FLsouthsider

You want the young players to succeed. If the team is winning because Giolito, Rodon and Lopez are putting up quality starts ... Moncada and Anderson are going off, etc., etc. ... well, then that's a great thing. Now, if it's Holland, Shields and MiGo throwing consecutive shutouts while the other team is balking home runs, well, yeah that doesn't accomplish much. But I'd much rather see the young guys come up, get some successful ABs and innings at the big-league level and bring some confidence with them into spring training then worry about whether the team is drafting at No. 2 or No. 3. That said, the extra bonus/slot money would be nice.

Is it possible that Courtney Hawkins learned how to hit in the last week?

Are they going to cap Kopech's innings this season?

What's up with Jameson Fisher? Is he hurt?

I just like the idea of raiding a team's farm system in exchange for a guy that they cut five years ago.

If they move Frazier, they could do the same thing with the Yankees with a guy like Chase Headley or Brett Gardner. Or maybe the Sox and Yanks swap 3B and the Sox get an extra prospect or two for paying the extra year of Headley's deal. Might as well get creative.

QUOTE (reiks12 @ Dec 9, 2016 -> 09:03 AM) Am I the only one who is obsessed right now? I keep refreshing mlbtr and this thread. I need this resolved soon so I can get back to my normal life. I can't imagine how Hahn feels. I'm thinking the Sox might hang on to Quintana this season. Next year's free agent class of SPs is nothing special so it wouldn't be all that surprising if he stuck around another year and then Hahn can move the crown jewel of the winter meetings for a second straight year. Although God only knows the kind of defense Q would be pitching in front of here. And if he thought run support was bad before ...

Assuming a full tear-down, the White Sox are going to be really, really bad with an expansion team roster. There are about 1,500 innings to account for. Someone has to pitch them. I'd rather it be something like a Holland reclamation project or an Erik Johnson Quad-A type than rushing someone (ahem, Carson Fulmer) up to the bigs. With punting on the next year or two, White Sox can afford to be patient with young players for once.

Eff it. Sell everything that isn't nailed down.

I've moved into the total rebuild camp because it really is a unique opportunity, but it poses some really interesting questions. First off, I think most of us would agree that it makes sense to hang on to Anderson, Rodon and Eaton. But, of course, everyone has a price and you should always listen to offers. Now, let's say Hahn decides to go full nuclear option. Hypothetically ... They trade Sale and Quintana in megadeals to the Dodgers, Red Sox or Astros. They package Eaton and Abreu to, say, the Nats for God-knows-what. Jones and Melky get sent to San Francisco (OK, OK, so the Giants aren't big Cabrera fans after his PED suspension in 2012, but this is all a fantasy-baseball-esque dreamscape anyway). Robertson goes to a contender. Frazier, Lawrie ... maybe they stay because they don't have tons of value in this market. But maybe Hahn revisits that at the deadline. Avi ... still has zero value. With ALL of those pieces on the move, the White Sox could realistically acquire anywhere from 10 to 25 prospects, a significant portion of them being high level to elite. Now, not all of them are going to be MLB-ready, obviously, and the big-league roster is now essentially bereft of any veteran presence. The interesting thing to me is figuring out how in the heck you go about putting a team on the field for the next two seasons. It reminds me of expansion teams, where they have to feed off the scraps. I mean, it would be one UGLY season, like 50 wins. A season where we're all looking at Charlotte and Birmingham box scores every night. But the wave of talent -- considering it would be buttressed by likely back-to-back top-five picks in '18 and '19 -- arriving over the next two to four years would be IMMENSE.

There is almost no chance I would remain a White Sox fan if the team moved. It's probably hypocritical to be that way, since I moved away from Chicago about 15 years ago and haven't looked back. That said, I still love Chicago, and the thought that someone would take a community institution (and a charter member of the American League with 100-plus years of local history) and sell it off to Oklahoma City or wherever just makes me sick. It would be a slap across the face. I live in South Florida now, and I go to maybe three or four Marlins games a year. If the White Sox bolted, I'd probably just punt on baseball altogether.

Sale was named a finalist for the Golden Spikes Award today.

QUOTE (Texsox @ Apr 9, 2008 -> 09:46 AM) Your points are well founded, but just pushed a little too far. A grocery store operates year round and their infrastructure costs are spread out over that year and over a wider and deeper volume of products. If your local grocer was only open 80 times per year, you would see a much different pricing structure. At a grocer, some items are "loss leaders" to lead people into the stores, and some are the profit items once you arrive. And now compare the price of that beer at the grocery store and have someone buy it, deliver it to your home, serve it to you, and clean up after you. Factor in the cost of your home, electric, gas, insurance, and see what that grocery store beer really costs. We have strayed far from your original, and IMHO valid statement, baseball should be concerned about turning away fans at the gate bnecause of economics. There is a sweet spot between selling 1 @ $20 to one customer and selling 20 @ $1 to 20 customers. Your costs go up with more transactions for the same gross. So that one sale looks tempting, but when that narrow customer base leaves, you are in real trouble. Yes, but, not insignificantly, grocery stores also operate at much, much smaller profit margins. And grocery stores don't charge you a $20 cover charge, either. Sorry for the threadjack. Economically, everything is higher today for baseball than it's ever been... on the revenue and costs side. MLB is on pace to out-earn the NFL within the next five years. Up to this point, fans (at least in the aggregate) don't seem to respond to higher costs associated with going to games, evidenced by the record revenues and attendance figures. I love baseball and love the Sox, so I hope it's sustainable. I just wonder if it is, in regards to the long-term health and growth of the game. Then again, this argument has been trotted out there for years and things are still sunny.

QUOTE (Y2HH @ Apr 9, 2008 -> 10:02 AM) Also true, with Diesel being well above 4$ per gallon, the delivery trucks for food/beverages will raise their freight costs in order to offset the rising cost of fuel. Which is why beer prices are up 40 percent at the grocery store.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Apr 9, 2008 -> 09:40 AM) I didn't say I was happy about it, there you read into what I said too far. The complaint for decades was that the owners were getting rich off of the Sox. This has never been true. There was also the complaint that our payroll was too low for being in the 3rd largest city in the US. Now we have the 5th largest payroll in all of MLB, including higher than that crosstown team who happened to draw about 1 million more fans and made the playoffs last year. Let me ask you flat out, would you rather have higher prices and a higher payroll, or lower prices and a lower payroll? Because those are your choices when it comes to White Sox baseball. Whether you're happy about it or not, you're still complicit. As for payroll vs. prices, I don't really care what the payroll is so long as the team is competitive. And teams need not have the highest payroll to compete. The Sox's payroll has gone about 50 percent since 2005 and the team has gotten worse. Of course I want the team to compete and win, but I'm not shelling out $44 for an Italian beef sandwich or my monthly car payment to park. And as far as ownership getting rich off the team, Bill Veeck once said that you don't make money operating a baseball team, you make money selling your baseball team. JR and his ownership group bought the Sox for $20 million. I'm guessing the club is probably worth $350-400 million today. I'd say that's getting rich off the Sox. I'm not begrudging JR for making a good investment, good for him. But let's not kid ourselves.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Apr 9, 2008 -> 09:15 AM) If you have a rebuttal, I would love to hear it. Rebuttal to what? Your willingness to pay $8 for a hot dog? Baseball is a business and the team is maximizing revenues. Just not out of my wallet. I don't even live in Chicago anymore, so I'm not exactly the club's target market. However, pardon me if I think it's a long-term mistake to squeeze families and casual fans, turn them upside down and shake every last nickel out of their pockets before they leave the stadium.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Apr 9, 2008 -> 08:47 AM) What do they need to acknowledge? The Sox have the 5th highest payroll in major league baseball. It has gone up very close to 50% since 2005. For the one Chicago franchise that puts all of its profits back on to the field, that means they need to get the money from somewhere... Yes winning has its price. For all of the people who were pissed when we had a middle of the pack payroll, this is the price you pay the piper. We could go back to having cheap concessions, cheap parking, and a half empty stadium, but that would also require the team to go back to a $75 million payroll. There is cost for everything. You want to run with the big dogs, it will cost you. Wow. Jerry Reinsdorf and Bud Selig just added you to their Christmas card list.

Be sure to visit Guero Canelo for a Sonoran hot dog... http://www.elguerocanelo.com/ And for those of you who don't know about Sonoran hot dogs (video) ... http://regulus2.azstarnet.com/mediaskins/main.php?id=1670 The carne asada caramelos at Guero Canelo are amazing, too. My favorite restaurant in Tucson is Cafe Poca Cosa. It's located downtown, and you'll want to make reservations. EDIT: ALSO, IMPORTANT NOTE IF YOU'LL BE DRIVING IN TUCSON ... The I-10 is open, but the exits are closed from 22nd to Prince. The closings affect all of downtown Tucson and several major roads, including (but not limited to) major east-west roads Congress/Broadway, Speedway and Grant. It's part of a highway widening program. So if you hop on the interstate on Ajo (TEP is on Ajo Way right next to the 10) you won't be able to exit until Prince on the north side of town. Also of note to those of you who might be trying to find a hotel near the airport, the Desert Diamond Casino opened its new facility late last year. It's located on South Nogales Highway, across the street from the western edge of the Tucson airport. The casino is brand new, and they opened an on-site hotel. I haven't been inside the hotel, but they did a nice job with the rest of the complex. Be forewarned, though, that rooms at the new Desert Diamond hotel are among the most expensive in town, according to a recent story by the Arizona Daily Star.

QUOTE(Steff @ Sep 11, 2007 -> 02:43 AM) Per http://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/CHW/1994.shtml , no. Also per his bio, whitesox.com, and numerous other googled sites, he never wore #23 in a Sox uniform. He did indeed play in the Crosstown Classic that year, though I have no idea what uniform number he wore. The game was at Wrigley that year. The Crosstown Classic was an exhibition, so that's why he doesn't show up on baseball-reference.com.

QUOTE(ChiSox35 @ Aug 12, 2007 -> 05:49 AM) *** Baseball isn't a game of "what have you done for me lately". Think of it as a phase. Look at Mags. I'm not comparing the two production-wise, but rather their situations. Management thinks he's injury prone, dumps him, and now he's gonna be the AL MVP, and a big part of the reason D-Town got to the show last year. Patience is a virtue. Don't compare Podsednik to Ordonez. First off, Magglio averaged about 600 (extremely productive) at-bats for six years. Then he went down with a freak knee injury, and his agent basically forced the team's hand with the handling of said injury. On top of all that, Ordonez was making $14 million the year he went down, and is clearing well above that in Detroit now. Magglio is and was a franchise-type player. And as such would have cost the Sox roughly 15-20 percent of their payroll. Would you commit that type of money to a guy with an iffy knee? Would you have rather had Ordonez in RF in 2005 (when he missed half the season with a different injury) instead of guys like Dye, Pierzynski, the aforementioned Podsednik and others? Ordonez had serious questions about the health of his knee resulting from a single incident, not the litany of ailments that have fallen upon Podsednik in recent years. And bringing back Ordonez required a huge leap of faith, as well as a huge pile of cash. Not just writing him off as "injury prone" and being done with it.

QUOTE(WHITESOXRANDY @ Jul 31, 2007 -> 04:12 PM) that would play for the Sox at a discount. I'll start with some ideas: Ron Leflore Rock Raines Ralph Garr D.B. Sweeney Oney Guillen Ribbie Rhubarb Jenny McCarthy Am I missing anyone ? Mike Huff.

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Jul 6, 2007 -> 10:04 PM) Fact. Floyd did not have an impressive start tonight. There is no way around that. However, I beleive this is an unfair statement. Couldn't the same thing been said about the Twins after the Garza start? All he really had was a fastball that got rocked? Is that the best they could do? I don't like Floyd, didn't like the Garcia trade but wanted to give it a chance. And I agree with you about giving Floyd a chance. But your comparison of Garza and Floyd is way off the mark. Garza was a home-grown No. 1 pick. He dominated the minor leagues in 2006 at every level, going from high-a to an eventual callup to the big club. Was absolutely dominant at every level of the minors, striking out 154 in 135 IP. Garza is roughly the same age as Floyd (MG is 23) but newer to pro ball, since he played at Fresno State rather than going to the pros right out of HS. Garza was was very impressive in spring training in 2006 and 2007. Floyd had a 9.00 ERA in 19 IP this spring in his only ST with the White Sox. Yes, Garza had a rough first start in the bigs and a few other clunkers along the way last year. If you take away his debut, his ERA last year drops by a full run. Floyd's ERA in the majors is now over 7.00, and that's over 110-plus innings. So while you probably shouldn't write off Floyd because of one bad start (you should write him off for going on three years of not being able to get out major-league hitters), a comparison between Garza and Floyd is less than apt.

Dave Gallagher, Ivan Calderon, Freddie Manrique, Bob James, Gene Nelson, Danny Pasqua, Bob Zupzic, Joe Cowley, Steve Lyons, Mike Huff, Charlie Hough, Don Pall, Tony Phillips, Davey Martinez, Dave LaPointe, Ray Searage, Eric King, Jerry Kutzler, Wayne Edwards, Ken Patterson .... OK, I'll stop now.

p.s., Pitch to Fisk at Your Risk.

I remember going to a game where Tim Laudner hit a grand slam (and looking it up on baseball-reference.com, it apparently was June 1987 off Jose DeLeon) at Old Comiskey when I was a young pup. One of my best friends at the time, his family had moved to my hometown from Minnesota, so I remember being especially pissed that they lost that game. I still hate those damned homer hankies. We saw Nolan Ryan in 1989 or 1990 with the Rangers. Though he didn't pitch, it was still cool just to watch him play catch in the outfield. I remember my dad getting us lost going to a game once and ending up in Chinatown. I thought we were done for. We went to a game at the new ballpark in 92 or 93 with my great-grandfather, who was in his mid or upper 80s at the time. And our seats were like third row from the top of the upper deck behind the plate. I don't think my great-grandpa was very impressed with the new park. I got screwed once buying tickets from a scalper to a Sox-Cubs game probably 10 years ago. "Yeah, these are right on third base!" They were the second-to-last section in left field, upper deck, second row from the top. At least I only paid $20 for them. Still, that old park was such an amazing place. Yeah, it was cramped, falling apart and had some of the most ridiculous viewing angles ever conceived in the corners. But, man, the view when the field came into focus, unreal. That's when the cramped, closed-in nature of the park was a huge benefit. By modern standards, the place would be labeled a "dump," but it had so much charm, character and history (as well as funky smells and sticky floors) that no architect could ever recreate. Sigh. I miss Old Comiskey.