HuskyCaucasian

Fox News anchor Shepard Smith with a moment of non-partisan sanity: If America Tortures, "I Want Off The Train!"

QUOTE (BigSqwert @ Apr 22, 2009 -> 02:59 PM) That comment about meeting with communists during the cold war is a flat our b**** slap. Rock on Hillary!

QUOTE (kapkomet @ Apr 22, 2009 -> 01:03 PM) That's stated a hell of a lot better then you said it the first time. Of course we've screwed the pooch over there. If I've said it once, I've said it a thousand times, I am far from the most articulate person in the world. I prefer to let other people fight the battle then say "I agree with him" lol.

QUOTE (kapkomet @ Apr 22, 2009 -> 12:59 PM) Ok, so to make this official, you are saying that THE UNITED STATES is guilty of killing of hundreds of thousands of people on behalf of these governments? I am saying the United States caused a chain reaction that has lead to the current situation. The argument I have been trying to make is that America has not been all innocent in all this. of course we never wanted the leaders of Iraq and Iran to torture and kill innocent life. that's just silly. But like it or not, 9/11 has its root in out middle east meddling. but we find it MUCH easier to just say "it's those crazy turban wearing Muslims that caused all this." It's not that simple, but it's taboo to say otherwise.

QUOTE (ChiSox_Sonix @ Apr 22, 2009 -> 12:58 PM) True. But most of it doesn't also true. But it doesnt help when you waltze in and stir the pot.

QUOTE (ChiSox_Sonix @ Apr 22, 2009 -> 12:57 PM) John Kerry says hi the truth hurts like a b****. We Americans hate to think we could do wrong. Well, we f'ed up the middle east pretty bad.

QUOTE (kapkomet @ Apr 22, 2009 -> 12:56 PM) Are you f***ing serious? um yea. A lot of the $h*t that has happened int he middle east does have roots in American involvement.

QUOTE (kapkomet @ Apr 22, 2009 -> 12:56 PM) Damn. You sunuva. I'm talking modern times. We did imprison the Japanese during WW2

QUOTE (BigSqwert @ Apr 22, 2009 -> 12:55 PM) Sure we did. Ask my native american friends about that one. oh good call.

QUOTE (kapkomet @ Apr 22, 2009 -> 12:54 PM) Never said we didn't, but I sure don't think we made it our official policy to kill thousands of civilians just for fun, either. But we did make it official policy to support people like Saddam and the Afghan government which lead to the killing of hundreds of thousands. We were for them, before we were against them.

QUOTE (DukeNukeEm @ Apr 22, 2009 -> 12:52 PM) Because we had never killed any innocent middle easterners prior to 9/11. nope. never. I've never heard of this country called Iraq until 2002 when I was told they caused 9/11.

QUOTE (BigSqwert @ Apr 22, 2009 -> 12:50 PM) Doesn't seem very effective if you need to do it over 100 times and still get no new info. my favorite comment on this... after about the first 81 times, he might start to get the idea you aren't really going to drown him.

QUOTE (BigSqwert @ Apr 22, 2009 -> 12:39 PM) Let's not forget, one of the reasons Bush gave for going to war was that Saddam tortured people. So we had to torture people to justify a war where we tortured people so we could get somebody else to stop torturing people. :notworthy

QUOTE (BigSqwert @ Apr 22, 2009 -> 12:21 PM) Torturing will only recruit more extremists to want to do more harm to us. "But... but... we did nothing wrong. Terrorists hate us because we are free." WRONG! At the root of extremest hatred for America is our CONSTANT meddling in middle eastern affairs. This dates back to the 70s. Osama's hatred for America is rooted in our presence in Saudi Arabia.

QUOTE (kapkomet @ Apr 22, 2009 -> 12:19 PM) Then why is our current government running away from it as fast as they can? (I know the answer, but I want to see yours. You do realize you're arguing against your whole premise here, right?) Running away from what? Iraq and Afghanistan? We arent running away from Afghanistan, and Iraq has run it course. We can stay there another 20 years and it wont get much better. There will ALWAYS be war there. Ironically, the only way to get fighting to stop is to have a dictator, which we overthrew.

QUOTE (ChiSox_Sonix @ Apr 22, 2009 -> 12:13 PM) Ok, so for the purposes of this argument it's going to be a war then? Just checking because it often isnt. I think it's a war. We invaded other countries to stop it. Over threw the Afgan government. It's a war. If invading, occupying, and overthrowing governments isnt war, I'm not sure what is. That would make anyone captured on Iraq, Afghanistan, or Pakistan POWs. People captured abroad.. like the guy from Canada, is up for further discussion.

QUOTE (ChiSox_Sonix @ Apr 22, 2009 -> 12:13 PM) He was a US citizen. He was held in federal custody and was not part of an organized terrorist group whose main goal in life was to wipe out the United States. Not the same thing. We'll never know. Maybe he was. Should have tortured him. He might have known more.

QUOTE (ChiSox_Sonix @ Apr 22, 2009 -> 12:09 PM) How many American lives would you be willing to trade for the right to say "we do not waterboard in the United States"? 1? 50? 5,000? How would you feel if you lost someone you loved as a result of a terrorist attack on this country that could have been avoided if we were able to gain enough information to stop it ahead of time? I refuse to sell my soul. If we are willing to do ANYTHING to get what we want, that makes us no better than those we wish to torture.

QUOTE (BigSqwert @ Apr 22, 2009 -> 12:12 PM) I think the focus on preventing terrorism is a joke compared to health care. How many tens of thousands of people have died from cancer and other diseases in the past 10 years? How many Americans died from terrorist acts in the last 10 years? Universal health care... bad. Torture... good!

QUOTE (kapkomet @ Apr 22, 2009 -> 12:02 PM) The Constutition is not for non-Us citizens. Then these "enemy combatants" should be tried in an international court, not US.

QUOTE (ChiSox_Sonix @ Apr 22, 2009 -> 12:01 PM) -The Geneva convention treaties were designed to protect prisoners of war and innocent civilians. These terrorists technically are neither. This is the "war on terror", right? So, it's a war, we just never officially declared it. QUOTE (ChiSox_Sonix @ Apr 22, 2009 -> 12:01 PM) -Does our constitution even mention torture?\ Warrantless wiretapping? QUOTE (ChiSox_Sonix @ Apr 22, 2009 -> 12:01 PM) -People like Abu Zubaydah and Khalid Sheikh Muhammad lost their right to "human rights" the second they agreed to help orchestrate and contribute to the murder of thousands of innocent Americans. An act that they also have no remorse for and undoubtedly would support the repeat of if they were ever released. Timothy McVeigh i guess should have been held at Gitmo and subjected to torture as well.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Apr 22, 2009 -> 11:43 AM) Which is why Dick Cheney has been campaigning loudly to get the whole story told. Here's what kinda pisses me off about the whole thing. Cheney keeps saying "but look what info it got us". So, basically, he is saying the ends justify the means, which is NOT what we stand for as a country. We are against torture... no matter what the results. So, for Chaney to say what he is saying, says he doesnt give a rats ass about the constitution, the Geneva conventions, or the rights of humans. As long as we get what we want, the rules be damned.

Thiefs!

QUOTE (smalls2598 @ Apr 22, 2009 -> 09:58 AM) Rose, Toews, Kane, Quentin, Danks.....we sure are experiencing some amazing young talent in Chicago right now. QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Apr 22, 2009 -> 10:09 AM) Don't forget Cutler, Forte Chicago sports shall rise again... minus the cubs

It's the democrats fault!