Chisoxfn

QUOTE (ChiSox_Sonix @ Jul 10, 2015 -> 06:20 AM) The unfortunate part of this team having been so bad this year is the fact that with this rotation we would be more than capable of winning in October. Which is why I've long said if this team were to get into the playoffs, you shorten the rotation, you shorten the bullpen, you might have a chance, but that would be dependent on at least fixing the defense and of course getting that 2nd wild card spot is still an absolute stretch. However, it is why Kenny and Hahn can't panic and can look at tweak team but key is having view on 2016 and 2017 while still potentially giving yourself a shot for this year as well.

QUOTE (chitownsportsfan @ Jul 9, 2015 -> 08:04 PM) Melky is surging. If Avi can hit a little and they get something out of the infield other than Jose maybe they can turn it around. I will say this: to be 5 under at this point feels like a miracle and maybe things aren't quite as bad as we thought with 90 losses. Even if they win like 80 that's an improvement. The pythag isn't there by the pitching is pretty damn good. If the offense and defense could just not be league worst bad they could get to .500 IMO. I've been saying for a long time, this team isn't that far off and it isn't in this horrific shape that some posters here would want you to believe. The defense is a real problem and we need some good hitters to go with it. Will it be easy to fix (in the sense that it is a slam dunk), no, but it is totally workable and doable and I expect while we will see the club sell, we might also see us have a trade or two where we buy (using some of our prospects for young position players or getting in as a 3rd team to pick up something that fits our roster needs better). 3B and SS are two major needs in my mind and I'd also like to see us pick up a good defensive outfielder who can run and ideally hit a bit (that might mean using Garcia as bait (along with others to fill other needs) or moving LaRoche and freeing up some flexibility for Mekly / Garcia to DH a bit more. I still don't worry a lot about 2B because I've long been high on Micah and think that having him continue to develop and work some defensive kinks will be good for him to do now. Catcher is an area we could make an offensive improvement but defensively Flowers isn't horrid, so at least he has that going for him. To be frank, biggest defensive improvements would probably be warranted at 3B and corner outfield. I'd bet on Eaton and Ramirez trending closer to their career norms and thus you see natural positive defensive regression their. When it comes to Avi / Melky, if you play them in LH / DH (presuming you move LaRoche) and take care of 3B, that is replacing two positions where we have had awful defensive production that is not driven by small sample sizes. It could be Ramirez is horrible but his issues seem to be more mental then physical and even though you'd expect range limitations, you don't expect him to maintain this poor of play and I feel similarly with Eaton. I also have no problem if you find a CF that you prefer and move Eaton to LF either (either way, we need to upgrade defense without making offense any worse).

QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Jul 10, 2015 -> 07:35 AM) But then you have to deal with car salesmen every 3 years. No thanks. Highly recommend just working through the online / fleet managers. So much easier a process (and so not scummy). Only scummy part is when you meet with the finance people, who to be frank, are probably 10000% scummy then the car salesmen.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 9, 2015 -> 03:59 PM) The problem with white privilege is that it does not mean you or your family haven't worked hard to get where you are. Saying that it exists and asking people to acknowledge how it effects people willing to work equally hard from the same situations is part of the point of highlighting it. So hypothetically you emphasize with a particular person when having a conversation, oh I'm sorry, I understand I had a leg up and am compassionate for your situation and what you've worked through? How does that really help the impacted person? Does it make them feel better, does it erase past inequalities, does it do anything different? I suppose maybe the person at least feels they were acknowledged for their success and what they did to accomplish whatever it was they accomplished? I could tell you that if I told that to my father in-law, he'd be irate if I made that sort of comment (and he was one of the last flights out of Vietnam and lived on a marine base until eventually making it on his own (came over with nothing, not knowing if his family survived, made it over, etc, and then had to find ways to get other members of his family over, etc). All that said, he's incredibly proud of what he has been able to accomplish and what he was able to accomplish for his family and his children (one of which is obviously my wife) and would never want to hear about how he could have done so much more if he hadn't been born in a poor country and then had to deal with war, etc.

QUOTE (illinilaw08 @ Jul 9, 2015 -> 03:40 PM) I'm pretty sure this conversation has veered away from the documentary that was its focus, but when talking about race in this country, I think it's important to note that, as Jenks point out, yes, being white provides a certain level of privilege over being black. I presume that everyone in this thread worked hard to be where they are - I certainly know that I did. But I also understand and acknowledge that my background - middle class with parents who valued the crap out of education - gave me a leg up in getting to where I am now. It was only 50 years ago that the Civil Rights Act passed. Policies that directly impacted generations of African Americans were phased out within most of our parents' lifetimes. To acknowledge that it was easier for my parents to obtain middle class success in America than for a large chunk of minorities is simply reality. It doesn't devalue the work that my parents did to be successful, it just acknowledges the reality of race in in the 60s. The point here (before I really start rambling) is that acknowledging that being white helps and having empathy for those who have had to (and still have to) deal with/fight discrimination is a huge and necessary step in race relations. Good post and very elegantly said.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 9, 2015 -> 03:38 PM) Per the story, he actually committed a crime, received no punishment for it, and then was able to build a life. Real simple question. Is that fair? Do we afford that same chance to people equally today? Or ever? If we do not, should we take that into account? If his family was able to make their lives better, shouldn't we give that same opportunity to others? We as a society are arresting and imprisoning millions of people for a comparable crime in marijuana possession right now and those people are overwhelmingly african american males. Basically the exact thing his family was able to sneak around the law to survive without substantial jail time. I literally couldn't imagine a better example than this if I tried. He wasn't caught. If he was caught and let go while another person was given 100 years, sure, but even then, that would have been 80 years ago or whatever. This is today and you can debate how much time people should get for possession, etc, but the facts are currently people getting busted are getting busted in accordance with our current penile code. Unless of course I'm mistaken.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 9, 2015 -> 02:31 PM) And how many African Americans are currently serving long jail terms in this country for drug crimes comparable to that which your family was privileged enough to be able to avoid? What will you do or support to give them the same opportunity granted to your family? Who the hell cares about what happened to his grandpa back in the 20's or 30's or whenever the hell it was. I am beyond flabbergasted. Do you live your life thinking about where you'd be if x and y didn't happen to your grandparents or your parents or just pass up on opportunities that opened up because somewhere somehow their probably is someone more deserving or someone who had to go through "more" to get there? Do you just live your live dreaming about if only x, y and z happened to my great grand parents and then my parents, etc and then I'd have been something or do you deal with what you were dealt and do the best to make the best of it (through hard work, dedication, etc). My answer to that question for myself is I was dealt a certain hand and went forward to improving the hand I was dealt (and I'm thankful I was dealt a good hand which provided me the opportunity to grow up in a safe environment where learning was encouraged, etc, but that has less to do with my race and more to do with growing up middle class, imo, but someone could go ahead and say different but I'm not going to feel bad for who I am or apologize either) and I take great offense at anyone who would want me to feel bad for what I have accomplished because it is what I HAVE accomplished to date. By the way, having never thought about this until now (cause I could care less what race someone is), I suppose my kids technically are minorities (I think, unless half white counts as white...hell if I know, don't really care to be frank) and I have an expectation that they will get a hand dealt to them (which I hope will be a good hand) and they too can build upon the hand dealt to them and continue enhancing their lives and the hands dealt to them, but also at the same time, being good people / humans who treat people well and continue the trend of being better and more understanding than previous generations, etc. Will they or won't they, hell if I know, and while maybe some ahole will snicker about their race, they will know from a young age to be confident in who they are and I will do everything I can to help teach and promote that.

QUOTE (flavum @ Jul 9, 2015 -> 02:09 PM) I'd love Todd Frazier on this club. If the Sox somehow got back to .500 by July 30, I'd trade Rodon to get him. 30 year old 3rd basemen (or would be, beginning next year) who is eligible for free agency in 2018 and would get a pretty big raise in 2017. I'm not trading Rodon, who is cost controlled for much longer for him. I'd trade for Frazier and think he would be a good get, but Rodon is one of the top young pitchers in the game. I'd give him up for one of the top young position talents in the game but not Frazier.

QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ Jul 9, 2015 -> 12:46 PM) The option is always the last year though, not the first. If he wants that guarantee of a check if he gets hurt, the franchise wants the guarantee that he's going to be there for a while. My mistake, I thought you could put the option year earlier in the contract. I am wrong though.

QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Jul 9, 2015 -> 12:29 PM) You can only have 1 player option. He wants the max under the new cba. So in that case, I'd do my 5 year with player option and then tear it back up and do it all over again in the following year. You still keep the same leverage while having the long-term guarantee. We all know he's opting out again a year from now.

Lebron or his agent really messed up. Evidently he is signing a 2 year, 1+1 deal. I don't understand why he wouldn't have went back with another max deal with consistent out clauses. At least then in instance he has significant injury, he has protection and get all the money. Right now, if he had a horrific injury, he only has 2 years of guaranteed money. Given all the leverage he has, it just seems ludicrous.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 9, 2015 -> 11:57 AM) Welcome to 4 years ago. The Sox heard the Marlins offer, and told him they couldn't offer him anywhere close to that money. This has been known since it happened. Problem is they never asked him how low he'd go and apparently he would have gone pretty low (albeit it sounds like that was only during the season he would have gone that low...we don't know what he would have done once he hit FA and received that offer from the Marlins).

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 9, 2015 -> 12:01 PM) "someone else had to do it years ago that didn't look like them." Highlighting again. Lets cut through all the stuff and just get to the...what do you propose? Should everyone that was born a certain color not accept any job they get or college they got into or move out of their house because of any potential advantage they had in life? And lets go past this, lets take race out of the equation...should everyone be born have to be stripped of any wealth / privileges from their families and be moved to a separate land away from their families so all children can have equal starting points?

QUOTE (bmags @ Jul 9, 2015 -> 10:48 AM) so...the bulls did not sign Aaron brooks back at the vet min. We used a portion of our MMLE, so...we can't sign anyone else better than vet min. Because aaron brooks. Can't wait for the "WELL THIS IS SMART BECAUSE THEY DRAFTED JIMMY BUTLER" comments. I don't know. Was Brooks the best person we could sign? I presume we don't actually have bird rights to him so were actually limited on what we could offer him? I do agree that I'd rather give Lin that money then Brooks.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 9, 2015 -> 09:37 AM) Basically at this point it looks like the Bulls are set up to "try last season's roster again". I don't feel that excited about this situation. And It's not the only team in Chicago I'm expecting to say that about this year. They will add another player, just not sure who. I also don't have a problem with it. We were the 2nd best team in the East and only had like 17 regular season games with the starting lineup in tact. And yes, I say we were the 2nd best and that was fairly obvious in the playoffs. I was incredibly pissed we lost to Cleveland and a lot of guys on our side sucked and Cleveland was playing really hurt but we also had our own issues and had guys who were playing hurt too. Both are probably going to be trends (Noah / Taj / Rose are injury prone) and on Cleveland's side you could make the case that Kyrie and Love are as well. Bulls were still a technical foul call from having total control of that series (and/or a Lebron buzzer beater) so while we'd all love to be the heavy favorites, we still are an extremely competitive team who will be top 5 in Vegas odds, I presume. Behind Spurs / Warriors / Cavs. Not sure if there will be anyone else we will be behind (maybe OKC?).

QUOTE (RockRaines @ Jul 9, 2015 -> 08:38 AM) Man, I've never owned a car that long, how do you guys do it? Doesnt the new models/redesigns just make you want to trade it in? I get tempted and I love new cars but I'm patient. We cycle our cars over ~ 10 years span, so new car every 5 years and we pay it off pretty much immediately when we buy it. Love the lack of car payment and for me (as when we don't have the payment we just have a sub account that we invest in some lower risk, decent dividend / return yielding stuff so that when the 5 years comes, we are ready for the next one, I like a quality car but at same time, would rather have my money invested in the markets (and or have a nicer house) then have it sitting in a depreciating asset. Right now my Pilot is now 11 years old with about 160K miles and to be frank, I still like that a lot more then our 2013 Highlander, although the Highlander obviously gets the bulk of our usage. That said, I officially have the itch because the new Pilot is about to come out but I'm hoping our current Pilot holds out another year (at least) so that I can wait until the kinks get worked out of the new model (as well as any premium / inability to haggle) and then replace the current version. But for me, a car should be comfortable, reliable, and get me from point A to point B. I don't get that excited over how fast it goes (rather have a lil better fuel efficiency, especially since we are a SUV family) cause I don't drive crazy (at one point I did but with the family and other things, just doesn't matter). And all the fancy electronics can be just as much a pain in the rear then anything else (although bluetooth was awesome to have integrated when we finally got the Highlander and ditched my wife's old Isuzu Rodeo that somehow actually was a good car...lasted like 12 years with little maintenance). I do look forward to some of the new features when we finally do upgrade. Note: I should point out my wifes commute to / from work is only like 8 miles round trip so it isn't like the 2nd car gets heavy useage, etc anymore. I tend to do the heavier driving (and all weekend driving) so its just another reason I'd have a hard time justifying buying 2 sets of cars new during shorter periods. All that said, I see a lot of reasons to lease if you want the new cars, etc, and I do occasionally think about it because when some of the lease specials are out their (with negative money factors), I do my financial analysis and it gets more to the point where I could justify the extra cost. But for me, I'd rather just stick the money into 529's, my next house downpayment (doesn't contribute a lot, but hey, every penny counts) and ensure 401K max and any other sort of tax deferral I can do.

QUOTE (bmags @ Jul 9, 2015 -> 08:04 AM) Very upset seeing Lin sign elsewhere on that contract. Yeah, I am more pissed about that then this Jordan stuff, haha.

QUOTE (SleepyWhiteSox @ Jul 8, 2015 -> 11:08 PM) It's all DeAndre though. He cut off contact with the Mavs since Tues. all on his own and contacted Doc/Clips so they could sway him back. So lame. I hope players throughout the league trash talk him so much about how much of a lame he is for this that he shoots under 30% from the line and the clips lose a ton of games almost exclusively by the hack-a-"_" strategy. Wasn't his agent also pretty bad in this deal. Sounds like a lot of stuff said never made it back to DeAndre.

QUOTE (WBWSF @ Jul 8, 2015 -> 04:47 PM) It seems like this subject of White Sox attendance brings out a big response. I've often wondered does anybody who works for the White Sox read any of these comments? I can guarantee it. They are extremely aware of these sites. Does Kenny, probably not, but do people in the marketing department, etc, check in on what fans are saying on Soxtalk (and other sites) most certainly. Will they make changes because of what we said, not when it comes to roster decisions, but absolutely when it comes to product / ball park features, effectiveness of ad campaigns, etc. Not just because 1 person said it, but it is direct feedback that is readily available from a target demographic. That said, they also care about getting the non hard core fans in, but when hard core fans struggle to want to go, how are you going to pull anyone else.

QUOTE (RockRaines @ Jul 8, 2015 -> 01:05 PM) It been manufactured by several different companies over that time period so something doesnt match up there. My 2011 and 2014 grand cherokee have been my favorite cars ever and this was the first real issue. You kept your car for 2+ years. If your car is exploding or having major issues during a 2 year window and that is a general trend, it has got to be a pretty big POS (and that is a general trend, you don't expect new cars to die on you in the first few years or really have any issues outside of routine maintenance..not just a rare your car issue). Jeeps though, have lots of eletrical and build quality issues that show up during 4-5 year ownership durations (let alone 10 year duration vs. what you'd see from other car companies). And despite shifts in manufacturers, a lot of tech doesn't necessarily change, it continues to get leveraged / updated. It isn't as if Dodger joined Mercedes and Mercedes, who didn't build trucks and the like, just threw in new chassi's and instantly mercedez them. Yes, changes happened but cars aren't just entirely flipped over or begin from day 1, they get modified for long periods on existing parts, etc, and with exsiting teams. While I bet some of the car flipped during the pre dodge / post dodge era, I bet a lot also stayed the same (not necessarily parts wise but in terms of teams involved in actually building / designing as well as assembly plants, etc...I have no research to back this up just presuming). And I also said, Jeeps are beautiful cars, fantastic 4 wheel, early on generally nice rides, etc. My dad has a 2015 Cherokee and loves it and I'd say it drives amazingly but that doesn't mean it will do so 5 years from now. My uncle is a mechanic and the only jeep he'll swear by are manual jeep wranglers. Those things, electronics be damn, will run forever. Jeep's automatic tranny's have a lot of issues (Engines are pretty good though), but electronics and water pump are major problem areas (and just general build quality such as plastic / other parts breaking / falling off).

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 8, 2015 -> 02:33 PM) It is the double standard being used in this thread. One note talks about only the most recent history for the Sox, but then is going back to before a good portion of the Bulls fan base can ever remember to explain them. It is silly. What double standard. We could go back to 1990. Our whole point was the Bulls franchise was changed for the better the day Jordan arrived. The Bulls become a show and a phenomena and backed it up with 6 titles and that gave them staying power through a down era and now they are back (not to the level previously) but have been a consistent playoff team and a perennial title contender (favorite, no, but Vegas has long had them amongst the front runners for the title). There is no comparing the Bulls & Sox from 1990 onward. It is a horrible argument. If you want to go back to the pre-jordan era and when the Bulls largely sucked, sure, but fact is, product took a turn for the better and the Bulls became the face of the NBA internationally and did so far a long time (Jordan was a god before he ever won his 1st title so the stretch really was well sustained).

10 teams since 1990 have had fewer playoff appearances then the Sox (I believe): Nats, Rockies, Marlins, Mariners, Orioles, Royals, Mets, Padres, Blue Jays and Rays. On that list, 3 are expansion teams and the list includes 3 world series winners (Blue Jays (1) & Marlins (2)). I'd also say that one thing almost all of those teams has in common is lousy attendance (w/outlier being Nats (new stadium / relocated franchise), Rockies (solid attendance, beautiful stadium, big city, Mets (new stadium pickup, but prior attendance had its own issues when team stunk at Shea) and Mariners (just a strong fan base in general...nice stadium and they benefited heavily from Ichiro and market (heavy Japanese / Asian population).

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 8, 2015 -> 02:29 PM) It is funny that Sox fans will point to only the last 10 seasons to talk about how bad they have had it, but are willing to go back to the 1990's to talk about how good the Bulls have it. 5 postseason appearances and 1 world series ring in 25 years. 20% of the time they made the playoffs. Bulls made playoffs 72% of the time and won 24% of the championships during that era. I think someone else talked about how putrid the Sox run has been over past 40 years even. Its been downright pathetic in terms of making the playoffs and any sort of sustained success. Sox had two / three shots at a run. 93 / 94 and then strike blew it up. Then again in 2000 and we never capped, but made it back in 05 and looked like we could put something together but again, never capitalized.

QUOTE (fathom @ Jul 8, 2015 -> 02:25 PM) I bet him and Frank are the only players anyone would name. Buehrle might get some love.

QUOTE (Buehrlesque @ Jul 8, 2015 -> 02:23 PM) I don't think anybody here is making this point. We're just given the real and logical reasons why people don't go to the Cell, and the factors other stadiums/teams have in their favor. I really don't care about any factor other then performance. Yes, cubs have benefited for whatever reason, but most teams are going to struggle with performance when they haven't had a lot of sustained success and post-season appearances. That is just the reality and more recently we have had some pretty awful teams to watch and as I've alluded to this team this year is probably the worst of the bunch to watch play (even more so then last years team that was horrifically frustrating to watch). When the product on the field stinks and the cost to go to games is their, what incentive does a person have to go pay. You don't get some huge discount on tickets when product sucks. Not much incentive to walk up and in 81 game season and with stadium capacity ~40K, that is a lot of potential seats to fill each and every night. Add in worse defense on the planet, cost, and poor fundamentals and I don't see why you'd watch. Do you pay 10 bucks to see a great movie, sure, lots of people do. Do you pay 10 bucks to see Gigli, hell no (or at least I hope not...that would be a bannable offense). Yes, the 2015 White Sox are the theatric version of Gigle.