courts now. The subpoenas have been tossed in one federal district court; decisions await in the others.

note - I changed the title because the Governor Doyle of Wisconsin merely confirmed what the Secretary Paige said, and Doyle did not say it himself and Paige's remark is out of line

a season's tickets sales depend a lot on what happened the season before which is why in 1984 we had a disappointing season and the cubs won a division title and we outdrew them

and that is the flip side to my not being fond of Colon so I really have no one opinion on this because it could go either way

there may be a great deal of truth there CK... sadly or not sadly, I was never impressed that much by Colon but I would nto have minded re-signing him

JM would have done the same - in fact did the same trashing JM is soooooooolast year.

no they are doing something else there this is an Andy Rooney thread shouldn't you be studying?

Andy Rooney asked tonight: Mel Gibson, how many millions of dollars are you going to make off of the crucifixion of Christ?