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QUOTE (whitesoxfan99 @ Feb 11, 2016 -> 10:43 AM) Also, while injuries definitely are impacting this team, the fact is even when their record was good this team was basically playing like a .500 basketball team in terms of their efficiency margins. Their best month of they year in terms of win-loss record was November and they actually got outscored by their opponents that month. They won a lot of close games (7 of their 8 wins were by 6 points or less) and only one of their losses was a game they had a chance to win so they were never as good as their record indicated. This has been a mediocre at best team from day 1 this year and now that they are having injuries they have gone from mediocre to downright bad. The problem I have, is while they might have played mediocre, the roster, at the start of the season was far better than mediocre. The combination of poor fit and poor coaching have just made things worse (to go along with injuries). Nothing I've seen from Fred makes me think he's a good coach, but I'll also admit he's in a tough spot. But when it comes to Gar, he made his bed when he came out strongly and talked about how Fred was the guy who was going to maximize the talent, etc, and this team has done nothing but got worse and I don't see how JR ignores it. I don't think Gar is someone JR will "protect". Pax, absolutely. I think it is unlikely Pax gets fired. An interesting alternative is whether Hoiberg would move into the front office (vs. coach). I.e., do the Bulls fire Gar, have Pax take on greater reigns, and have Hoiberg become GM?

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Feb 11, 2016 -> 10:37 AM) Games missed last season, 50 wins. Pau 4 Butler 17 Noah 15 Dunleavy 19 Gibson 20 Hinrich 16 Rose 31 McDermott 46 Snell 10 If they tuned out Thibs, they haven't tuned in anyone this year. If it was time for Thibs, it's time for the Mayor and his boy Gar. Gar really needs to go. He forced out Ron Adams, now with a ring at GS. Wouldn't let Thibs hire the strength guy from Houston, now with SA. I read when Thibs was hired, it was a JR pick. Pax wanted Collins, Gar wanted Mike Brown or Lawrence Frank. It wasn't time to change the coach. It was time to change the players. The team isn't good enough. There isn't a coach in the world that would make this team healthy and championship caliber. Yeah - I remember when I say who Gar's coaching picks were and I was like, it all makes sense. He wanted to the coaches who were push overs and controllable. I wouldn't have had an issue with Pax's choice in Collins and well I was glad JR won out. And I agree, this team has battled injuries forever (and given the injury track record you should expect it) and it wasn't until early March last year when they hit 25 losses.

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Feb 11, 2016 -> 10:31 AM) They clearly stopped last year. At least, parts of the team. Gasol never bought in to the way Thibs did things. I doubt Mirotic or McDermott did either. Guys didn't exactly clamor for him to stay. What benefit was there to clammor for him to stay? Jimmy has made it clear he was a believer. Rose and Thibs were always close and I don't recall Taj or Noah being happy. I don't know that Mirotic would know any better and while Doug might have been upset he was hurt so it is a moot point (and Thibs supported Doug's drafting). Pau is the one outlier who did not like Thibs (and it isn't a shock since Pau is pretty low key and largely used to being coached by Phil who was very low key in the grand scheme of things).

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 11, 2016 -> 10:28 AM) This is absolutely true. If you think about it what you think other teams around the NBA would look like if you removed their best player, plus a couple of other starters, and key reserves? I can also agree with the second part as this team, even when it was close to healthy, had way too many nights where it didn't show up. Look, I am of the opinion that the bridge to Thibs was done. It was burnt down and over. I get why the coaching move was made. But nothing about Fred Hoiberg has impressed me, even with the obvious injury caveats included. Agree with everything you say. I think it is unfortunate that the bridge to Thibs was done though, because I feel Gar completely sabotaged him (and obviously by last postseason, Thibs had finally had enough and was going to start leaking stuff). On a sidenote, Taj might be out. Sounds like he's pretty beat up, but given how and what he plays through (same with Jimmy), I always wonder how the guys deal with Rose.

QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ Feb 11, 2016 -> 10:06 AM) I mean, that's just revisionist history. The team stopped listening to Thibs that last year. They were tired of him. I loved Thibs and what he did, but it was time for a change. I love how Haugh and others keep saying "we need change just for change!" while at the same time claiming change for change with Thibs was a terrible decision. Which is it? Gar wanted us to believe they stopped listening to Thibs last year, but I don't believe that for a second. As far as I can tell, they haven't ever even started listening to Fred. By the way, I do agree, that injuries have played a pretty critical role in this losing streak. Wilbon was on about a day ago saying the roster isn't near as bad as the record and other teams feel Bulls roster is talented. But he went on to say we have major leadership issues (and ultimately I also think we have major coaching issues to go along with the injuries). Butler MJD Mirotic Noah Plus: Some games missed by Rose, Pau, Hinrich, Aaron Brooks.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Feb 11, 2016 -> 09:55 AM) Google Bulls will continue free fall, and get behind the paywall for Haughs column today. Sometimes I think he's a dufus, but I think he nailed it today. Yep. That was a great article. Just finished reading it.

A Bulls team once known for defense gave up at least 100 points to an opponent for the seventh straight game Wednesday. Makes me f***ing sad. This was a team that as a fan you could be so proud of (even when they weren't winning, they were doing everything right). How fast the bandaid is getting ripped. This is just painful and downright embarassing. Gar has to go. The Bulls have to make a statement.

Does Gar make it to the deadline. This team is just horrific. There record in there last 18 is just absurd. I read some quotes from Korver on the Bulls and he talked about how Thibs ingrained everything into your brain and the detailed approach, etc, and how it will take the new players more time. But than he talked about our offense and how Thibs used to call every play (like most coaches do) but not with Fred. If Fred was going to do that, he'd need a silky smooth PG like Chris Paul or prime Nash. Otherwise, offenses and teams need coaching. I feel like Fred is afraid to coach, to be frank.

QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Feb 11, 2016 -> 05:38 AM) Are you on some planet where Derrick Rose still has trade value? The only way you're dealing him is for a worse contract. yes I am, the planet where other NBA reporters have indicated Rose could be traded. I'm not saying you'd get something for him, but someone would take him off of our hands (especially with where the cap is headed).

QUOTE (iamshack @ Feb 11, 2016 -> 09:10 AM) I call bulls***. I'm in your camp.

QUOTE (greg775 @ Feb 11, 2016 -> 09:05 AM) I'll stop with the topic then. Didn't know 400 partners was pretty average Greg, I've now learned that I must in fact be a gigantic prude.

QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Feb 10, 2016 -> 01:26 PM) Also - only Carson looks like someone who's supporters could go deferentially to Cruz. Christie lines up more with Bush or Kasich. Fiorina I can't tell really. Kasich or Bush would go to Rubio most likely. I would think Fiorina supporters go to someone more mainstream but Carson's probably go all over the place (more to Cruz / Trump but for now split with than some mainstream candidates picking up some as well). Does Carson even qualify for the upcoming debate? So next debate will have an even more narrowed down field, which could create new senses of urgency, etc, and overall gives each of the candidates more time to shine / fail.

QUOTE (bmags @ Feb 10, 2016 -> 11:13 AM) Right, when it became clear Obama was inevitable suddenly they changed to him. They may be useful to prevent a brokered convention in that way. I think, on its face, they are very stupid. But, I kind of like having it in the back pocket if a trump like insurgent ever happens on dem side. If the majority speaks, the majority speaks. Would seem odd to have the delegates go a different way (this differs from say a general election where you have the various states because I will always argue if the format changed to where it was total popular vote, you might get differences from the reality). For example a republican in CA may not vote because it doesn't matter where a democrat in a red state could do something similar.

QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Feb 10, 2016 -> 10:01 AM) California managed to finally get its budget situation back in line once Democrats got supermajorities in the state legislature. Progressive Minnesota is kicking butt in the upper Midwest. Lol. California is a joke. Budget might have improved but that had a lot more to do with the improvement of the overall economy than anything any party did.

QUOTE (knightni @ Feb 10, 2016 -> 09:46 AM) Is it true that releasing Rose only counts for $7 mil a year - over the next 3 years - against the cap? They would trade him well before they released him.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 10, 2016 -> 09:39 AM) I totally agree with your top 2 statements. On the third, I'd vote for the Libertarian candidate before I voted for either Trump or Cruz. I did it when Romney ran last time, and I probably will do it again. It is a crazy election cycle for sure. It has been a long time since we have seen truly this much question as to the nomination, maybe back to the Civil War. Even the 08 Democratic race that took a while only was down to two candidates the whole time. This is a f***ing mess. Yeah. I agree with you. If it is Trump / Cruz, as of today, I'd be writing in a candidate. But if someone put a gun to my head and said pick one, I'll be honest, I'd go with Trump.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 10, 2016 -> 09:17 AM) That is the irritating part. While calling a 4th place finish momentum, they are missing out on the chances to get real momentum behind whoever is the NotTrump candidate for the convention, leading to an actual convention fight for the nomination, instead of giving the eventual candidate a chance to start campaigning months earlier. Well maybe my difference here is, I view there being 3 distinct candidates. Trump, Cruz, and the moderate conservative (Rubio / Kasich / Bush). So basically you have 3 people fighting for one spot. The top dog, Rubio, is losing momentum and both secondary candidates have gained momentum. Kasich gained more, but Kasich also has almost no money so Bush isn't in all that bad of a position. All things considered, its amazing Bush has any chance to be back in this (after the way Trump put him out to the pasture). I agree with you they have to widdle that field down but I view Cruz as bad, if not worse than Trump (personally speaking) and I figure we have two more states to truly narrow this field down so that by Super Tuesday, only one person remains between Rubio / Kasich / Bush. I actually think I vote for Trump before I vote for Cruz. By the way, good debate Mike. Crazy that we are even talking about this. It is such an interesting political year.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 10, 2016 -> 09:15 AM) Obviously Foreman is giving the typical GMs BS answer when he talked about this being a title team. What seems obvious to me is that with even typical health, this roster wasn't a top level team, but in the second tier right under the GS, SA, CLE level. It is a starting line up with multiple All-Stars, and a pretty good amount of talented depth. Obviously a couple of the guys weren't ready for the bigger minutes that injuries forced them into, but I don't think anyone anticipated Tony Snell and Doug Mc being counted on for huge minutes this year. The roster as it is playing today is obviously not going to beat many teams at all, but when you look at how many front line players are out, there is no roster in the NBA that would survive that. My hope is that at the very least Pax forces Foreman to punt on this season and at least trade Gasol to the highest bidder, and then see what guys like Taj and Noah with an expiring deal can bring. This is exactly what I see happening. Not sure if they move Taj or not, but I wouldn't be surprised if they did turn the page and make this more of a developmental season with an eye to next year. Of course Hoiberg would have to step up his game and focus hard on drilling everyone on his system and start running that system.

QUOTE (bmags @ Feb 10, 2016 -> 09:09 AM) Niko is not a "great" move. Great moves at the least provide you with a good player. Niko is bad. Pau is a fine player. He was a very strange choice to fit on this roster, it created a weird carousel of rotations, and killed our wing/pg rotations. That was a bad signing of a good player. What did the Bulls give up for Niko? Niko was an above average role player last year with upside. This year he hasn't been good, but its been six months. The value the Bulls got from Niko where they grabbed him, is impressive, and despite his struggles this year, he is still absolutely a tradeable asset. I wouldn't trade him at this point because I think there is a better upside betting on him turning things around than the value you get from him in a trade today.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 10, 2016 -> 09:05 AM) Bush still finished tied for 4th at 11%, after getting crushed in Iowa. He is also polling 4th in SC right now at 10%. http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/20...imary-4151.html Momentum though. Had Rubio had a strong finish, I think Bush is out. Rubio is eroding right now (whether he can stop that erotion or not, remains to be scene). Bush has benefited from it, as has Kasich, and Bush has to see that Kasich is a beatable guy (if not from the pure perspective that Bush has so much more resources than Kasich). I just see no logical reason for Bush to walk away now. If he has a weak showing in SC and Nevada, than I could see him turning away and getting pressured to turn away, because the non Cruz / Trump candidates are all going to get a ton of pressure from more mainstream conservatives to widdle their side of the field down to 1 by Super Tuesday. I put the odds much higher today that Bush could be that guy than I would have a week ago (when I'd have given him zero chance...odds might only be 10%, but that is still an improvement). Kasich might actually be the guy in the driver seat right now, but he needs to capitalize on it with a strong showing, as this is going to be the first time he gets any sort of main stream coverage (or so I suspect). He absolutely has to capitalize on this opportunity. I'd actually say odds are pretty split between Kasich / Rubio of who would come out and who would have said that a week ago (when Rubio had all the momentum). Note: Kasich might end up getting lucky cause I have a feeling Bush is going to spend his time and money attacking Rubio and Rubio will thus have to do the same to Bush, which might mean Kasich can stay above the fray and benefit from the other two beating themselves up. None of this impacts Trump / Cruz as I think they have an entirely different base.

QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ Feb 10, 2016 -> 09:02 AM) Who would you have signed instead? And that plan means you're basically giving up hope that Rose ever becomes a good player again. Up until last season, that would have been foolish, not to mention the FA nightmare of having an organization give up on a player after 1 or 2 injuries. Hurting their FA pull is the last thing they can afford given how low it is already. Also Gasol was a great pick-up. Dude's been an all-star each year he's been here. What more do you want? He doesn't fit the Hoiberg system but maybe Garpax was hoping he'd be enough of a piece to get past Cleveland and still have Thibs as a coach. Examples please. And the Heat got lucky a scrub in the D-League developed into a major player. And they didn't have to deal with a franchise player who is constantly hurt. Signing Gasol was a great move that argues against the "they don't make any good moves or sign good players!" complaint. Niko was just a miss. Through half of last season everyone and their mother thought he was a great find. I'm still not willing to give up on him either. He makes a lot of stupid mistakes, but he still has a ton of talent. It's been 1.5 seasons. Same with McDermott. His defense can improve and then he'd be a really solid contributor. And who are you drafting instead of McDermott? What need could have been filled. Go look at the players taken after him. A bunch of nobodies. As I've said before, given unlucky situation with Rose, they've been pretty hamstrung in what they could do. As Balta has pointed out, any moves they could have made to get better means you lose out on Butler or Taj or both. Other than some max free agent like Lebron or Melo WHO THEY TRIED TO ACQUIRE, they're not signing anyone as good as Butler now. So that's all a wash. You absolutely have to give the Bulls credit for not executing on a deal to move Butler. Reality is a lot of GM's would have dealt Butler. You should give the Warriors the same credit as they could have dealt Klay for Love and who knows what Golden State becomes if that happens. Does Draymond end up developing into the player he is, how does Love fit in with them, etc. How can anyone knock the Pau signing? Pau might suck at defending the pick and roll, but he's been a very good player for the Bulls. And Niko was a great move. I'm actually curious how the time off, etc, will be for him. Might allow him to clear his mind and kind of regain his edge. Niko clearly has talent (and I complain about him more than others), but I really question whether Hoiberg is the right guy to get the most out of our players and help develop our guys. I always thought Thibs did an amazing job getting the most out of his guys and developing young players.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 10, 2016 -> 08:54 AM) The bottom half of the field should be dropping out. Realistically the only guys who should be left are Trump, Cruz, Rubio, and maybe Kasich. Given Bush's finish in NH, I have a hard time indicating why he should drop out. You might think he's toast, but reality is he's gotten a bit of momentum recently and is starting to gain some traction (all while Bush's primary competition, Rubio is sliding). He'll need to keep building on that and can't have a poor finish here on out, but I see no reason, with all the money he has raised, that he should drop out based upon the results in NH. He beat Rubio and was basically the same as Cruz (two guys who are clearly in the race). Now Christie, Fiorina, and Carson clearly all need to walk away. Christie put all his eggs in New Hampshire and was way behind everyone else. The other two have zero momentum or just declining momentum. I'm sure Carson won't (since he didn't focus much on NH anyway, but I don't know that he makes it to Super Tuesday). Note: I refer to Rubio as Bush's primary competition, because I clearly think the core republicans want one of Rubio / Bush / Kasich and prior to super tuesday they need to get the field narrowed to one of these remaining candidates so they can actually stand a shot at beating Trump or Cruz.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Feb 10, 2016 -> 08:50 AM) Yeah, the Thibs will never win a title is crazy to say. If he has the talent, he will win a title. If Phil or Pop had the Bulls roster the past several years, they wouldn't win a title either. Phil was truly lucky (not saying he wasn't a good coach, but damn did he have talent). He had arguably the two greatest DUO's in NBA history at one point in time or another, between Michael / Pip and Shaq / Kobe and than again had a heck of a duo with Kobe / Pau. In fact, during most of his tenure as a coach, Phil had the best active player on the planet (from Jordan to Shaq to Kobe).

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Feb 10, 2016 -> 08:49 AM) The country has never tried left-wing politics before. I'd like to see it but it's never happened. I don't think that changes this year. If Illinois / Chicago is any example, count me out. If California is an example, again, count me out.

Christie has to drop out now, right? He put all his eggs in NH and lost. I thought Jeb would be on his way out, but with his showing, he clearly won't drop out and Kasich clearly can continue a little longer (how much so, who knows...unless he gets the backing of Bush).