fathom

QUOTE(nitetrain8601 @ Nov 12, 2005 -> 03:29 AM) I don't think so. The Cubs, even though the Marlins want Pie, will most likely give up Rich Hill(a starter with lots of upside) for Pierre. That leaves the Marlins needing a CFer (Rowand). They also need relievers to bridge the gap between their starters and Todd Jones(assuming they resign him) which would be Damaso. Now we might have to throw in a prospect like Rogo, but I would be fine with that considering we would have Delgado and Kong. Patterson will also be included in any Pierre deal, and he'll be their CF. Rowand, Marte, and Rogo are not enough to get Delgado, let alone have the Marlins pay some of his contract. Don't forget that the Marlins love Contreras and that they think he'd be a hit with the Cubans by playing in Florida.

Um, are some people forgetting what we'd have to give up to get Delgado? It would probably cost the Sox Contreras, and put us without a 5th starter again.

When evaluating any player, you can only give so much credence to their stats before the 2005 season.

Here's my thought on Duque: We all knew he was a risky proposition when we gave him 2 years guaranteed. No way can he be counted on as a starter next year, and he'll likely be on the DL about 2 months out of the season. Will he be paid too much for his 2006 role? Most likely yes. However, he contributed when we needed him in the postseason, so it will make it a lot easier to swallow.

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Nov 11, 2005 -> 10:05 PM) That's honestly the biggest reason I wouldn't want Aaron traded: him, Joe, and AJ are so close and I just don't want to mess with the chemistry of this club. That being said if Aaron could be the center piece for a big bat you obviously have to look into it. As much as Rowand disappointed me at the plate last season, he impressed me just as much with his leadership and attitude. However, if you can trade him with the big picture being that he's a piece to acquire a marquee power hitter, then I have no problem getting rid of him.

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Nov 11, 2005 -> 09:47 PM) Um...el duque. You want to trade Aaron for a top notch starting pitcher and do what with him?? I don't understand what you're trying to say, and if you want to trade him for a prospect I actually have to agree that, that is taking a step backwards, no need to trade Arow for a minor leaguer when you're going to have the Duke to back them up. My idea for trading Rowand would be to get a starter that's coveted by other teams (like Wang), and then use that starter to acquire a hitter. Thus, we wouldn't have to give up one of our core starting pitchers (the heart of this team), and we have Rowand's replacement in CF as a cheap player with a lot of potential. The thing that could be important is giving Anderson the shot in the outfield before the minor league guys below him are ready for the majors.

QUOTE(Kalapse @ Nov 11, 2005 -> 09:45 PM) Rowand = Kotsay Hunter >>> Kotsay Kotsay's arm is infinitely better than Rowand's arm. Hunter's better than both guys when healthy.

QUOTE(nitetrain8601 @ Nov 11, 2005 -> 09:41 PM) I don't think Rowand would be traded in a deal for Delgado if Pierre is dealt to the Cubs. Why? Because FLA wants Pie if for Pierre from the Cubs. Not a chance in hell they get Pie for Pierre. More than likely, Hendry will get the better end of the deal, and it will likely be Patterson and Wellemeyer for Pierre.

QUOTE(Gene Honda Civic @ Nov 11, 2005 -> 09:08 PM) Hudson and Rowand are attracting a lot of attention because they're not just mid-level players. Hudson is the best defensive 2B in the game. That + and average bat is extremely valuable. Rowand is one of the best CFers in the game. CF, specifically in a spacious ballpark, is the most important defensive posistion on the field. Rowand is also only a year removed from a top 10 OPS season in the AL. -- These guys are very good players. Mench can hit HRs, doesn't strike out a lot, and is cheap, thus his value. When I say mid-level, I don't mean that they're average players. Rather, they're not near the superstar level either though. If you've seen the names being thrown around in deals for these guys, you would have thought they were superstars. With the weak FA market, more teams are looking to acquire their big players via trades this offseason.

Well, I guess since the expert has spoken, there's no reason to follow the hot stove this offseason.

QUOTE(Kalapse @ Nov 11, 2005 -> 05:57 PM) I still don't want Rowand traded until after the '06 season. Unless a trade comes up for Delgado, I really don't want to see Row moved. The .900 OPS CF from '04 was so f***in' good, he needs one more season to prove it wasn't a fluke. Or you could trade him now while he still has value. Another subpar offensive season from him, and teams wouldn't be willing to give up much for him at all. From what it seems, mid-level players like Rowand, Orlando Hudson, and Mench are attracting a lot of attention, and there seems to be a pretty nice sized price tag for them also.

If you were to trade Rowand for C. Wang, then you could turn around and include Wang in any trade to try and upgrade our offense. Thus, the Sox could possibly avoid having to give up one of their big 5 starters for next season.

QUOTE(SSH2005 @ Nov 11, 2005 -> 06:39 AM) I don't really buy that about Walker. He still has a lot of value because he is a great stick and makes barely anything ($2.5 million). By the way, Eduardo Perez is 36 years old. I'd rather bring Frank back very cheaply, hope he can stay healthy, and have Gload as a backup DH/1B. Even though I gave my suggestions, I think the most likely scenario is PK signs with the Red Sox, Gload isn't brought back, and Frank signs for about 2.5 mil. Of course, I still stand by my blind prediction from 5 months ago that Carlos Pena will be the starting 1B for the 2006 White Sox (no reasoning for that psychic vision). BTW, I know people suggest that if PK leaves, we should use guys like Rowand, Duque, and Marte to try and trade for a new 1B. I think a trade chip that should really be used is Politte, who on a team like the Tigers might think he can be a closer. We can make Steff happy, and sign Urbina then.

QUOTE(SSH2005 @ Nov 11, 2005 -> 06:31 AM) The Cubs are going to trade Todd Walker for a reliever or in a package for an outfielder. We won't be getting him. Eduardo Perez? You can't be serious. Just don't look at his career numbers. :puke Perez has hammered lefties the last couple of years. If we sign PK, it's likely going to be very difficult to afford a power hitting DH also. Thus, that's the reason for the possible platoon with two guys who are very good against rhp/lhp. Todd Walker's value is going to be extremely low now since all teams know that the Cubs have no intention on bringing him back.

QUOTE(SSH2005 @ Nov 11, 2005 -> 05:23 AM) What would be the best option in your opinion? A trade for Thome or giving the job to Gload? Just curious on what you want to see the Sox to do. If you can sign PK to 4 yr/52 mil, that's great. I wouldn't give him a 5th year. In my opinion, the Sox shouldn't bring back Frank next year. I love him, but you just can't trust him to stay healthy. If you do bring back PK for so much money, you then make sure you resign guys like AJP and Garland, and look for some cheaper replacements at DH. An idea that I was thinking of platooning players at DH, with something like Gload or someone like Todd Walker vs righties, and Eduardo Perez vs lefties. I think people have significantly overstated how much money the Sox would have to spend this offseason though. Let me add this thought also: If PK takes more money to go elsewhere, I won't lose a single second of sleep over it. If anything, it would make me pretty excited to see what else KW might do. It would make things much easier though if KW doesn't have to give up a pitcher to replace the 1B in a trade.

QUOTE(sufferingsoxfan @ Nov 11, 2005 -> 05:03 AM) Helton is a damn good player but has an albatross of a contract. And so might PK in a few weeks. If a team signs him to 5/65, they're going to regret it.

QUOTE(Jeckle2000 @ Nov 11, 2005 -> 02:15 AM) When we were at our hottest Rowand was our three hitter almost every game... Also I do expect Konerko to be gone... I just can't see KW giving him a 5 year deal, although I would love to be proved wrong there for sure... Rowand had 3 homers in 139 AB out of the 3rd spot. Especially if we lose a 40 homer hitting number 4 hitter, that's unacceptable. Rowand needs to be lower in the order to concentrate on hitting before he becomes the 4th outfielder on the club.

QUOTE(Jeckle2000 @ Nov 11, 2005 -> 01:37 AM) Heres what I think they should do... Move Rowand into RF, move Anderson into CF, move Dye to 1B, sign or trade for a power bat to DH... Then the lineup for next year looks like this... Pods-LF Iguchi-2B Rowand-RF Power bat- DH Dye-1B Anderson-CF AJ-C Crede-3B Uribe-SS Just say no to Rowand in the 3rd hole. Unless we're facing lefties 162 games a season, he should be batting 7th.

Everyone knows I was one of Ozzie's biggest critics during the season. Outside of maybe one or two calls in the playoffs, I thought he managed perfectly. However, the thing I've most been impressed with Ozzie since the end of the regular season has been the way he's handled himself. He seems to be a lot more serious lately than he was, and I think that reflects well on Ozzie. Every interview I've seen/heard, he's been very centered and hasn't been the loose cannon that he was. I don't care who our manager is.....anyone that leads the White Sox to the World Series is a legend in my book. Congrats Ozzie!

QUOTE(CWSGuy406 @ Nov 10, 2005 -> 09:19 PM) That trade would be awful... I agree with that, but you know KW and Ozzie want more speed, and Pierre's one of the few marquee speed guys who's available.

Alex Gonzalez of the Marlins is not a better player than Uribe. Gonzalez has a subpar attitude, can't hit a slider if his life depended on it, and will cost at least 5 mil per season.

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Nov 10, 2005 -> 08:23 PM) I'm personally a big fan of Ross and would have no problem with him starting at first if we added a top notch dh. That being said, imo Kenny is just saying that for leverage in the trade market, he doesn't want other gm's to believe that he needs another first baseman. I would highly doubt Gload is our starting 1b next year. Perfectly said

QUOTE(Steff @ Nov 10, 2005 -> 04:17 PM) Link... ? Cause for some crazy reason.. I've never heard this and I've been following Kenny's career since Cleveland. Reported by two different radio stations during the following offseason. Is it accurate? Who knows. The people saying it sure seemed like they had inside information. But in all honesty, a lot of people on here, including you and myself, receive inside information from different sources. A lot of the time, it ends up being false. However, it doesn't mean that the posters should get ripped on for sharing the information that they've been told/heard. These aren't the type of rumors like "I was walking in the airport, and overheard KW on the phone, etc.".

QUOTE(Steff @ Nov 10, 2005 -> 04:13 PM) Good grief... Mark is a Cardinals fan.. guess he shouldn't be allowed to play for us anymore either. Well, you never hear stories about how Buehrle doesn't feel right playing for the Sox because he's a Cardinals fan. These are the exact type of stories that were said about Lofton after the season in which he played for the White Sox.

Two things: - Ozzie knew Pierre when he was with the Marlins. In my mind, Ozzie and KW would jump at the chance to trade Rowand and a prospect for Pierre. - Furcal wants a 5 yr deal. If we're not going to give PK a 5 year deal, we're not going to give it to Furcal. I'll still be STUNNED if he doesn't sign with the Cubs.