Rex Hudler

And then b**** like crazy when Griffey's career ends with a knee injury and the Sox are on the hook paying him $12.5 million through 2008!

The rumor was posted on WSI as "someone called into the wise guys and said this deal could be done".... A bunch of hot air, if you ask me.

You aren't......... the choice is up to the SoxTalk staff. If they want to show all of the entries after the fact, they can do so.

I think Jason wanted these logos emailed, not posted on here. I don't think a popularity contest is what the idea was. Just a thought.

Not necessarily UNS. The discussions of trading Perez began before they moved Kevin Brown. Since then it has been mere speculation that they would still move him.

1. Not saying anything about Cooper's ability. Just that it wasn't very smart trying what they did with Cotts at the time they did it. 2. Don't know or care who made the decision, just that it was stupid in how they handled it. I wouldn't even had minded them starting Cotts against the Yankees if they would have announced it a week earlier, stated they had confidence in Neal and were going to stick with that decision regardless of wins and losses earlier in the series. If you are going to throw a guy out there, stand behind him so he knows you are behind him. The Sox certainly did not do that in this case.

Cotts throws 89-91, Moyer is more like 84-86. Cotts deception has a lot to do with his motion, not just changing speeds. Moyer never had a strikeout rate of 11.2 per 9 innings. Cotts batting average against was .178 last year. Moyer was at .246. I haven't seen Moyer a lot in recent years, but I don't recall him getting hitters out up and down much. He's pretty much a stay down and away, while coming inside on occasion, type pitcher, ala Tom Glavine. That is not Cotts.

I don't see any Jamie Moyer type comparisons or similarities at all.

UNS, the problem is, I don't think LA deals Perez unless they have a deal done for Maddux. It could happen, but I don't think it would.

baggs, aboz and others have given some good info on Cotts so I will try not to repeat it, Here are some other thoughts..... 1. Cotts flat out knows how to pitch. He is a rare pitcher that knows how to use all four quadrants of the strike zone rather than just pitching in and out. His ability to change speeds, coupled with deception and use of all four quadrants of the zone make him very difficult to hit. I saw him many times freeze hitters and get a K looking because hitters weren't expecting to see what they got. He doesn't follow normal pitching patterns. Being able to do that, allows you to expand the strike zone on hitters which makes you that much more effective. That didn't work in the Majors because he was never able to establish himself and his ability to work the entire zone. Once he gets comfortable and establishes his confidence, you will see his ability to get hitters out increase tenfold. 2. The Sox did Neal no favors by trying to teach him to throw a cutter almost immediately after his MLB arrival. What does that say to a kid other than "We don't think you are good enough"? Why not give a kid a chance to use the stuff that was supposedly good enough to get him there in the first place and develop some confidence first, then try to add to his repertoire? Trying to change him after his initial bad outing only drives his confidence down. 3. The Yankee Stadium debacle was the final straw. Cotts was set up to fail in that game. Manuel teetered all week over whether Cotts of Buehrle would start. No one knew who would go and both pitchers were in limbo (is it any wonder BOTH lost?). Basically, Manuel said that if the Sox win the first two games of the series, then Cotts would go because the series was already won and that game was less important (yeah, right). If they lost one of those games, he would go with Buehrle because they would then need that game to win the series. Couple that with the fact the whole Sox clubhouse wanted Buehrle to get the start, and you have a perfect molotav cocktail ready to blow. What else could have that done to a pitcher who was already struggling than completely f*** up his mindset? As I said, the Sox set him up to fail, so that debacle should have come as no surprise. 4. If you look at his outings for the Sox, there are a few silver linings. His first outing was horrible, there is no disputing that. However, I believe that can certainly be chalked up to nerves. He basically had to fly across the country and jump right onto the mound. That outing should be tossed out the window. His second outing @ Texas showed promise. He only walked two hitters and struck out six, including ARod twice. The Sox should have pulled him after 5 innings when he had only given up one run. Getting him off the mound with a successful ending would have done wonders for his confidence. Ffor those wondering, yes, I was saying this before the 6th inning even started. Instead they ran him back out there to face ARod a 3rd time. He gives up a solo HR to ARod and then walks a couple. He gets two outs, but leaves with (I believe) the bases loaded, where the bullpen came in and gave up a hit allowing his last two runs to score. Even with the rocky 6th inning, the outing was something to build on. The third outing was tough because he had to face the same Rangers team within a week. There is a definite advantage to the hitters in this situation. He was also making his home debut so there was added pressure with lots of friends and family around. I'm not making excuses, just stating why this wasn't just simply his "3rd start". He got the win in this start but didn't pitch particularly well. He looked like he did early in the season in AA, when he allowed runners to reach and then got out of jams. He only allowed one run, but 5 hits and 5 BB. it was encouraging to see he could work himself out of trouble, especially considering the Rangers were likely to have more success against him than the first time. All things considered, it was a so-so outing, but it was his first MLB win and an outing to build on. Last comes the Yankee Stadium debacle which has already been chronicled. I think too many Sox fans remember his first and last outings and fail to look at the things he showed in between. There were definitely things to build on. I have no doubt that if Neal had made his 4th start against Detroit, he would have pitched much better and continued to start for the Sox. How he would have fared the rest of the season is tough to tell, but I think it is a mistake to allow the two bad outings to overshadow the big picture with him. All that said, there is no doubt Neal needs to continue to get better. His walk totals, pitch counts, etc, all make life harder for him. But the pure fact is, hitters don't hit him well. He gave up 2 HR, a .178 avg against and only 67 hits in 108 IP. If he can hone his command and gain the confidence to utilize all areas of the strike zone, that will allow him to expand it on hitters and you will see where the above numbers came from. Four starts is too soon to judge any pitcher, especially a young one who had thrown no more than 2/3 of a season in AA. Keep in mind Buehrle made the jump, but they also eased him into the game using him out of the bullpen. A lot can happen down the road, but I am confident Neal will be back with the Sox, whether this year or next, and become a solid MLB pitcher.

Thurston was supposed to be ready to step into the Majors last year and was a big reason they traded Grudz and Karros to the Cubs. He had a horrible spring and couldn't win the 2B job, which contributed to making that trade look so bad. His average in AAA last year dropped from .334 in 2002 to .290 last year. His SB's went from 22 to 1. Some may feel he is still a legit prospect, but last year was definitely disappointing for him. He was BA's #5 prospect for the Dodgers last year and dropped out of the top ten this year. Sometimes guys have setbacks and they bounce back, so anything is possible for "joey Ballgame" as he was called.

Those throws from the hole might be a tad tough.

LOL I knew that was going to come from somewhere..... surprised it didn't come sooner!

Yeah, right....... you'd b**** because we haven't won two! LOL

Only partially baggs....... In reality, fans can have great experiences at the ballpark and their lives can be enriched by those experiences. To be so tense in life to complain constantly about wins and losses in an entertainment venue seems overblown. One can find ways to enjoy sports and sporting events without being so intense, yet retain or even exceed their current quality of life. Sorry for my zen-like state this afternoon, but I do think there is some validity here.

I'm taking a new stance........ To hell with winning...... just focus on going out to the ballpark and having a good time. Enjoy a dog and a beer and some quality time with your kids. Use the ballpark to do business, to have a good time with your friends. Fun can still be had without a WS Title, damnit!

You can break it up into 2 or 3 posts.

No, Mussina didn't threaten him. But Mussina could have spoken up and said "Hey, this wasn't a surprise. I was told the day before the game I wasn't going to pitch unless we went extra innings. I don't have any problems with Cito because he told me up front what they were going to do. Sure I would have liked to have pitched here at home, but that's the way it goes sometimes. They needed guys to be able to pitch in case the game went to extra innings. It's not that big of a deal" A statement like that would have very much lightened the load, so to speak and taking much of the heat off Gaston. That didn't happen. I wish I could remember all of the details. But the blow up after that All-Star Game is what changed how manager's managed it and led to the tie a few years ago. Which I still see as no big damned deal, but hey, that's me.

Nope, not close.

Some grudges are more understandably harder to let go than others. Especially one where you received death threats!

Brando, I agree with your comments except for the one above. Who the hell casres if we win or lose a trade as long as we win on the field? If the trade helps the Sox do that, what Thomas does in LA would not matter one iota! And just to clarify, none of my scenario was pointed at you or your willingness to admit you were wrong. You just happened to make the comment that you would stop going, so I was playing on that comment, not you personally. All that said, I don't think the trade happens. But it is intruiging to think about nonetheless.

I believe Mussina either made comments about not getting to play in the game in Baltimore or he didn't say anything to the media letting them know that he knew ahead of time he would not pitch. The media basically crucified Gaston for not playing Mussina and Mussina didn't come to Gaston's defense. I can't recall if Mussina was vocal about it or not, but even sitting silent would have allowed the media to continue to roast Cito.

The only thing I don't agree with him on is that Maggs is worth the same type of contract as Guerrero and Tejada. Personally, I wouldn't give Maggs a 5 or 6 year deal. the Sox have already been burned by bad contracts enough. There is no way I would guarantee anyone that much money for that length of time. As good as Maggs has been, I fear that 3 years from now he will be hitting .290 with 32 HR and 95 RBI while grounding into 23 DP's. Solid numbers yes, even good numbers, but not $12 million numbers.

I believe he was a 6-year free agent and signed with the Cardinals.

Two things...... first, for clarification, Pacheco will play this season at 25. He did not turn 25 until 2 days before the end of last season. It's not a major issue, just clarifying that you were basically adding a year. Second, let's talk hypothetically..... Let me qualify by saying I am not indicating any preference for or against this possible trade, just bringing up a thought. You wrote: Let's say the trade happens. Whether other prospects are involved are not significant for this scenario. If Perez comes over to the Sox and goes 16-8 and helps the Sox win the AL Central going 89-73, would you come back for the playoffs? Would you admit the move worked out (regardless of what Frank did in LA) or stick to you guns and no longer be a Sox fan regardless? Don't say "it won't happen" because we are talking hypothetically. The question is, IF this happens, what do you do? Stick to your guns or admit you were wrong and jump on the bandwagon?