fathom

Hell of a drive by Cutler and Knox!

That should have been pass interference

QUOTE (MurcieOne @ Oct 24, 2010 -> 07:06 PM) Olin Kruetz just got blow'd the f*** up. Seriously, this is amazing. How the f*** are they this bad? That was as dominating of a play as you'll see from a DT.

It's been almost a month since Jay Cutler last picked up a first down on a 3rd down play.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Oct 21, 2010 -> 03:49 PM) He was clearly pissed because the previous pitches kept nearly hitting him. Terrible pitch selection going with an offspeed pitch after Uribe clearly seemed uncomfortable picking up the Oswalt fastball in that AB.

There's a bit of a 2003 Cubs vibe with the Rangers. Up 3-1 in the series, and everyone seems too confident they'll win based on who they have pitching in game 6 and/or 7.

Balta, with your theory about freeing up money, how do you feel about the Sox basically unloading Buehrle and his huge contract for minimal parts this offseason?

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Oct 20, 2010 -> 10:01 PM) How in the world would you have called that a huge failure? Was keeping Javy Vazquez in 2009 a better option, or were there people who were going to pay a better price? Just like with Swisher, it seemed that KW jumped at the first offer that came across the phone for Vazquez. Now, you might say there's no way to know if that is true or not. However, for him to make a deal so early into the offseason, he must have had some interest in Flowers. The deal is a huge failure if Flowers is a bust because the organization acquired him with thoughts of him being their catcher of the future. We're a team with a 100 million dollar payroll, so we shouldn't be happy just to unload a player's salary for nothing.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Oct 20, 2010 -> 10:47 PM) The key to that deal is and always will be Tyler Flowers. This is how every trade for prospects works out, and why it is so difficult to deal with prospects. Some of them pan out, some of them don't. I've been trying to hammer this point through to the "pro-development" guys around here over and over, but not one ever addresses the downsides of trying to develop your own talent with assets that have a huge fail rate. There are so many costs associated with this beyond what anyone here has pointed out. What we have seen with Beckham and Flowers, amongst some others, is nothing compared to trying to keep 6-8 guys in the picture and have any clue what your collective team is going to perform like. Anyways, I digress...I'm not willing to write off Flowers just yet. Let's see where he is 4-5 years from now before we really know what we've got here. I'm not ready to write off Flowers either, but sadly, the Sox very well could be. We heard how down they were about him during ST of last year, and after this year's dismal season, who knows what opportunities they'll give him. Like you said, Flowers was the key to the deal, and if he doesn't pan out, then the trade was a huge failure.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Oct 20, 2010 -> 09:07 PM) Well, no, because we still moved $22 million/2 years of salary, and while we lost potentially good production in 2009, we avoided paying that kind of money for a guy worth about as much as Kotsay in 2010. I'll be honest, to me, this seems like a very homeristic view of things to excuse KW for a bad trade. This could be what J4Life was talking about, but I don't want to speak for him. I'm sure KW had higher expectations for the trade than simply freeing up Javy's salary.

QUOTE (ChiSox_Sonix @ Oct 20, 2010 -> 08:59 PM) My point was countering the argument that it was another of KW's "awful moves" Can't we just say the Javy deal was awful because we got virtually no Major League production so far from the 4 players we acquired, with the center piece of the deal being a bust so far?

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Oct 20, 2010 -> 08:54 PM) You said: 1. People say "Morel shouldn't be used as a throw-in in a trade because he has a lot of value to us". 2. This statement angers you. 3. You point out that other people actually do seem to value Morel somewhat highly, based on the ranking you gave. 4. You took this to mean that Morel has value to other teams. 5. The step you missed...if Morel has significant value to other teams, then going back to 1; he shouldn't be used just as a "Throw-in" in a deal. He ought to be only dealt if he nets something of value back directly. I probably shouldn't have used Morel as my example, as his status actually blew up this season as a prospect. A better example would have been Flowers after last season. His stock dropped around baseball, but he was actually still a very important prospect for the Sox due to the impending FA status of AJP. There were a lot of other catching prospects ranked above Flowers (the 100 Yankees catching prospects, Ramos, Castro, etc.), so if he was in a deal, it might seem to the Sox like they're giving up a lot but the other teams likely don't value him as much.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Oct 20, 2010 -> 09:38 PM) But that argues quite effectively that the statement Morel should not be a throw-in in another deal is 100% correct. No idea what this is asking, and now I'm concerned I didn't articulate my post as accurately as I wanted. Another thing that frustrates me about how some perceive our minor league system is an argument like this "we might not have good starting pitching in the minors, but we have a handful of good relief arms". No one really cares about relievers in the minors.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Oct 20, 2010 -> 08:37 PM) That being said, I find it a bit disappointing that when a prospect of ours is hyped a bit, there are those that will immediately discount him as flawed and overrated. Even more disappointing to me is the fact that often times, those posters that pointed out the flaws in those prospects are the first to criticize Kenny when that player is later traded. Seems a bit hypocritical in my opinion. There's been plenty of prospects that I've been on the bandwagon for, most notably Beckham and others. What frustrates me is when some of the people on this board don't realize that just because a player is a decent prospect in our system, that doesn't mean they're actually considered a prospect in the overall scheme of MLB. One of my favorite things to say during trade deadline talk is that we shouldn't trade some of our prospects (perfect example is Morel), as the player is probably more valuable to the Sox than they are as a throw-in in another deal because the other team won't value them as high. I do have to say that Morel's #11 ranking in BA for his minor league division (AA, I think) was impressive, as the list was loaded with prospect superstars.

QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Oct 20, 2010 -> 06:45 PM) we give up premium talent to get these guys and then dump 'em off on another team when ozzie doesn't like them for mediocre packages. I couldn't agree more, it's probably been the most frustrating part of the last 3 years.

The Javy Vazquez return has been extremely disappointing so far.

QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Oct 20, 2010 -> 05:21 PM) phillies offense ain't been right all year. I assumed it was all the injuries. But even at full strength they're still struggling. I still can't believe they gave Ryan Howard all that money. Whenever I watch Howard, he seems to be an easy out.

QUOTE (RockRaines @ Oct 20, 2010 -> 03:41 PM) The Question is: Would some of the Anti-Ozzie people on this site be willing to take on Ryno as the next Sox skipper? Not if he's addicted to small ball like he's been in the minors. Quade was a solid hire for the Cubs. The players like him, and he's great at putting out well-constructed lineups.

QUOTE (Athomeboy_2000 @ Oct 18, 2010 -> 07:40 PM) ok, I thought maybe I was just noticing it. Good to know there are others. Heard ZZ last night saying that after the Giants debacle, the Bears offense responded with a great offensive game vs Carolina. Had to laugh at that.

QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Oct 19, 2010 -> 05:39 PM) They've got a bevy of premium pitching prospects not too far away from The Show. They need offense like I need crack. I saw they released Melky today. Wouldn't shock me to see Cabrera with the Sox next year, as he's always been rumored to be a KW favorite.

QUOTE (bigruss22 @ Oct 19, 2010 -> 04:25 PM) It'll be interesting to see where everyone ends up, because apparently Grienke is on the market too now, which could really affect where Lee gets the best offer. I've always felt that when Greinke gets traded, it will be to Atlanta.

QUOTE (buhbuhburrrrlz @ Oct 19, 2010 -> 04:39 AM) gonna vomit when the yanks sign him. Much rather they get him than the Tigers or Twins, two teams that he's been linked to this upcoming offseason.

QUOTE (Athomeboy_2000 @ Oct 18, 2010 -> 08:40 PM) ok, I thought maybe I was just noticing it. Good to know there are others. Could he be compromised by being paid by the Bears to host a show about the Bears show on the Score? Of course, as well as literally standing right behind these guys on the sideline during all the games and trying to get some scoop from them.

QUOTE (RockRaines @ Oct 16, 2010 -> 08:10 PM) There are still alot of question marks with Illinois and OSU, they are both relying heavily on young players. I would say they are both top 10 teams, not sure about top 5. MSU is still the team to beat IMO. Illinois has 3 starters that are seniors. You won't find that very often in college basketball. I'm stunned to see any publication or expert not pick Duke to be #1. Michigan State over them? Say what?

QUOTE (Athomeboy_2000 @ Oct 18, 2010 -> 08:13 PM) Dose anyone else think Zach Zaidman is too much of a Bears cheerleader? He's almost always positive about the Bears. Absolutely, he's TERRIBLE. Never says a bad word about anything relating to the Bears. Hell, he makes Chris Rongey seem like a Sox pessimist.