LDF

QUOTE (chitownsportsfan @ Aug 31, 2015 -> 10:12 PM) I don't blame Cooper or Stevenson at all. Get better players. let me play devil advocate...... then why should RV be blame.

QUOTE (scs787 @ Aug 31, 2015 -> 09:09 PM) I believe you are suggesting people like him because he promotes fundamentals? Right? What good does that do if he's not getting them to execute what he's promoting? Why is it that people blame Robin for poor execution while Steverson rarely gets a mention on the board? my point and it is still is, the team came out of spring training and imo not ready for the season. with that, that is all RV and the higher ups for promoting him. now the coaches, if you think the batting coach should take equal share of the blame then both coaches , batting coach and pitching coach should also share in the blame. i, imo do not have the answers.

QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Aug 31, 2015 -> 09:45 PM) I don't get why you, and other posters here, think that. It's not like we have that much money to spend, and the FA market (outside of starting pitching, which we don't really need) is unattractive. the point is.... there is some kind of a pulse in the fo.

QUOTE (Lip Man 1 @ Aug 31, 2015 -> 09:40 PM) Sorry...I don't. We'll see. Mark that is kool and i respect your opinion. let me explain my thought.... with a very quiet trading deadline, esp when some of the poster if there was a struggle, so to speak if to trade or not. at least i am seeing some freaking life in this arse backward of an org.

well at least the sox may had some iron in the fire. as i said, i really believe this is going to be a fun off season.

QUOTE (scs787 @ Aug 31, 2015 -> 03:44 PM) Why is Steverson considered some brilliant mind? Sans Addison Russell, what hitter has come out of the Oakland organization where he was the roving minor league hitting coach? I follow this board religiously and I feel like I'm the only one to bring up Steverson, and I just don't get that. you do have a point, but wouldn't also mean that fundamentally is what he promotes. now, i do not know if this is the answer or not. i am just wondering.

QUOTE (AustinIllini @ Aug 31, 2015 -> 08:06 PM) "Most hated mouthpiece of an active manager" now that is funny

in the course of building for next yr, i believe that the yanks may start acquiring players for next yr run, or supposed run. investing to that goal, i can see the yanks spending. look at how important a closer can help. the yanks usually don't have to worry about a salary restraintants. with his salary off the books and hopefully some nice rtns in prospects, i can see Nate Jones being a valid part of the team next yr.

it will depend on the prospects coming back

i wonder if i can add ozzie's kids this this post.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Aug 31, 2015 -> 07:18 AM) I wish there was some type of computer/quant simulation which could demonstrate the impact of a manager/coaching staff...that it could "run" 1000 seasons with Ventura in charge of the Cubs, and Maddon in charge of the White Sox. Some will swear until they're blue in the face it wouldn't make any difference at all. An equal number who have put up with the tail end of the Ozzie show and then the abysmal baserunning/fundamentals/execution/defense of the 2013-2015 White Sox teams would swear on their graves that a better manager could maximize this team's talent and at least have them close to .500 if not better. Obviously SOMETHING happened the first 5 months or 2012, just subtracting Guillen from the equation...yet Ventura's inexperience showed up down the stretch. Yet those who still advocate for keeping Robin around will use the argument of a number of teams changing managers mid-season and it not making much of a positive impact (or is it simply the fact that most of the teams with managers getting fired weren't very good in the first place?). It does seem that the best time to implement a new system/strategy from a managerial/coaching standpoint is in the offseason. well let me add this, obviously something happen coming out of spring training that cause this downward season. if poster don't want to believe that, then lets look at the remedial training the FO tried to put RV in when the season is already started. here is one thing, RV has pride, maybe that will come into play here and he will not subject himself for another season.

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Aug 31, 2015 -> 06:14 AM) But he has 20 HRs. i wouldn't be surprise to see him up. just to see if he can handle big league pitching. then again, he is suppose to get his swing redone. so maybe not.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Aug 30, 2015 -> 07:09 PM) Not surprising. They thought they had a team that was right on the edge of competing, invested a lot of money in filling their last couple slots, and then found themselves at the bottom of their division and well out of the race. That's the kind of failure that typically costs people jobs. that would be true, unless one would considered how the sox org works.

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Aug 29, 2015 -> 04:27 PM) Rodon was much more polished out of college than Fullmer. Fulmer has a goofy, vicious delivery that they really need to straighten out to get full value out of him. and that is what i was looking for .

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Aug 29, 2015 -> 03:24 PM) The upside of both of them is "#1 starter in the big leagues after a couple years in the big leagues and Cy Young contender by the time they reach free agency". Rodon slightly better since he's a lefty? Sure I'll go with that. excellent. i always thought Rodon was a weak to solid #1. whereas Fulmer is a #2 or ???

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Aug 29, 2015 -> 04:01 PM) So if you're going to max out your salary spending you darn well better have a team that has some room to survive a couple players underperforming or getting hurt! And we've even been unbelievably lucky this year on health too! you are correct. but i am not talking about max out the salary allotted by the owners, i am talking about players not performing as expected .... all types of players.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Aug 29, 2015 -> 03:50 PM) The point is...that's by far the likelist scenario when you try to remake your roster on the FA market. With the guys you're paying full price for, there's a very high chance that they will under-perform substantially. That's why they're on the FA market and available in the first place. When you sign 1, you've got a fair chance that guy will perform and a fair chance he'll underperform. There's virtually no chance he'll overperform if you're paying full price for him because the demand on the FA market is that great. If you're trying to find 4-5 different pieces, and 2 or 3 of them significantly underperform while 2-3 are about where they should be, your roster is going to be missing 4 to 5 wins compared to what you budgeted for. When you're buying full priced guys, there's virtually no upside risk and there's a lot of downside risk. There's so much demand on the market by teams that actually are competitive that you are extremely likely to find several duds if you try to find several guys. Oh, and I should also note the risk of guys underperforming is probably even higher if some of the pieces you're trying to find are guys for your bullpen. underperforming is a risk in fa, traded players and regular players. there is no way possible to prevent this. i still say, adam laroche was a bad calculated risk that failed, i still like melky. but that aside, the team needs another 1 or 2 more players via fa's... the team also needs to make some desperate trades for more prospects.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Aug 29, 2015 -> 03:43 PM) It's not really about the money though. Overpaying for LaRoche & Melky would be fine if they were productive. The problem is they're pretty much under-performing by a good 4 to 5 wins. There are plenty of free agents that are performing at or even exceeding expectations (whether they're overpaid or not). The same strategy of "going for it" could have resulted in a much more favorable outcome if the execution consisted of a different set of players. i believe that it is all about the money and in essence an owner who believe that this team in any multi yrs of ownership, believe that a baseball team can compete with a limit payroll expense. furthermore, these owners will not pony up the necessary money to build a core that is on the verge of doing something. however, these owners will take short cuts but wasting money and time full of promises.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Aug 29, 2015 -> 03:16 PM) Trib had an article a couple days ago where they threw in the under-the-radar talk about a callup for him this year. That's sort of exactly how they were talking with Rodon last year. Whispers about a callup but being coy about it. My best guess still remains he'll be on a very similar path to Rodon. Get to 140ish innings this year, start in AAA for a game or two next year after ST, and then comes up to the big leagues, maybe stays in the pen for a couple weeks giving Danks or EJ starts, then takes over a rotation slot. as much as i hate to ask this, but isn't Rodon upside suppose to be greater than Fulmer??? so isn't it possible to expect different results in his development vs Rodon development.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Aug 29, 2015 -> 03:05 PM) Yes, we improved marginally on our record this year. It took spending >$50 million/season in new money and trading for a pitcher 1 year away from free agency and having a team that is unbelievably, remarkably healthy to upgrade by ~4 games. There's a good chance that'll be just enough to land us a first round pick in 2016 that isn't protected. This isn't complimentary. I didn't wade into this thread last night, y'all know how I feel about these guys, but man this attitude of "we're going the right direction look at our record!" really frustrates me. Just to tread water from this season we'll have to spend like $25 million in new money and attendance is going to go the opposite direction next year again. while many tries to look at the best if possible. i really would like the to know, how they really feel about their bumbling around, calling this bad luck. a post was made on the legacy of the present owners. the real question should be what are their opinion on their legacy of half not of incompetence, mismanagement and a futile record of poor decision making. and since JR is the most focal point here, i real would like to think what he really thinks of his legacy.

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Aug 29, 2015 -> 06:46 AM) My issue is this team can't develop hitters to save their lives. i believe that this can not continue. question is what would be the trigger or what would need to change. maybe just maybe it is Hahn.

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Aug 29, 2015 -> 05:43 AM) Ugh being a sox fan sucks right now. Just keep losing. Sorry to piss off a lot here with that but it's best thing for us. while it is for the best or not, this team does not have the little, what ever you call it, but the killer instinct to start and finish a game, a season.

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Aug 29, 2015 -> 05:38 AM) In fairness to a complete rebuild, this attendance already sucks. and i would say, the sox fans will not stand and wait for a "rebuild" according to the owners. even thou the sox been rebuilding for a while now.

QUOTE (Lip Man 1 @ Aug 29, 2015 -> 04:54 AM) 19th time this year the Sox allowed three runs or less in a game...and lost. 9th time team has been shutout. Have played 127 games, have scored three runs or less in 66 of them. 52% overall. Mark excellent info.

QUOTE (Lip Man 1 @ Aug 29, 2015 -> 04:52 AM) Austin: You make a valid point to be sure however I've been told from sources for years that JR is more "hands-on" than you may think. I was told for example that one more than one occasion he has interjecting himself into the draft process and 'recommended" who the team should take. That puts the scouting director and his staff in a bind. Put it this way, how comfortable would you be going against the 'recommendations' of the guy who signs your pay check? Mark that is a great point. and i think this might also explains alot more. if the team owner dictate on how much they have to maneuver in order to spend on the fa market.