sox4lifeinPA

QUOTE(Soxy @ Dec 12, 2006 -> 02:42 PM) You got the names right. Jacob was the favorite son of Isaac who wrestled with God and got the new name. But wasn't Jesus considered to be the fulfilment of those promises? Doesn't his promise reflect the new covanent that God made with us (consequently negating those previous ones)? Sort of like the Abrahamic covanent was replaced by the Davidic one (it's been a while since I took theology), but I seem to remember there being several different covanents with God and his people, each one overwriting the last. So, basically the new covanent (as celebrated in the eucharist) negates those previous contacts with God. again, I agree. Basically Judges are sent by God after Joshua takes over for moses. Each time the Israelites strayed from God, they cried out in need when they faced persecution, and a Judge was sent to deliver them from that persecution. rinse and repeat. so eventually the Israelites said...no wait, we want a KING! So God said, ok...have Saul. That goes ok for a while, but Eventually, God's Spirit left Saul because Saul was a selfish man. So God selects David via Samuel and David becomes King through a chain of events. David eventually fails, because he is not THE king. so a couple hundred years go by and prophets are sent to prepare the way for Jesus...and There we have it, the old testament in a nut shell. Throughout all of this the most important thing is to remember that all of the Old Testament stories point to the Gospel...that is the most remarkable thing about the Bible. We are the Israelites in need of a king, but confused by our own sin.

QUOTE(Soxy @ Dec 12, 2006 -> 02:49 PM) I'm obviously not going to change your mind on this issue (or you mine), but I think the idea of having to pay for sins twice (on earth and, I'm presuming you believe in hell, so there too) is just so incredibly unjust. I just have a hard time envisioning a merciful and just god who would be so sadistic to make us pay for our own sins and those from way before our time. you don't have to change my mind, I believe that same thing. Jesus paid the price, so we don't have to. My point about generational sin is that the price is paid eternally, unfortunately sin still has repercussions that effect in spite of that. we're saying the same thing, I think.

QUOTE(Soxy @ Dec 12, 2006 -> 02:31 PM) I'm not convinced even the works book (James) would argue that there's some sort of inherited sin. Obviously, there's that bit in Matthew, but I think, overall, the view of inherited sin is Old Testament. But I agree, there's really nothing in the Gospel or Pauline tradition that would argue for us paying for old sins. Certainly the idea of paying for sins isn't something we'd have to argue about. It's a done deal. As far as generational sin, I think that's a real and painful thing. On a theological level, we don't have to deal with it for reasons as stated, but abuse is one of the easiest things to track. It's passed down from one parent to the next.

QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Dec 12, 2006 -> 02:21 PM) I agree its a step. I was more pointing out Mpls' apparent thinking that we've lost all privacy and that the chip was no different. To me, its a VERY large leap. It's dangerous for the government to have ANY say in what we can and can't do with our bodies. Our bodies should be considered sovereign from the United States. There are laws and rules for my body living IN the U.S. but the government shouldn't have say over what I put IN my body. Some glaring problems, however: drugs, abortion, assisted suicide... to me, those are issues that bleed into interpersonal interactions. Would saying that I would never want the government to force Miss PA to have an abortion the same as saying I think Miss PA has the right to choose what Miss PA does with her body, i.e. have an abortion?

well, you're right, it's not. That's works mentality and not Gospel centered at all. QUOTE(Soxy @ Dec 12, 2006 -> 02:27 PM) Actually, the first thing they did was to essentially take over the protestent church in Germany. Which was basically what started Bonhoeffer and his colleagues to start their own little seminary (and which, ultimately, resulted in their own deaths near the end of the wary). Some of the most chilling pictures of World War 2 (for me) are the pictures of the beautiful churches all decked out in swastikas. The Nazis didn't want to quash ALL Christianity, just those who wouldn't bend a knee to them. what she said.

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Dec 12, 2006 -> 02:07 PM) How exactly are you defining the Holocaust in order to come up with that statement? In the same way that gays, gypsies, etc were being taken away, most of the original protestors of the nazi regime were clergy and other outspoken christian figures. They were the first groups of people that Hitler "discarded" in order to fully implement his propaganda.

QUOTE(Soxy @ Dec 12, 2006 -> 02:00 PM) So, American citizens had to pay for Japanese citizens' sins because they were the same race? It seems like the people that are "paying the price" in all of those examples are the people who had already suffered the most. And, to be fair, isn't the retributive justice type theology much more Jewish than Christian? And, ultimately, what you say doesn't address your previous concern: if we were so Godly before prayer in school was removed, why did we commit so many atrocities when God was still part of American life? And I'd be interested to hear what the Jews, Gypsies, gays and intellectuals were "paying the price for" in the Holocaust. As well as what the Indians were paying for. Christians were the first to die in the Holocaust, FWIW.

QUOTE(Soxy @ Dec 12, 2006 -> 01:45 PM) Why didn't faith keep us from the Civil War? Or the poverty in 1930s? Or the introduction of Birth Control (well before the 1960s)? And I can assure you abortions have been happening long before Roe vs Wade. Where was our faith when we were interring the Japanese in the Second world war? Or during all the lynchings during the reconstruction? Where was faith during the Jim Crow laws? Or when child labor was allowed? Or in the rampant discrimination of immigrants in the 19th and early 20th century? Where were our values when we exterminated the Indians? We're just more aware of all the crap stuff that happens now because that is what sells papers. Can I be the one to point out that each emerging generation more or less tries to champion the one issue that their parents never seemed to get right, and subsequently, there'll be things that our kids say we're "square" about (probably chicken f***ing) and tell us how we f-ed things up all along? cool. Soxy, you make great examples and each one of those examples relates to a particular generation of people ready to take on an issue yet unable as they age to handle the next big issue. I think at some point a generation must face the social implications of constantly "freeing" our society. Some of your examples, however, do not belong in the same column as others. Roe vs. Wade is not the same thing as Jim Crow laws. Likewise, as many would argue, same sex marriage laws are not the same things as anything you've listed above.

Fun Facts from a Feature I just Figured Out... (oooh consenance!) Who posted in: Catch-All Anything Thread Poster Posts Texsox 646 -Our Catch-All King Soxy 422 FlaSoxxJim 326 DBAH0 266 Rex Kickass 231 SnB 231 southsider2k5 222 Queen Prawn 219 Steff 206 Heads22 205 LosMediasBlancas 175 Kalapse 121 Kid Gleason 116 Gene Honda Civic 114 Rowand44 112 whitesoxin' 93 greasywheels121 91 The Critic 78 kapkomet 77 sox4lifeinPA 75 SoxFan1 74 WHarris1 69 Brian 68 Balta1701 62 SleepyWhiteSox 55 qwerty 52 YASNY 52 Tony82087 51 Mercy! 51 Chisoxfn 45 AddisonStSox 39 IlliniKrush 38 Mplssoxfan 32 Flash Tizzle 30 witesoxfan 23 Goldmember 22 3E8 21 BigSqwert 18 KipWellsFan 15 kyyle23 14 Middle Buffalo 14 Yoda 13 Chisoxmatt 13 DePloderer 11 ScottPodRulez22 11 santo=dorf 11 Czarina 10 AssHatSoxFan 10 BDavisFutureHOF 9 Gregory Pratt 9 DonkeyKongerko 8 Mr. Showtime 8 knightni 7 Murph 7 EvilMonkey 6 SoxAce 6 GASHWOUND 6 southsideirish71 5 Balance 5 the southside tiger 5 Tmar28 5 Chisoxrd5 5 dasox24 4 HighHeat45 4 SSH2005 4 CWSGuy406 4 RockRaines 4 3 BeWareTheNewSox 5 4 redandwhite 4 maggliopipe 4 Jake 3 Buehrle>Wood 3 mr_genius 3 Steve Bartman's my idol 3 LowerCaseRepublican 3 RibbieRubarb 3 rangercal 3 mreye 3 Leonard Zelig 3 NUKE_CLEVELAND 2 max power 2 Divorceki 2 Ishmookie 2 da_bears86 2 Random 2 Capn12 2 whitesox247 2 Rex Hudler 2 tonyho7476 1 TheBlackSox8 1 beautox 1 ChWRoCk2 1 WilliamTell 1 Dick Allen 1 SouthsideNorthsideFan 1 farmteam 1 hammerhead johnson 1 whitesoxfan101 1 BobDylan 1 PoohIss 1 sti3 1 MurcieOne 1 chimpy2121 1 sayitaintso 1 smalls2598 1 Dan 1 iWiN4PreP 1 Spiff 1 Wong & Owens 1 Felix 1 OilCan 1 The Ginger Kid 1 rventura23 1 maggsmaggs 1 Crullrl 1 robinventura23 1

QUOTE(Texsox @ Dec 12, 2006 -> 01:21 PM) Just to relive some childhood memories, I cranked the a/c down to 60, stood in a bucket of ice water for fifteen minutes, then made some nice hot tomato soup and a sandwich. it better not be just ANY sandwhich.... there can only be ONE: THE GRILLED CHEESE

the list is being compiled as we speak. Once we get the names, we need to fill in the blanks for songs by these artists.

QUOTE(Jenksismyb**** @ Dec 12, 2006 -> 12:24 PM) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_correctness Most issues dealing with political correctness come from liberal movements. haha...wikipedia that's like going to mcdonalds for health tips

Ironically, My windows based mp3 player DESTROYS the ipod.... hmm.

QUOTE(Texsox @ Dec 12, 2006 -> 11:54 AM) Each person chooses their own path, some by not choosing. I am not questioning them attempting the trip they are on, nor would I question yours. You were a Native American in another life, weren't you?

QUOTE(Soxy @ Dec 12, 2006 -> 11:37 AM) You just liked the video. . . take it back... or the angry, rabid beaver will kill us all.

QUOTE(FlaSoxxJim @ Dec 12, 2006 -> 11:19 AM) She'd go on my guilty pleasure list. I like Jagged Little Pill and the follow-up album qute a bit – even if radio did it's best to kill them. definitely for JLP on the guilty pleasure... but, Thank U is one of the best produced songs I've ever heard.

QUOTE(southsider2k5 @ Dec 12, 2006 -> 10:33 AM) You realize that your supposed to donate your winning back right? It was through my employer... so no, I'm not giving it back ...I gave it to Miss PA so she could buy clothing

Alanis Morrisette - Thank U

I made money off of the United Way this year.... gave $75 and won $100 through a drawing

I would like to know who, in spite of the privacy issues, is in favor of something like this? maybe it's my "sunday school end times" indoctrination pouring out, but this is such a bad, bad idea. QUOTE(YASNY @ Dec 12, 2006 -> 10:25 AM) Mark my words. It'll happen. They'll make it so you can't just 'take it off'. 12 Monkeys comes to mind... ripping out your teeth to escape "the man"

so what you're saying is that....it's not the size of your pocket knife, but how you use it?

QUOTE(southsider2k5 @ Dec 12, 2006 -> 10:16 AM) Sox4lifeinPA and the Friends of PA s'os your face

QUOTE(southsider2k5 @ Dec 12, 2006 -> 10:16 AM) and goes to organizations I see at work everyday. What organizations go to your work everyday?

Maybe we should get rid of guns (except our military, of course silly) and outlaw religion in public places while we're at it. What else can we do to ensure the apocalypse by 2050? Perhaps burn books? Set up internment camps? QUOTE(YASNY @ Dec 12, 2006 -> 10:13 AM) The die is cast though. It's going to happen. It already happens in the form of Debit and Credit Cards....but having no choice but to implant something should NEVER be constitutionally sound.

QUOTE(Texsox @ Dec 12, 2006 -> 09:37 AM) The Republicans around here crack me up. Pussies? Americans? why it seems like just three or four years ago that Bush landed on that aircraft carrier with the giant Mission Accomplished banner behind him. Just to prove I'm not a pussy, I am ready for thousands and thousands of more Americans to die in combat. I want blood everywhere. I believe we should invade every planet if it means that no person on this planet is living under a brutal dictator. Only when every last person who wants harm to the US is killed and lays bloodied in the streets will I say enough have died. Then we need to kill their children, and their children's children. Most Americans understand the difference between a just, necessary war and everything else. Perhaps the lesson to learn here is don't mislead the US public. 90%+ of Americans supported the invasion. It wasn't until the truth started leaking out, until American soldiers stopped upholding the very laws they purported to believe in and want for the Iraqi people that support cratered. Americans are a few steps above the savages that some people here would find endearing. We understand that you can't go to war because someone is using torture on its citizens and then use torture in that war. Some see that as being civilized, some as being pussies. I'll take the higher road. Did we just become pussies because the Dems are taking over? I like the new campaign strategy for '08. whatever, pussy