YASNY

QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Nov 16, 2007 -> 08:51 AM) So, this question, basically, was put to the Democrats in the debate last night. I saw answers from Kucinich, Richardson and Obama. Kucinich was predictable - no it isn't working, and get out now. Richardson said no also, but added his usual spiel about engaging regional partners, finding a political solution, and then leaving. Obama echoed the regional partners and political solution thing, but he actually acknowledged that the surge was undoubtedly working in some neighborhoods. Just interesting to see the differentiation there, for those who care about the Dem nominee. I am glad, I suppse, that Richardson and Obama are talking about the political situation. But I still think none of them really know what's going on over there. Not to be trite, NSS, but do you?

QUOTE(Texsox @ Nov 16, 2007 -> 07:27 AM) I find it odd that anyone would think that the laws of the US and a third world country should be the same. Each country has different needs, different budgets. In Mexico, maquiladoras (manufacturing plants) are required to provide transportation, a Doctor, and meals. It's what they need, it would not work in the US. One could say the US is hypocritical for providing foreign aid like food and medicine but will not enact laws to provide the same for their own workers. I find it odd that the leader of another nation should have any say so about our nations immigration policies and discussion of those policies among our candidates.

It'd be nice if Kenny signed Hunter To replace that old 'Husker punter and if he deals Crede to the the thirdbase needy Getting Cabrera would be a real stunner Limerick style

QUOTE(kapkomet @ Nov 16, 2007 -> 08:51 AM) Yup. That's right. Corporations can't do deals without the "sports and entertainment" schmoozing, hence the corporate suites. It's an absolutely disgusting industry. As much as we b**** about politics and money and people's struggles, it costs the common family tons of money to watch a GAME now. It's insane. How far does it go? Baseball made over $6BILLION last year. As long as we keep paying, they'll keep raising the prices. And as long as we keep buying Budweiser and Gillette Foamy, they'll keep paying baseball to advertise at the park and on their telecasts, then continue to raise their prices to cover the increased ad costs. All baseball has to do is make sure they don't kill that golden egg laying goose.

I'm just glad that we'll never have to hear "There's never been any solid evidence that Bonds used steroids." Well now there is. A positive test is now public record.

QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Nov 15, 2007 -> 11:41 AM) That's why I don't drink bottled water - the bottle itself. And I knew some of them were just tap water. But the organic farms, I have it on good source in some cases, not to mention I watch them work. I have no doubt that some "organic" stuff isn't as organic as we are led to believe. But there are people who have a mind as yours or mine for these things, and are farmers, so there are some people who do produce real organic. And the more push there is for it, the more market there is, the more of that there will be. I can agree with that.

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Nov 15, 2007 -> 11:26 AM) Both Aquafina and Dasani, owned respectively by Pepsi and Coke, are filtered tap water. There are some that are actually pumped out of the ground or from mountain springs or something like that...but that alone means very little to me (seriously, anyone who wants to take a drive up to Owens Valley, look for the Crystal Geyser water bottling plant right along the shores of Owens Dry Lake. It's located in one of the worst environmental areas on the planet). And the major food companies have been lobbying basically as far as I can tell since the word "Organic" was invented for looser standards on what qualifies as organic so that they could label their products as such without having to change their production processes much. For reference, I'll just include the first example that pops up on the Google. Thank you. I'm not much on remembering exactly where I read things as I'm more of a ingest the knowledge type of guy. I'll get on roll when I read something that interests me, and search for more 'knowledge'. Of course, I don't believe everything I read and I do try and use the consider the source approach.

QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Nov 15, 2007 -> 10:56 AM) Actually, I'd suggest you can avoid all of those things you list if you so choose. And that's where the power of the consumer comes in... You can choose to buy fruits and vegatbles from organic markets (or organic brands). I've actually been on organic farms - we have some land in Wisconsin very near one of the farms run for the Organic Valley brand you may have seen in the store, and we've bought from them directly on occasion. You can choose to eat meats that are organic and given organic feed. This all gets back to the food source thing I mentioned here previously - that's going to be a bigger and bigger thing. You can choose to drink bottled water that is not flouridated too - but then, to be honest, I think you are shortchanging yourself a bit. That flouride isn't a bad thing, from everything I've read. This also, to me, ties into people coming up with ways to provide their home's energy independently by way of solar cells, small wind turbines, etc. Living off the grid, or less on the grid in any case, will be a growing trend. You are a very trusting soul. I for one don't believe that most organic ingestibles are as organic as you are lead to believe. Also, from what I have read is most bottled water is ... you ready? ... tap water. Then you get the plastic bottles that are being sold by the billions because they can sell tap water for $1.29 a bottle filling our landfills. When will those biodegrade? Oh yeah, the bottles also happen to be a petroleum based product. So, what is being pumped into the air as those plastic bottles are being produced?

QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Nov 15, 2007 -> 10:35 AM) That's pretty much my point. The CO2 is emblamatic of the larger, overall issue. Just a single indicator, if you will, that gives us a clue as to how much other crap we're tossing into out environment. I note your point, but mine was what we are tossing into our bodies. And it has to be by design as it's damn near everything we ingest. When you sit back and look at it, what choices do we have? Can we avoid drinking flouridated water? Can we avoid eating fruits and vegetables that aren't laced with pesticides and/or preservative chemicals? Can we avoid eating meat that hasn't been fed with pesticide laced corn or whatever. There is something sinister going on, and it goes well beyond the Bush administration. Also, it's been building for about 40 years, at least.

We are toxifying ourselves, for sure. Flourine in our water. Pesticides on our crops. Mind altering drugs being prescribed by our physicians left and right. Who knows what they are putting in the skies with chemtrails. It isn't just CO2, my friend. It's damn near everything we eat, drink or breathe.

QUOTE(Texsox @ Nov 15, 2007 -> 09:47 AM) Friends of Tex from the lunatic fringes It's Jim and he to accept the challenges. I hold my breath, waiting for Nantucket Responsibility? I will simply duck it Duck responsibility, is that what you said? May the bird of paradise s*** on your head.

QUOTE(southsider2k5 @ Nov 15, 2007 -> 09:04 AM) For that, they can have him. I'll take Aaron for 4/48 versus Torii for 6/90. Hell I'd rather have Owens in CF for 400k than pay Hunter that much for that long. Agreed. And he'll be out of our division, so we benefit there.

QUOTE(Texsox @ Nov 15, 2007 -> 07:53 AM) They would say it was idle speculation, but slander works. In this case, the slander may bite Romney more than it bites Thompson.

QUOTE(Texsox @ Nov 15, 2007 -> 08:10 AM) Last night as I shuffled off to bed thoughts of this thread played all in my head a topic we have not started before B4! Bingo cried Jim from the Florida old men's store That Bingo reference was less than great. And I can't recall if there is a G48.

QUOTE(BearSox @ Nov 14, 2007 -> 10:43 PM) what RockRaines said... With the lack of black ballplayers in MLB these days, that makes it seem like a moot point. You saw my response to Rock. Your remark could be interpretted as a backhanded slap at the Sox because they haven 't had a completely black outfield for several years. I was hoping that wasn't the case and that you'd clarify.

QUOTE(Jenksismyb**** @ Nov 14, 2007 -> 10:17 AM) Didn't the military sieze like 20k tons of weapons and ammo just in the last month or so? Aren't they more effective in their pursuit of the cells of insurgents that are still terrorizing parts of the country? My thinking is that the leaders of the insurgency are finally at a point where they understand that if they continue as they were they'd be finished in the short-term. However if they scale back and regroup they'll be more effective in the long term. This means not only entering the political arena, but also restrategizing their hope to take over the country. I was a pro-war guy in the beginning who has watched this admnistration continually f*ck up to the point it's almost laughable how they handled this war. But I'm also convinced that by leaving now we'd lose any long-term benefit of going there in the first place. That being said, I think this reduction in attacks is only temporary. I really see it as the insurgent leadership getting smart and realizing they can do more harm later if the relax their efforts a bit. You are correct. The terrorists have changed their tactics many times, then we'd change ours, which would cause them to change again.

QUOTE(kapkomet @ Nov 14, 2007 -> 10:16 AM) First enforce the laws that exist. That would pretty much "strengthen our borders" by cutting off the demand for illegals alone. There's that word again.

QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Nov 14, 2007 -> 10:09 AM) I'd think you could do both at the same time. But, if you had to pick one or the other, I think you'll get much more bang for your buck by addressing the demand first. Think about the math. You want to REALLY secure the border with Mexico? A wall as some have discussed, or heck even the virtual wall I have proposed, you are talking tens of billions of dollars (or for the wall, hundreds of billions). For a tiny fraction of that, you can enact tougher laws, and hire a few hundred people whose job it is to find, clean out, fine and collect from businesses who hire illegals. As demand plummets, people will stop being in such a hurry to come across. Enact tougher laws? You mean like the current immigration that get ignored by illegals and liberals now? Nope ... secure the borders first, keep Al Qaida out. Then worry about clearing out the illegals already here while we then implement a guest worker program and go after those that hire illegals.

QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Nov 14, 2007 -> 09:58 AM) Much of the discussions we had about Blackwater, DynCorp and other private security firms in Iraq was in other Iraq threads, but there is a lot of discussion, so here is a new thread. Update: FBI says at least 14 Blackwater shooting cases unjustified. I don't doubt it a bit. We shouldn't have hired a bunch of cowboys to go over. It should have been left in the hands of the military.

QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Nov 14, 2007 -> 10:04 AM) If there is business demand, no matter hwo much you spend trying to secure the border, illegals will still come in. You need to both secure the borders AND do a lot more to stem demand for illegal labor. You can't do just one of the two and expect to make a significant dent. Note that I said FIRST, secure the borders.

Perhaps it is the surge AND the fact they've been chased around for 4 or 5 years. And yes, I'm sure the goundswell for peace has helped too, as the Iraqi people are finally stepping and pointing fingers. This is what was said on numerous occasions would have to happen and what TPTB have been hoping for.

QUOTE(Texsox @ Nov 14, 2007 -> 08:21 AM) Seriously, I wonder how many illegals would have actually went and got one. There would be a risk for either course of action. Personally, I never liked the idea. Stuff like this diverts attention away from real solutions. We need a guest worker program, tied to job creation, and then stuff like drivers licenses are not even an issue. First, we need to secure the borders.

Everybody knows that the good guys lost Beaten by the Queen of Hearts every time. Don't you draw the Queen of Diamonds, she'll break you every time. You know you know the Deuce is still wild. Revved up like a deuce, another runner in the night. And I've got such a long way to go, to make it to the border of Mexico Like a bat out of hell I'll be gone when the morning comes Come spend the night inside my sugar walls And the words of the prophets are written on the subway walls. I've built walls, a fortress deep and mighty. Yet I swear I see my reflection some place so high above this wall. Way up in the air in my beautiful balloon Gonna get high as a kite by then She don't lie, she don't lie, she don't lie, cocaine Sittin' downtown in a railway station, one toke over the line There's a guy with a ticket to Mexico. No, he couldn't look much stranger. I don't want a pickle. I just want to ride my motor-sicle. I like smoke and lightning...Heavy metal thunder. Fat-Bottom Girls you make the rockin' world go 'round. Get on 'yer bikes and ride! Ride, take a free ride, take my place. Have my seat, its for free. Oh, anything I want he gives it to me. Anything I want he gives it, but not for free – It's hateful! You got to get it up, get it up. You got to get it up, get it up, yeah you got to give it to me. Rock me baby, rock me baby all night long.

QUOTE(southsider2k5 @ Nov 14, 2007 -> 09:30 AM) Or any other axe to repeatedly grind... You know how we love grinders.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Nov 14, 2007 -> 09:30 AM) Its interesting considering the studies and press revolving around the lack of black players in baseball today. I had that thought in mind when I asked the question.