Pants Rowland

QUOTE(Brian26 @ Mar 20, 2007 -> 10:57 PM) If it's all about Sox history, there's no reason to promote your website on every post. There are people on WSI that have contributed a thousand times the amount of information you have over the years....for free and without trying to promote their own agenda. People here promote all kinds of crap in their signatures/avatars and it is their prerogative. Much of it is muted promotion of sex, tv shows, college teams, etc. and none of it has to do with the White Sox. Until you pointed it out, I did not even notice the link in his signature. I am not familiar with WSI but I do know I enjoy threads started by StatManDu far more than I like enduring one thread after another debating the OF and 5th starter. Please leave the man alone.

QUOTE(joeynach @ Mar 20, 2007 -> 03:28 PM) Sorry bud there just isn't that much boobie to see in April at wrigley when its 48 with 20 MPH winds and rain. There are a few bums though. But the boobie you do see sure can cut glass. Mmmm...boooooobies.

QUOTE(Middle Buffalo @ Mar 19, 2007 -> 11:46 AM) El Duque. Best game. Jack McDowell 1-0 against Seattle (I think it was Randy Johnson pitching for them). Ok, I'm officially old. I searched and can't find the best pitched game I remember. Never happened? Was I looking at BlackJack through goatee colored Sox shades? Closest thing to what I remember was 2-1 Sox over RJ. http://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/SE...199406250.shtml Guess that makes me a fan. As far as best games pitched to reference, there are a lot. Britt Burns' heartbreaker in the 1983 playoffs first comes to mind. I also remember either Burns or Dotson pitched a 12-0 one-hitter against KC in 1983 where the Sox hit back to back to back home runs early in the game and the no-no was broken up with one or two down in the 9th. Alvarez pitched a game a season or two after his no-no against the Orioles. I do not recall the opponent but I know it was like a 2 or three hit shutout and he was as on as I have ever seen a Sox pitcher. Even he said it was the best stuff he ever had in a game, including the no-hitter. I also recall a tight game between the Sox and Blue Jays in either 1993 or 1994 where Alex Fernandez gutted out a 2-1 victory in a matchup between the two premier teams in the league at the time. I recall another game where Black Jack gave up a leadoff home run to Paul Molitor of the _____ (I think he was still in Milwaukee) and then proceeded to dominate with a one-hitter that the Sox won by a large margin. As far as recent dominant performances, Garcia in Houston first comes to mind as do a handful of Buehrle's hour plus gems, in particular opening day 2005 versus Cleveland. I also must say that Contreras and Javier Vasquez had a two week span or so in the first half last year where they both were as unhittable as I have seen a tandem of Sox pitchers in a long time. I think between the two of them, they both took no-hitters deep into two games. I believe Javy's were consecutive where Jose's were spaced a bit apart.

QUOTE(StatManDu @ Mar 18, 2007 -> 07:46 AM) Thanks, all. I appreciate the kind words and love doing the blog. It's all about Sox history, that's all. I never could really convince the fine folks at WSI that. O well. Other best pitched inning candidates that I will delve deeper into later: Bill Simas, Hollis Thurston, Scot Radinsky and Jack McDowell. That Foulke inning has a soft spot in my heart. It was intense and showcased all that was good about baseball. Was the Bill Simas inning against Cleveland in 1996 (I think that was the season although it could have been 1997)? Sox again clinging to a 4-2 lead and were in the midst of winning like 22 out of 24 games or something to that effect? I seem to remember Simas coming up huge and striking out one or two of their most feared hitters. I could swear Mr. Thome was one of them as well. FWIW, I recall that as the greatest regular season Sox run I had witnessed since the second half of 1983.

score?

QUOTE(shoota @ Mar 15, 2007 -> 11:43 PM) Exactly. Bartman cost the Cubs one out when they were five outs from the World Series. He deserves criticism for that. It's fitting that the Cubs, a team known for absent-minded fans who know little of the game of baseball, would have its World Series chances diminished by one of its own fans. At one point in the series they were up three games to one. In the game referenced, I believe they were leading 3-0 at the time of the alleged Bartman gaff. The play did not result in a run, hit, walk, error, or anything in between. It was simply a strike and there is still no guarantee Alou catches the ball. Maybe he catches it, they win the game and go on and win the series. However, for a whole team to get unraveled by a foul ball such that they lose 8-3 shows that they are probably not a championship ballclub. Champions take advantage of other teams mistakes and overcome adversity.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Mar 14, 2007 -> 05:47 PM) When some of you people get a chance, read this game thread from the beginning. So much negativity, so much angst, an outside person wouldnt even know this is a White Sox FAN site. This is supposed to be a board of people who love this team and this organization. It started out negative, but it has been some really funny sh** for many pages now and great PBP, too. Very much in the spirit of Caray and Piersall if that rings a bell. I have mainly been observing but as a fan for the better part of 25 years, now, I think it is my duty as a fan to engage in debate and criticize the team much as it is our duty as Americans to question our government. If I don't do either, I am neither a true fan and this is not really a democracy.

I can't believe this thread is still alive. I did not think it would make it to 2 pages.

Work really has sucked today. This thread has been refreshingly funny with minimal arguing. Thanks for the good cheer.

QUOTE(joeynach @ Mar 13, 2007 -> 01:47 PM) Its not the price or payroll im arguing about. Its about denoting that Sea series as Prime as if due to the matchup being Seattle its a popular or crucial series, when obviously its not. If they want to charge more for it becuase its a weekend during Jun, Jul, or Aug fine by me, they should because those tickets are in higher demand (thats the way econ works, things in higher demand cost more), but dont label it a Prime because of the two teams matching up. That works for our rivals like Minny, Det, and also for the big boys like Yanks BoSox, but like I said dont pull a fast one on us by pooling lowly seattle as a "bigtime" series the way those others teams are. I and everyone else would rather enjoy the strait up its a weekend summer home series therefore it costs you more because of demand. Instead we are supposed to just blindly accept that its a prime matchup alright and is as popular and interesting as playing the Twins, Tigers, or Tribe. Thats just not reality. I think you are reading WAY too much into the whole Prime/Premier thing. No one is pulling a fast one. They do not say Seattle or any other team is the reason for the elevated pricing. They simply color code the entire schedule in a month-by-month layout that is easy to follow. The mid-summer weekend night is the reason for premier pricing, not the Seattle Mariners.

QUOTE(iamshack @ Mar 13, 2007 -> 12:15 PM) But we should have gotten more....if for no other reason than he is "the handsome" Neal Cotts! Great team marketing asset, right?

QUOTE(Kalapse @ Mar 12, 2007 -> 04:14 PM) Thome just hit a 500 foot HR over the enormous batter's eye in CF. Farmio is freaking out. Farmer struggles. How I miss John Rooney

QUOTE(StatManDu @ Mar 6, 2007 -> 04:20 PM) Could DJ be more boring? ... He can stop saying "go ahead" any time now, too. Put Farmer and Harrelson together, simulcast it and send the other guys adrfit ... PLEASE! You can't be insinuating that Farmer is an enjoyable listen, can you? His amanlove for Dennis DeYoung alone is offensive enough. Add his arrogance and he is downright intolerable.

QUOTE(Scwible @ Mar 6, 2007 -> 03:24 PM) Good deal for both sides. I like it. Maybe it'll calm him down. Is this extension confirmed yet?

QUOTE(GoSox05 @ Mar 6, 2007 -> 03:19 PM) he makes less than Gil Meche The Sox love 3-year deals with pitchers. At that level of bargain, can we trade him for some top prospects that will dazzle in 2009?

QUOTE(StatManDu @ Mar 5, 2007 -> 03:05 AM) MARCH 5TH WHERE’S MOE? 1926: Rookie shortstop Moe Berg was not at the White Sox spring training camp in Shreveport, Louisiana. The Sox explained that Berg was taking a law course at Columbia University in New York and won’t be available until May 15. Who knows where Berg actually was? Later in life, he spent time working for the O.S.S., the forerunner to the CIA. With Berg out of the picture (he actually didn’t play for the Sox in 1926), the Sox brought on Everett Scott, recently released by Washington, to play shortstop. Berg is one of the most interesting players in baseball history. His Society of American Baseball Research bio is worth a read at http://bioproj.sabr.org/bioproj.cfm?a=v&am...756&pid=962 JORDAN’S FIRST START: 0-FOR-3, RUN, RBI 1994: In his first start, Michael Jordan went 0-for-3 with a run and an RBI in the White Sox 15-7 Grapefruit League win over the Texas Rangers in Port Charlotte, Fla. Jordan started in right field and batted sixth. The offensive hero of the day was Robin Ventura, who homered and drove in four runs in his only two at bats. For the rest of the day, visit www.whitesoxalmanac.com If my memory serves me right, I thought Berg was a catcher. Am I mistaken? On that note has anyone ever read his entertaining biography, The Catcher was a Spy? I read it a while back. Fascinating man on many levels.

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Mar 2, 2007 -> 04:48 PM) It took a while, but he was still fired. And still worshipped by too many fans.

QUOTE(FlaCWS @ Mar 2, 2007 -> 04:41 PM) At some point winning the World Series can't mean lifetime immunity from consequences. Tell that to Ditka.

QUOTE(HeGone33 @ Mar 2, 2007 -> 03:29 PM) When it comes to gameday, on the field, I highly doubt that any of our players are sitting there thinking about some off the wall comment made by Ozzie at one point another. I know many of us have played competitive sport in our lives and when you are playing games, nothing else matters and you get caught in the competition within the game. If anything, things that are said, should motivate people. The players who sucked last year didn't suck cause of what Ozzie said. Plain and simple when things are going good, he's a hero, we don't win last year, and he is an a@@. Im 26 years old and as far as im concerned, Ozzie was a big part of fulfilling a dream of mine, seeing the Sox win the World Series. I do financial analysis and Ozzie manages a baseball team. I won't tell him how to do his job, and I wouldn't listen to him tell me how to do my job. I see your point but a manager, whether it be in baseball or financial analysis is supposed to be something of a mentor to those that report to him or her. Part of being a mentor requires patience with younger, less experienced team members. Those guys are going to have a lot of energy and enthusiasm, but they are also going to make mistakes along the way. Some egos are more fragile than others. If the manager rides the young guy enough, he could break his spirit and mess up his confidence. Obviously, someone so fragile that they can't handle constructive criticism is not a guy you want on the team anyway. However, Ozzie is broadcasting shortcomings in a very public forum. I am not saying it is hurting morale of the team overall, but the potential is definitely there. FWIW, I have heard McCarthy was something of a sourpuss. Supposedly he was always debating politics and religion in the bullpen. I forgot where I read this, but I think it was in a profile of the bullpen last year in one of the papers. It was delivered in a fairly lighthearted tone but it was still mentioned by a teammate in the pen with him. Again, I do not know the situation behind the scenes, but guys like that can mess up clubhouse chemistry even if they are talented and work hard. McCarthy's comments after being traded also hinted at this where he notes they were always focused on the negative rather than the positive. Maybe that was his own perception and he was taking things too personally rather than taking it like a young professional that needs to improve his game.

QUOTE(aboz56 @ Mar 2, 2007 -> 11:59 AM) Wrong, BA had already switched to 32 before Hall was signed. Must have been the last sticking point in Hall's negotiations.

QUOTE(CanOfCorn @ Mar 1, 2007 -> 10:11 AM) Under the Radar. You have inspired me...."Can O' Konerko"

I do not necessarily put a lot of stock in preseason predictions, especially from ESPN, but I sure would like these predictions to be true.

QUOTE(Middle Buffalo @ Mar 1, 2007 -> 01:45 PM) I agree. Internationally speaking, though, I believe that the recent failure of our professionals (NBA, MLB) against other countries has as much to do with our players lack of commitment to train for the events, arrogance, and poorly constructed teams. Essentially, in baseball, we sent the 2005 Yankees to battle when we would be better served to send the '96 Yankees. Players have to be willing to sacrifice their personal glory for the good of the team. No doubt. The U.S. sports federations have a bad habit of looking at the top players statistically and failing to fill in the gaps created by their broad shoulders. The lack of role players has resulted in consistent disappointment on the international stage. I may be speculating, but this same reasoning may offer a tiny clue as to why Santo is not in the HOF and also why his vote tallies from fifteen years of eligibility were so low compared to his near success in the veterans committee. Media eye witnesses covering baseball daily are able to objectively summarize a player's entire career and vote for the HOF. They look at the numbers but they also remember the intangibles such as clutch hits, advancing runners, taking an error while trying to save a run, playing with injuries, etc. If a player is not the complete package, odds are fifteen years are not going to be enough to get him in the HOF via a media vote. Then the veterans are asked to reconsider just in case the press slighted him somehow. Some of these veterans were contemporaries of said player and can judge accordingly. However, many others did not follow his career and are forced to either abstain or rely on paper numbers. With Santo, this has dragged on for so long that the intangibles of his game have effectively been thrown out. This forces the voters to compare numbers to other players in the HOF. Santo's supporters have taken it a step further and said the VC should compare his stats to other 3B in the HOF rather than all HOF members. The true Santo fanatics say he should only be compared to the 3B from his era, especially in the NL alone. If you spin the facts enough and look at them from just the right angle, you conclude that Santo's ommission is nothing less than a tragedy. Using the same approach, I am sure someone could argue Dave Kingman into the HOF along with Harold Baines, Jim Rice, Don Mattingly, Dale Murphy and a whole slew of other borderline players with impressive paper stats. Time heals all wounds. In the case of Santo and his supporters, time seems to be putting enough distance between the voters and possible gaps in his game. I am too young to opine on his qualifications, but older fans I know that watched his career do not split +75% pro to -25% con for his induction. To hear his career described by someone who was there, he sounds like another good player with some impressive statistics. Believe it or not, there are a lot of players in that category who have to pay for a ticket to get into Cooperstown.

QUOTE(Middle Buffalo @ Mar 1, 2007 -> 09:42 AM) There's no way anyone can conclusively say what would have happened over the course of a full season of competition if the Negro league players had been allowed in MLB. Surely, there were Negro leaguers who would have excelled, but there are just as many who would have failed to live up to their billing. Just use Triple A can't miss prospects as an example of how wrong scouts can be when the players move up to the next level. All Star games are just that. All Star games. The Negro league All Stars likely would have done well in MLB, but every player in the Negro leagues was NOT Paige or Gibson. They had their fair share of roster filler, and I'm sure that some of the numbers that the All Star Negro league players accrued came at the expense of these lesser players. That said, I think Negro league players do have a place in the HOF, but I don't think it's right to say that any player would have dominated the MLB players because we just won't ever really know. My initial comments were very much tongue in cheek, but it is fairly safe to assume that the overall quality of play and level of talent in MLB would have increased substantially had Cap Anson and Kennesaw Mountain Landis not resisted integration. My understanding was that the Negro Leagues were as talented (and untalented) as MLB. Just as not all Negro Leaguers were Paige or Gibson, not all MLB players were Walter Johnson or Babe Ruth, either. The AL was maligned for a long time by the haughty National League, which had already been in existance for 25 years when the AL declared itself a major league. Some old time fans still refer to the NL as the "Senior Circuit" and dismiss the AL as a sideshow of sorts. Those fans are obviously few and far between nowadays, but the arrogance was there for some time. A similar arrogance contributed to the myth that the Negro Leagues were of lesser talent and were a lower quality brand of baseball. Further, a lot of marginal players in the all-white AL & NL would also have fallen by the wayside rather than having productive careers had integration taken place long before Robinson broker the color barrier. Think of the quality of talent that would be lost if we removed all black, latino, and asian players from the major leagues. Do you think it would be better or worse? The WBC last year illustrated that small countries such as Korea, Japan, P.R., D.R., Venezuela, and Cuba are as competitive and talented as the U.S., if not moreso. They obviously had marginal players on their rosters that would not make it big in the majors and are definitely not HOF material. However, the same applies for the U.S. roster, which did not even fare as well as several of these teams and that is with both white and black players. How would the U.S. team have performed even worse if you removed all of the black players? They may have had trouble with the Netherlands. You are correct that we will never know who from both sides of the color barrier would emerge as the truly elite talent. However, if some Negro Leaguers were comparable to can't miss prospects that couldn't cut it in the majors, then it is more than likely the same could be said of the white players in MLB prior to integration. With that in mind, the Negro League stars should be given just as much HOF consideration as the elite MLB players from the period prior to integration. I have not analyzed the acceptance process of Negro League Players in the HOF, but historians seem to indicate that the opposite has been the case.

QUOTE(klaus kinski @ Feb 28, 2007 -> 09:41 AM) I just think its such a joke that Negro league players almost get free passes in while never facing day in day out major league players while great veteran players have to endure this process. Its Grandstanding at its best. What is an even bigger joke is all the players in the major leagues that got a free pass despite never facing the superstars of the Negro leagues. Imagine how sick some of those HOF players would have looked if they had to face Satchel Paige in his prime rather than when he was pitching in his 50s and still pretty darn effective. Josh Gibson would have made Babe Ruth a footnote in the record books, too. My understanding is the Negro Leagues dominated MLB in an All-Star game or two and the talent and overall level of entertainment was so great that those games consistently outdrew a lot of major league franchises. The Negro Leagues were major leagues with major league players. Don't forget to use green next time lest you look like a major league ignoramous.