SoxFan1

QUOTE (whitesoxfan101 @ Jul 26, 2011 -> 11:59 PM) What's Gordon Beckham ever done other than hit well for part of the 2009 season? Being a high draft pick doesn't mean you're worthy of trust as a key bat. Part of that 2009 season was 100 games of kickassness. You are being Mr. Hindsight right now.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 27, 2011 -> 12:00 AM) He signed them, he's ultimately responsible. Its about what you do now and in the future, not what you did in the past. WTF

QUOTE (maggsmaggs @ Jul 26, 2011 -> 11:58 PM) Dunn is clearly not KWs fault. But Peavy is. Rios is. Pierre is. Not having any suitable replacements in the minors except Viciedo. Having to rely on big-money acquisitions because we don't have any cheap, young and good talent in our system. That's all on KW. Dunn is the #1 reason for the White Sox struggles right now. You're getting absolutely nothing out of your cleanup hitter. A guy who was supposed to be your biggest run producer. Why is it ok to blame KW for the struggles of Peavy or Rios or Dunn but I never hear praise for being ballsy and re-signing Konerko or giving Humber a shot or for assembling a wonderful bullpen.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 26, 2011 -> 11:51 PM) That's not happening. If they are the paper champion every year like you claim, why isn't it translating on the field? I never said every year. I think it's quite clear that people had high expectations for this team coming into the 2011 season and that most thought they were the favorites to win the division. Again, the GM doesn't go out there and pitch or hit. How is KW at fault for the struggles of Adam Dunn? Gordon Beckham?

QUOTE (whitesoxfan101 @ Jul 26, 2011 -> 11:50 PM) The bolded part is true, but it shows people are stupid sometimes. Everybody always overreacts to opening day, for better or worse. One of my least favorite parts of baseball. I wouldn't say the White Sox were a paper champion as much as they were a paper team that could win in the high 80's again and win a bad division this year. For the price we're paying, I think expectations should be higher than that (although they clearly were for you, which I suppose I kind of get). Give me a break. 1, people thought the Sox were legit contenders. 2, no one thought the division would be this bad.

QUOTE (whitesoxfan101 @ Jul 26, 2011 -> 11:48 PM) Last year, I spent the entire year expecting the other shoe to drop. After hearing all of the reports on him from Toronto, and then seeing his performance in 2009 with the White Sox, it was hard to think something like that happening again was impossible. .878 OPS in the 1st half last year. After Greg Walker completely changed his swing in the offseason.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 26, 2011 -> 11:49 PM) BS. The GM's job is to put together teams that win on the field, not on paper. Please, PLEASE tell me how a GM goes about doing this.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 26, 2011 -> 11:47 PM) The White Sox perfomance the last few years would make me think otherwise. Lets get some guys who get pissed off when they lose. They ARE pissed when they lose and guys who have struggled KNOW they are struggling and take accountability. But they don't carry it over to the next game. You can't stew about a loss forever. Go out and get the next one.

QUOTE (whitesoxfan101 @ Jul 26, 2011 -> 11:44 PM) Couldn't help but laugh at the bolded. The Sox looked on the path of something special after playing great in 1/162nd of their season?! Also, being the favorite before the season is irrelevant. Being a paper champion doesn't get you very far. Being a paper champion is all a GM can do. And the bolded pat is absolutely true. People were as optimistic as ever after that game. They scored a ton of runs, Dunn hits a HR in his 2nd AB as a Sox player. Things are gravy.

QUOTE (whitesoxfan101 @ Jul 26, 2011 -> 11:42 PM) I don't know. It says our division is really bad? The struggles of Beckham, Rios, Pierre, and Morel haven't been a surprise. Perhaps the extent of them has been a surprise (but even that, not so much). I just find it ridiculous that so many people think Alex Rios underachieving massively/not giving good effort is a surprise. Or that Juan Pierre isn't aging well is a surprise. Or that Brent Morel not being able to hit MLB pitching is a surprise. Or that Gordon Beckham having an OPS under 700 again is a surprise. None of them are. Adam Dunn is a SHOCK, but those guys aren't a shock or surprise. You're proving my point as to just how good the White Sox could and SHOULD be. Even with Rios, Beckham, Morel and Pierre (who is actually playing well now), Dunn gets hot for 1 week and all the sudden you'd forget about all the problems the Sox had instantly.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 26, 2011 -> 11:40 PM) KW has said he does ask players about specific guys. If the team acts like they are on a 20 game winning streak when they are struggling, maybe that's part of the problem. God no. I completely feel the opposite way. You HAVE to stay loose in baseball. 162 games. A 6 month grind. If you sit and think about everything all the time, you're going to think yourself right out of the MLB. I'd much rather have a clubhouse where guys stay loose than a clubhouse where it's silent and everyone is sitting at their locker quietly.

QUOTE (whitesoxfan101 @ Jul 26, 2011 -> 11:39 PM) I don't think the problem is, or ever has been (at least under Ozzie), in the clubhouse. The Sox issues are in game management and roster construction related. Game management, yes. Roster construction, no. The day before the season started, the White Sox were AL Central favorites and legit contenders. After opening day, the White Sox looked to be on the path of something special. Now we have an awful team full of awful players with awful contracts. Give me a break. They're 2 games under .500 with seemingly everyone but PK and CQ hitting like s***.

QUOTE (Buehrlesque @ Jul 26, 2011 -> 11:39 PM) I know you were just spitballing there, but Sox would have to give up more to the Cards (and/or Blue Jays) to make that work. Right, I figured there would be more involved, I just have no idea what minor leagues could be a part of it.

QUOTE (whitesoxfan101 @ Jul 26, 2011 -> 11:36 PM) The only completely impossible to predict thing on this team right now, in terms of underachieving, is Dunn. I can't blame anybody for that, other than Dunn himself. Outside of that though, I mean Beckham, Rios, Pierre, Morel? I'm really not that shocked at any of their seasons, and I don't see how anybody could be. However, I think the Sox would be in 1st if Dunn were Dunn right now. To make a GM blameless for a 127 million dollar payroll being below .500 in a bad division is ridiculous though. Especially considering his recent track record with trades (awful), and not firing his awful manager (awful). If Dunn is even close to his career averages, the White Sox are in first place right now. What does that say about the struggles of the other guys you mentioned?

QUOTE (fathom @ Jul 26, 2011 -> 11:35 PM) But don't you think it's cause the Sox locker room at the time was much more conservative and uptight? I've been in the Sox clubhouse numerous times. There is never an uptight moment in there. In fact, I've been in there at times when the team has struggled mightily and you'd think the team was on a 20 game win streak. You can't go around and ask 25 guys what they think about adding Player X to the team.

QUOTE (fathom @ Jul 26, 2011 -> 11:33 PM) Is it too much to ask KW and Ozzie to do some research about how a guy would fit in, in the locker room, before spending a ton of resources to acquire them (ie: OC and Swisher). It doesn't seem that Swisher had any issues in the clubhouse in OAK or NY.

QUOTE (whitesoxfan101 @ Jul 26, 2011 -> 11:26 PM) I can't defend a GM who, given a 127 million dollar payroll, put together a team that has been under .500 almost all season and struggling to tread water in a bad division. How can you blame him for the players underachieving? YOU CAN'T. On paper, this team should run away with this division and be a legit world series contender. That's all a GM could do, make a team look good on paper. Christ on a stick I can't believe people are blaming KW for this team's failures.

QUOTE (fathom @ Jul 26, 2011 -> 11:25 PM) This trade makes so little sense that it scares me it's legit. Also, not sure how true it is, but a Cards buddy of mine heard STL wanted Sale and Beckham Exactly. There's really nothing I can think of with these 3 teams that sounds feasible with the names we've heard.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 26, 2011 -> 11:24 PM) Well, I am obviously the big KW supporter here....so I'll take the criticism, but I sure as hell can't fault the guy for assembling the best rotation in the division, the best bullpen in the division, and what should be an offense as good as any other in the division, only to watch the players fail. This s*** with Adam Dunn is absolutely inexplicable. If he was hitting anywhere close to his career average we are in first place right now. If this deal is true, and it isn't, then I am clearly wrong about the guy because this is a panic move. I'm with you on this one, actually. I'm a pretty big KW fan but have cooled recently. Still, you can't blame him for so many guys underperforming. No one expected Dunn to hit .160. You take a chance on Rios, sure. People quickly forget he was pretty awesome in the 1st half last year. He spends, people say he isn't spending wisely. He doesn't spend, people cry poor and blame him and JR. Whatever.

QUOTE (scenario @ Jul 26, 2011 -> 11:16 PM) That was my first thought when I saw the thread. According to the Rasmus story in the Post Dispatch last week, the Sox and Cards may need a 3rd team to get a deal done because the Sox did not have the prospect(s) the Cards were looking for. CWS get Rasmus STL gets Jackson, TOR prospect TOR gets Teahen I really have no clue. This simply doesn't make sense.

Bears could use some help. Obviously WR, OL, DL and CB. Some interesting LB too. There were rumors about Cullen Jenkins earlier. Rumers now about Jason Babin and Brandon Mebane. Mike Sims-Walker. Sidney Rice. It's going to be nutty.

I'm Craigslist furniture shopping. It's kind of awesome.

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Jul 23, 2011 -> 08:18 PM) Doesn't look astounding to me. Odd seeing Gosling in that role, plus it doesn't even look as cool as The Transports or the Fast/Furious movies. I'll still probably watch it.

I strongly recommend Naples, Florida if you're looking for somewhere on the Gulf Coast to vacation. Not as crowded as Clearwater and IMO, the beach was better. Had a great time.

Nikola Mirotic had 29 and 11 in helping Speain beat Italy in the U20 championship game.