TheBigHurt35

QUOTE(Texsox @ Mar 9, 2005 -> 08:30 AM) The laws are in place to stop the shell game that happens when corporations, big and small, are caught. Get convicted of bid rigging, "sell" the company to your right hand, and continue as if nothing happened. There are corporate punishments for this activity, one of which is being suspended from bidding on government contracts. Any corporate punishments, will have to be dealt with by Halliburton as the owner. This type of crime is systematic, not individual, and corporations are help accountable. That corporate entity is now Halliburton. You are correct that Haliburton may be suspended from bidding on government contracts, fined, etc. But individuals at Haliburton prior to 1998, such as Cheney, are free from prosecution for crimes committed by individuals at KBR. That was my point.

QUOTE(Texsox @ Mar 9, 2005 -> 08:19 AM) I just think we have a few very nice ladies here and when they point out an inequity, we should maybe look at it and see if it is valid. Of course, these ladies failed to account for all the times that I called Saddam and Kim Jong Il "worthless pieces of crap." :rolly But I understand their point (and yours) and will be more sensitive to this issue in the future.

QUOTE(Texsox @ Mar 9, 2005 -> 07:59 AM) Very adult attitude :headshake My, aren't we in a crappy mood today?

QUOTE(Texsox @ Mar 9, 2005 -> 07:58 AM) KBR doesn't exist as a separate entity anymore! KBR = Halliburton. To hold KBR, you have to hold Halliburton. They are one in the same. Legally, when you buy them, they are now you. The KBR that may have violated the law doesn't exist. Further, when you buy something for billions of dollars you spend millions of dollars on forensic accounting to track every penny going back a long time. That is why these mergers take months and months to complete. We seem to be confusing companies with individuals. The individuals who worked at KBR and allegedly committed these crimes should be punished if they are found guilty. The people who worked at Haliburton prior to the purchase of KBR have nothing to do with it and, therefore, should not be prosecuted. You're assuming that bid rigging is easy to discover and that the individuals involved didn't go out of their way to destroy the evidence. I'm not so sure that's the case. You don't think that would be difficult to cover up? All they'd have to do is have the employees set up personal accounts. And what's wrong with purchasing a company that may have done something illegal in the past? Are we to demonize Verizon for purchasing MCI/WorldCom? Hell, Verizon was fully aware of the fraud going on there.

QUOTE(Texsox @ Mar 9, 2005 -> 07:47 AM) The ladies are complaing that she had to be identified as a b**** "If the shoe fits..."

This guy was on O'Reilly last night. I almost hope that he's lying because, if what he's saying is true, CU is a complete disgrace to academia. I would never accept a job there, nor would I allow my children to enroll there.

QUOTE(YASNY @ Mar 9, 2005 -> 06:43 AM) It may be difficult to argue, but I'll take a shot at it. First, we don't seem to get much out of them for our money except a bunch of partisan politics and rhetoric. Second, after one term in office they are on a lifetime pension, which is basically 100% of their congressional salary, iirc. Damn right they are overpaid. You sure that their pension is 100% of their salary? If that's the case, I may agree with you.

QUOTE(chimpy2121 @ Mar 8, 2005 -> 10:06 PM) I just think its bulls*** that congress has voted to raise their salaries 4 times since the last time minimum wage was increased. IIRC, the base salaries for Congressmen is about $140,000. Given that importance of their jobs and the fact that they need to maintain two residences, it's difficult to argue that they're overpaid.

QUOTE(ChiSoxyGirl @ Mar 8, 2005 -> 06:46 PM) Well, I think that's sort of the point. Everyone rushed to call her a commie b****--but her boyfriend said stuff that was just as offensive and only half the outrage. OK, he's an asshole and a commie idiot as well. Happy?

QUOTE(LowerCaseRepublican @ Mar 8, 2005 -> 10:48 PM) Yes, the SEC with its Bush appointees is on a partisan witch hunt. No, I was talking about the people who are trying to hold Cheney responsible for what KBR did prior to 1998. And I don't mean you.

QUOTE(LowerCaseRepublican @ Mar 8, 2005 -> 11:05 PM) BigHurt, making strides from authoritarianism, my ass. The House of Saud has tons of blood on its hands. There is just no huge anti-Saud PR effort like there was to build up the Iraq war showing off what the House of Saud has done. Agreed that the powers that be in Saudi Arabia are corrupt and evil and that the recent elections may be nothing more than a fascade. But, PR compaign or not, they're still no match for Saddam in terms of ruthlessness. Saudi Arabia didn't murder tens of thousands of its own people with chemical weapons. Saudi Arabia didn't kill millions of its own waging on unprovoked war on Iran. Saudi Arabia didn't invade Kuwait (again, unprovoked). King Fahad didn't terrorize and murder his own citizens with his secret police (at least, not to the extent that Saddam did). Crown Prince Abdullah doesn't torture Saudi olympians for not winning gold metals and rape women for sport. I'll accept the argument that Kim Jong Il's government may be as bad as Saddam's was, but the House of Saud isn't quite there yet.

QUOTE(Texsox @ Mar 8, 2005 -> 05:50 PM) Think about it first. KBR violates a bunch of laws then is purchased by Halliburton. Are you saying no one should be held accountable? KBR doesn't exist anymore, it IS Haliburton. So a company could break a bunch of laws, then sell, and be off the hook? So, how would have Haliburton known that KBR violated those laws? The SEC didn't know until just recently and it was allegedly going on since the mid-80's. The people who voilated the laws at KBR should be held accountable. Unless these laws were violated after the Haliburton purchase, Haliburton has nothing to do with it. And what would this "investigative work" shown? For all we know, Arthur Anderson was cooking KBR's books. Until someone can show me some concrete evidence that Haliburton actually DID SOMETHING ILLEGAL, this is just a partisan witch hunt.

QUOTE(Texsox @ Mar 8, 2005 -> 05:20 PM) You said he didn't make any accusations about why they were trying to kill him, I pointed out he was dead. Who knows what he was thinking? The moment they opened fire, everyone in that car was targeted for assassination. Was it premeditated and specifically targeted at her? I don't know, only an investigation will prove or disprove that. My gut tells me not. We have overstressed, lesser trained, personell there and I can see a shoot first, save my ass, and let someone else sort it out, attitude taking place. I know that's what I would do. Earlier YASNY mentioned is we targeted her, she would have been dead. I agree, we probably would have used something a bit stronger than rifles. However, we have sometimes let assassination targets slip past, just ask Castro. Agreed, but the Castro comparison is laugable. Ms. Segrena didn't have an army protecting her on that Baghdad road.

QUOTE(FlaSoxxJim @ Mar 8, 2005 -> 04:25 PM) Sure, Cheney and the larger Haliburton entity should be held accountable for what KBR did before the acquisition, but there are other issues that should bear scrutiny. First, why did Cheney not do his homework at the time of the merger, shed light on the dubious practices of KBR and walk away from the deal? More likely, Cheney/Haliburtin DID do their homework and DID find slime under the rocks but chalked it up to business as usual and proceeded with the merger. Unless KBR engaged in these illegal practices AFTER being purchased by Haliburton, there's no legal basis for holding Haliburton responsible. And what makes you think that Haliburton could've uncovered any evidence of bid rigging? I realize that you dislike Cheney but, come on. Let's be reasonable.

QUOTE(southsider2k5 @ Mar 8, 2005 -> 01:30 PM) This is the line that got me. They are dissing the guy because he thinks for himself, and is willing to work with people on the other side. That is just messed up. What? You didn't realize that we elect and pay the salaries of these public officials just so they can bicker with one another? Didn't you get the memo?

Anybody who is relying on Social Security, either in its current incarnation or Bush's proposed plan, to float them through retirement is massively screwed.

QUOTE(Texsox @ Mar 8, 2005 -> 12:15 PM) Dead men don't talk And your point is...? I would've had no problem with Ms. Sgrena saying that our troops are stupid or incompetent (hey, they did shoot at her car), but saying that our government targeted her for assassination is completely irresponsible and indefensible.

QUOTE(Queen Prawn @ Mar 8, 2005 -> 11:28 AM) Since she is a "b****" does that make the dead man an asshole or a bastard or both? Neither, since I never heard him accuse our government of plotting to assassinate him.

So, tell me again why Lieberman is still a Democrat?

QUOTE(Pale Hose Jon @ Mar 8, 2005 -> 10:59 AM) I did some research and nearly every list of the worst dictators in the world show crown prince abdullah of saudi arabia ahead of sadam hussein. So using your reasoning we should invade Saudi Arabia correct? Most of the 9/11 hijakers are from SA, it is the most oppressive country in the world. http://archive.parade.com/2003/0216/0216_dictators.html The problem is that you're getting your "facts" from Parade Magazine. While I do not disagree that Saudi Arabia's government is very corrupt, I strongly disagree that they're worse than Saddam's regime or the former Taliban regime. The Saudi government is also going through reform now, something that would've been unthinkable in Saddam's Iraq.

QUOTE(YASNY @ Mar 8, 2005 -> 04:37 AM) You come in here with that vile anti-American crap and then complain about that? Man, you got your nerve. I imagine you can just get used to anti-Canadien sentiments. You're probably more responsible for turning the opinions of many American posters against Canada than anything coming out of the press. Yeah, it takes a real man to throw bombs at the U.S. government from behind a computer screen in Manitoba. :rolly KWF's actually doing us moderates and conservatives a favor. He's aligning leftist ideology with people of his intellectual caliber, which will almost ensure another Republican victory in 2008. Keep up the good work, Kip! :finger

QUOTE(EvilJester99 @ Mar 8, 2005 -> 10:03 AM) Wouldn't it kind of stand to reason that since she hates America more than the terrorists that she would have no problem lying about certain facts to make the US look bad?? Or that the terrorist would lie about releasing her without accepting any money from the Italian government?

QUOTE(LowerCaseRepublican @ Mar 8, 2005 -> 12:24 AM) Yeah fighting in Afghanistan where terrorists actually were. Totally not doing anything. http://www.canada.com/national/features/af...stan/index.html He didn't claim that "terrorists" were in Iraq. Just an evil dictator committing attrocities. Try reading next time.

QUOTE(EvilMonkey @ Mar 7, 2005 -> 11:01 PM) If you are so damn willing to 'protect' after the 'many horrific examples of inhumanity', why do you have such a bug up your ass about helping out in Iraq? Were there not attrocities happening there? Were there not mass graves? Was Saddam not gassing and killing his own people? Was Saddam not starving his people while building palaces of gold? And before you even start in with 'NO WMD's', that shouldn't matter, not if you really wanted to 'Protect'. Get off your f***ing high horse you arragont little pissant country and do something that matters. Couldn't have said it better myself.

QUOTE(Texsox @ Mar 8, 2005 -> 12:05 AM) If it was an accident, what difference does it make what political views the journalist who is living or the DEAD Special Ops Agent have? It wouldn't, but they're claiming that it WASN'T an accident. That's where the problem lies.