Chisoxfn

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Dec 7, 2016 -> 12:03 PM) Fangio pretty much put the report that he was leaving on blast, said he plans to be back next year and the report wasnt true. I keep hoping that is the case. If he leaves for a head coaching job fine, but anything else and I'd be dissapointed. I also am happy the team is playing hard for Fox and I hope they continue to. Doing worse for a top pick doesn't necessarily solve anything.

QUOTE (bmags @ Dec 7, 2016 -> 11:50 AM) Okay so Kopech is elite but Robles isn't? Why? Robles tool grades are almost identical to Moncadas with more defense/speed on Robles and less power. I wasn't talking Robles. Robles is far more raw then either Moncada / Kopech, imo. I like Robles though and would want him in any of the afformentioned deals. Personally, I don't see the Nats getting all of these parts and my hunch tells me they'd be a fit for a deal involving Eaton/Robertson, headlined around Gio / Robles / Lopez or two of those players, plus another couple prospects. Robles bust factor, given his youth and where he has played thus far in his career, is a lot higher then the other guys. Not saying Kopech / Moncada don't have rawness to them, but they are a little safer to project (albeit they also have bust risk too).

QUOTE (bmags @ Dec 7, 2016 -> 11:47 AM) The thing is we just had this conversation with Sale and he got nowhere near the filling in of talent after the premier guys that we all expected. I'm pretty confident in saying that if we take all of soxtalks mega deals and cut them in half it is way more accurate. Now, you may not take those top 30 players, but I'm not sure you get much more back. Kopech and Moncada is elite though. Plus two fillers. Q/Eaton aren't that much less valuable then Sale (on the trade market, considering surplus, etc).

QUOTE (ChiliIrishHammock24 @ Dec 7, 2016 -> 11:44 AM) Yeah, I need 4 guys for both Eaton and Q. The chances that Robles becomes as good as Eaton is now are very low, especially since he's so damn raw. Exactly. Plus, we should be realistic about all three of these guys. The odds that any one player we get back will end up being better then the three individual talents, is pretty unlikely, imo. I don't see Moncada being better then Sale and I doubt we'll get an individual who is better then Q or Eaton have been at their peak. That said, the value in this trades is if we can get back multiple good players, that will provide us with a much better and deeper team and one hopefully able to actually contend (and then of course you hope one of the pieces turns out better then the guy dealt, but probably not realistic). The dollar savings is something I don't even consider as it relates to these three particular players, because they all have such team friendly deals (plus between Sale, Q, and eaton you have 3, 4, and 5 more years of collective service, which to a contender, is a long time). Eaton has the same amount of guaranteed time with the Sox as Rodon.

QUOTE (bmags @ Dec 7, 2016 -> 11:39 AM) I'm fairly certain Nats may view Giolito and lopez as near interchangeable. I think a fair deal for Eaton is Robles and Lopez. Adding more is unlikely. And two top 30 players for eaton is a GREAT trade. I just don't think two top thirty players is that great of value for a guy who has been one of the best outfielders in baseball and is signed to a cheap contract for five years. Given bust rates of prospects, I don't see it. I think we need top talent + depth and need to get that in our packages for Q and / or Eaton. When it comes to Frazier / Robertson, I hope we get a back end top 100 guy for them plus some low level flyers (or maybe some arms we like that we think we can convert to relievers). Expect a bit more for Frazier then Robertson and think we get more for Robertson at the deadline then today. Nate Jones is interesting, but you wonder how much his injury history downplays the value he would have.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 7, 2016 -> 11:25 AM) I was a little surprised to hear that for most of the baseball industry, package the White Sox received was considered head and shoulders above Giolito/Robles/ Lopez which supposedly was their offer for Sale. Q/Eaton are so much surplus, Turner has to be part of it, or I don't see how it makes sense for the White Sox. I think trading your 2 most valuable assets to the same team probably isn't the best way to maximize value in a return. I agree with everything you said. I think packaging Robertson with a Q or Eaton makes sense (and similarly a Frazier or Melky with one of them), but putting them both in a deal probably doesn't maximize value. Given that we got a really elite guy in Moncada, I'm okay if the next deal is more Top 100 type volume talent coming through (vs. a top 5 prospect). The real question is would the Nats offer that package for Q and if so, would the Sox take it. Giolito has real headwinds, not to the extent of a guy like Fulmer, but he didn't exactly flash in his cup of coffee (he wasn't as bad as Fulmer, who showed just such poor "stuff"). When it comes to Fulmer, we have to hope the guy we see this spring, has some juice back in his stuff, cause he looked like a guy who either was impacted by an ailment (or maybe mechanics or other changes that threw off his rhythm) or a guy who was just overly fatigued. I saw none of the stuff you'd like to see of a guy who was picked as high as he was.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 7, 2016 -> 11:17 AM) If they didn't have the prospects for Sale/Cutch, I don't see how they have the prospects for this. Q is probably worth a little less than Sale, but Eaton should be valued a bit higher than Cutch. Maybe this is Rizzo try to waste RH/KW's time after they used him to perfection yesterday. I think they have the prospects, we just liked the package for Sale more then the package they offered. In Cutch's case, I think it is more that the two teams can't agree on what the right price is, not that the nats don't have the talent to get it done. They most definitely have the horses to do it, will they want to pay the price, that is another question.

This type of package would have to include Turner. Nats most certainly have the prospects to pull it off.

QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Dec 6, 2016 -> 05:33 PM) Rumors that Vic Fangio will be on his way out at the end of the season. That would suck, that's been one of the few bright spots. http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/colum...206-column.html This has me perplexed. Must be true.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Dec 6, 2016 -> 08:17 AM) More than anything, this team needs to play some defense. They are just awful as a team. The front line is terrible. Hoiberg is a bad coach. Period. We also have an awful bench, horrific.

Does having Moncada make it more likely that we would keep Abreu around for another year (kind of a stabilizing Cuban presence to help Yoan assimilate)?

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 7, 2016 -> 10:16 AM) Maybe things will go nuts this afternoon and evening, but for an event that was hyped up as going to be crazy, there hasn't been many trades. Without the Sale trade, this Winter Meetings has been a snooze fest. If I remember right, tomorrow is usually a non-event for news, so either stuff picks up later today or tonight or the meetings will end up having been very quiet. That said, I think we see a few more moves before Christmas. I also think if the Sox plan on moving Q, they would move him pretty quickly (as by and large the same suitors for Sale would be in on Q and we'd have presumably already done a ton of vetting on those lists, etc).

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 7, 2016 -> 10:19 AM) Supposedly the Red Sox vetted Sale pretty thoroughly. Much to the apparent dismay of many here, his ex-teammates don't consider him a monster. Merkin was defending him on Twitter from someone who said Sale was an idiot. Besides if Sale is so awful due for a meltdown, what is Kopech? Sale will be loved in Boston. His attitude and personality is everything you want out of a guy on a top notch ball club. I think they will love him in Boston and he will do fantastic. This could be better then when they got Pedro.

QUOTE (WhiteSoxLifer @ Dec 3, 2016 -> 11:32 AM) Several teams in need of a closer are keeping tabs on Wade Davis and David Robertson, but the trade market has been slower to develop. https://twitter.com/jcrasnick/status/805131878722404352 Im guessing once the dominos starting falling for the free agents interest would pick up for Robertson I think we probably would get more for him at the deadline, of course that is dependent on him not getting hurt, etc (and pitching really well). That said, you'd think once Chapman and Jensen go, we'd be in a better spot.

Trading a guy who is an ace with 4 years of cost control left seems like a pretty risky proposition. I'm open to it, but Q is probably the last of all the guys I'd move. I'd move Eaton, Melky, Robertson, Jones, and Abreu first (again depending on value).

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Dec 7, 2016 -> 05:24 AM) That is f***ing insane. They are getting Wade Davis for Avi Garcia. Soler is far better then Garcia. I don't think this is a bad deal for the Royals at all. Cubs have flexibility to move Soler but I'm surprised they are doing it for a closer who is a FA at the end of the year and has had some arm issues.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 7, 2016 -> 07:24 AM) Kopech's stock has really risen. Heyman had a tweet that one team put Moncada's worth at $100 million, and put Kopech's at $100 million They both clearly have a lot of upside.

QUOTE (soxforlife05 @ Dec 6, 2016 -> 11:05 PM) I don't dislike Moncada and Kopech. They are leaving themselves no margin for error by the deal being heavily front loaded and Moncada and Kopech have not proven anything above AA. The other two are lotto tickets. The bust potential with this trade in particular is much higher than it should be given we just gave up a perennial all star pitcher on a cheap deal. The front office has not earned the benefit of doubt given recent trade results. I agree with this. This is a riskier deal than I thought we would end up getting. I figured we'd go more for a deal centered around lots of above average prospects vs. two higher end prospects and then a couple feelers. Puts a lot more pressure on the top two guys to produce. In general though, if it is part of a bigger strategy that ultimately brings a lot of overall talent back to the organization, then I think it makes sense. In isolation, I have extremely mixed feelings on the deal, despite obviously liking Kopech and Moncada a ton.

QUOTE (bigruss22 @ Dec 5, 2016 -> 09:04 PM) I love Panera food, but it's gotten so damn pricey with smaller portions in the last few years. I loved right above one in college and a chipotle half a block away, hangovers were so easy then. I agree...I hadn't gone in a couple years (I used to go all the time when i was studying for my CPA and/or working on weekends) and was shocked at how much more it cost for what I would usually get (a you pick two with a soup and salad).

QUOTE (ChiliIrishHammock24 @ Dec 5, 2016 -> 09:07 PM) Oh s***, I didn't even know a new one had come out. Need to watch that ASAP. It was last year's christmas special. One day episode that didn't really tie into the overall season.

QUOTE (bmags @ Dec 5, 2016 -> 11:58 AM) The only panera is so far from my office, and I have a stupid corner bakery right on the corner that seduces me when I just want soup. And boy is their soup garbage. I do agree with you that their soup is not good. Panera's soup is good.

QUOTE (Brian @ Dec 5, 2016 -> 11:52 AM) Panera is one of my favorite places to eat. I usually get mocked when I say that. I like Panera and Corner Bakery (their chopped salad is really good as is their breakfast, imo).

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Dec 5, 2016 -> 07:02 PM) Totally. I mean I compare it to the Sherlock Holmes movies we had a few years back which are complete garbage, and I can't believe they are trying to tell the same story. It has been way too long since the last season. Can't wait for January to be here and for three more episodes. The show is fantastic (if you could call it a show...more like a long movie).

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Dec 5, 2016 -> 08:21 PM) This is where Boston can come in and either a) help us get Turner or b) beat their offer and we get a great deal from Boston. I wouldn't sleep on Houston either. I agree with Houston, especially given their GM's recent track record of being able to complete a big deal. Same can be said for Rangers front office & obviously DD for Red Sox. Don't see Dodgers front office having the same aggression, but Cashman could succumb to the pressure. I think Q is probably a more likely play for Dodgers / Red Sox / Rangers though.

QUOTE (bmags @ Dec 5, 2016 -> 08:14 PM) Handwringing mostly came after garbage Bowden report Only thing to really handwring over is the actual result of the deal and even then, we won't know the long term impacts for a while. What looks great on paper could be terrible and what looks bad on paper could be great.