beautox

QUOTE (StRoostifer @ Jan 13, 2014 -> 11:07 PM) Yes, and let me just add... Jerry was there for the discussion so that shows the Sox have money to take on Tanaka as long as the price doesn't go too crazy. Rock said if the annual price goes beyond 20M then they are out but even the Angels cannot go that high. Signing Tanaka would potentially allow the Sox to use a starter such as Rienzo, Johnson or possibly Danks as part of a trade to get a Catcher or even a DH/ LF after the 14 season depending on what we do with Viciedo (dh/lf). If the Sox signed Tanaka they would only have to deal witha tight payroll through the 14 season after which Dunn's salary comes off the books. There's also the possibility of trades involving ADA, Keppinger and Beckham which not only clears a bit more payroll but open up spots for young guys like Semien and Sanchez. Bottom line, the Sox really are in a much better position to afford Tanaka than the Angels. Also, the Sox are nowhere near the luxury tax threshold like the Angels are. I agree, Tanaka fits with Hahn's vision of this team competing. If the sox sign him this year there is no reason they can't be looked at as a dark horse for a WC spot much like Cleveland last year and in addition to that we have a lot of payroll flexibility coming into next off season with Dunn(15M) and Kepp(4-8M) coming off the books as well as having a very firm understanding of Carlos Sanchez and Marcus Semien. If Sanchez brings his helium with him from the VZL in his second go around at AAA at the ripe old age of 21 we could have a very good infield for years to come in Abreu, Semien, Davidson and Sanchez while getting value back in Ramirez(11-20M) and Beckham(ARB3) if they preform or are moved before the start of the season. Biggest question marks for this team going forward from '14 LF and C. Hope we can land a great looking backstop and maybe Alfredo Despaigne if he defects.

Prospect Digest's list

Ronan Thomas

QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Jan 12, 2014 -> 10:31 PM) Alfredo Despaigne? Is that your picture? Yes, heres to hoping he defects next year and Dayan proves he is a capable ML hitter and moves over to DH

290/360/520 25HR 9%BB 18%K

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Jan 11, 2014 -> 11:06 AM) I wonder how big of a check Arte Moreno will write given his limitations. If Yanks really aren't going to go crazy Sox could actually have a chance. I always figured Dodgers would go crazy. I still think Cubs would too, especially in this case, since everyone should have a pretty good idea what other teams are bidding. It isn't like its a blind bid. I'd think if the Cubs hear the Sox are the leaders by $5M or whatever it might be, they'd blow that offer up and come in higher (unless Epstein really is tied up). Hopefully Tanaka is secretly best friends with Shingo and Shingo tells him go to the White Sox!!! PS: I still don't know if it is a good idea to give the type of money being talked about but s***, as a fan, I'm not going to lie, it would make this probably the most exciting off-season in White Sox history. Whether it works or not, who knows. You got to like the fact that you don't have to use prospects / lose draft picks. Also, we seem to have a lot of cost controlled guys lined up which would allow the club to have a few guys signed to higher priced deals (and this gets a guy who at least over that long term window, should be in his prime). I just don't think the dodgers or angels go crazy with money for Tanaka. The dodgers for two reasons, they have Kershaw's pay day coming up shortly and they have plenty of depth on their 40man in the pitching department. The Angels need to start saving for Trouts record breaking contract they've got some room at 138m committed before salary ARB and are down from their '12 payroll of 155 but I don't think they make it happen.

Hes in!!!! see you in July

Sanchez is only 21 years 6 months and 2 days

QUOTE (Andy the Clown @ Dec 22, 2013 -> 06:26 PM) Personally, I'm a fan of Murphy. Good defense and nice secondary skills. He'd be superior to anyone we have currently. As far as the cost, maybe Keppinger, Snodgrass, and 4 million? The sox have the pieces to satisfy the yankees. Beckham & Gillaspie would provide some young talent that would be cost effective in keeping them under their 189M target. Even if you throw in Keppinger and 4M it still wouldn't be the worst thing. The players i would be looking at from the yankees farm are Sanchez(pipe dream), Murphy, Manny Banuelos who is now back from TJ (great buy low candidate) and left handed 1B prospect Greg Bird who is miles away from the show.

QUOTE (Stan Bahnsen @ Dec 19, 2013 -> 03:57 PM) I like Leury as a D replacement/pinch runner/backup, but not as a starter until I see a lot more at the dish. Carlos Sanchez doesn't turn 22 til the end of June, and is killing it in Venezuela. And, from what I've read, he's the only high-minors guy that profiles well to SS defensively - it's by no means settled, but many have doubts about Semien there. The first few months of CS' second go-around in Charlotte should tell us a lot. I hope he breaks out in a big way at AAA this season and gets off to a hot start that would facilitate a midseason trade of Ramirez and will have accomplished three things: better adjusting Abreu for 1/2 of a major league season, moving him for major league assets or prospects and opening up a spot for a very talent young prospect.

QUOTE (GreatScott82 @ Dec 18, 2013 -> 04:55 PM) It really makes no sense to carry along De Aza anymore. I'm hoping we can possibly get a young reliever in return for him. His value is way more than that, he will be 30 years old on opening day and under team control for 2 years with the option to extended a QO for his age 32 season that is literally his peak years 26-32. This year he should make 4.4mil and next you're looking at around 9.5 tentatively, thats 14m if we round up over two years. Over 600 AB's Oliver projects him to be worth 2.8WAR in CF over 600 AB, last year he had 675AB if you just do the math alone you should add .3WAR to his projection and moving him from CF to LF you can look to add an additional .3-.5WAR realistically for positive defense adjustments. So he goes from 2.8 to 3.4 based off ABs and moving him to LF conservatively. 1WAR as it stands today is going for nearly 7mil on the open market. With out any of my adjustments he should be worth 19.6M next season after taking out his likely contract you're left with a surplus value of 15.2M thats huge! add in additional ABs and moving to LF and you're looking at 19.4M. Let say he stumbles and declines slightly in his last year of arb and only produces 2WAR that is still a 4.5M surplus and that doesn't take into account inflation in the market either. TL:DR De Aza is worth far more than just a reliever you should be looking at two prospects in 6-11 range of a mid tier system based off that value alone.

With Hahn and the advanced scouts doing a great job reloading the ml team with real talent that has upside, and MI being a relative strength for the sox: Semien, Sanchez, Anderson, Johnson. I would prefer the sox go with what they can develop very effectively, pitching. I doubt Rodon is there at 3 but Hoffman has top of the rotation stuff to compliment Sale and Quintana, knowing the sox philosophy as well, it wouldn't surprise me in the least to see him fast tracked.

QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Dec 18, 2013 -> 01:37 AM) Other thing with Grandal... We'd then have 4 Cubans on the roster as starters, possibly Nieto if he beat Phlowers for the backup spot. Having two switch hitting Cuban hitters would be interesting. But more importantly, more Cubans could make JDA's adjustment easier. QUOTE (Chilihead90 @ Dec 18, 2013 -> 02:01 AM) And more importantly, it could really solidify a pipeline for Cuban players, similar to what the Yankees and Mariners have with Japanese players. Agreed on both fronts, with Dunn's contract coming off the books next year in addition to our modest payroll and cuba's shift in their pro players playing abroad policy. We could very easily see Alfredo Despaigne make his way state side next year. If that happens we would be in a prime position for his services. Keep Eaton in CF or move him to LF or move Garcia or just let Despaigne take over for left and provided Viciedo finally turns his tools into skills move him to DH, he is a right handed hitter as well so we would be a bit right handed heavy but Ramirez could be moved or maintained provided how Sanchez handles his second true go around of AAA. Pie in the sky time '15 DH - Viciedo R C - Grandal S 1B - Abreu R 2B - Semien R SS - Sanchez S 3B - Davidson R LF - Despaigne R CF - Eaton L RF - Garcia R Alright that was fun, getting back to this offseason I would like to see the following three players moved. De Aza to the O's for Mike Wright RHSP and Tim Berry LHSP Wright looks to be a middle of the rotation starter or power reliever and Berry is still a long ways away reminds me of former prospect Daivd Holmberg. Berry has got talent and a lot of project-ability but as it stands now he just repeated A+ at age 22. The O's system isn't what it used to be and has thinned out a ton, but they need someone to play LF and replace McClouth at the top of the order, Reimold isn't that player. Oliver projects De Aza as a 2.8WAR player in CF if you move him to LF where his defense is no longer a liability and actually an asset I can see a 3 win player easily. He is projected to make 4.4Mil in arb2 and it appears the rate of 1WAR is nearly 7mil that is a lot of surplus value(16.6Mil) for a team on the cusp of competing again. Also it wouldn't surprise me if later in the season the sox and o's team up again for a trade of Adam Dunn or Paul Konerko or both if they haven't resolved their DH situation by then. Beckham to the Jays for Aaron Loup LHMR and Sean Nolin LHSP and Adonys Cardona RHSP. Loup gives the white sox a young left handed middle reliever capable of getting both right and left handed hitters out effectivly, Nolin is the 10th rated prospect in the jays system by FG and BA, he has a celing and profile similar to Clayton Richard. Cardona is a teenage lottery pick that the jays paid 2.8M for; he features a low mid 90s fastball and a good curve but like most young prospects can't control it, he had a very down year at rookie ball in Bluefield. The Jays have missed out on every second basemen this offseason and earlier this offseason it was reported that 'Chicago's asking price is high for any type of package, and it's believed the organization is strongly interested in Blue Jays right-handers Aaron Sanchez or Marcus Stroman. Both of those pitchers are the prized assets of Toronto's Minor League organization and won't be easily pried loose, but it's possible the club will be open to potential deals considering its strong need to upgrade the roster.' link. Beckham is projected to make 3.5M in arb2 and Oliver projects him at 1.6WAR. Gillaspie to the marlins for Dan Jennings LHMR and Edgar Olmos LHMR. The marlins need a platoon partner for Ed Lucas. Lucas crushes left handed hitting to the tune of .330/.374/.509, he will be 32 years old by opening day. Personally I still feel Conor can develop into a 2-2.5 peak 3WAR player and platooning with Lucas against tough left handers would be great for him, seeing how he fairs right handers .261/.324/.414. Conor doesn't turn 27 till late July so there is still a fair bit of upside to him and he is slightly above average on defense at 3B; Oliver projects him at 1.8WAR next season. The sox would be getting another young solid left handed middle reliever in Jennings and a left handed reliever in Olmos that has some great tools that he hasn't quite turned into skills, he has some really easy heat

QUOTE (professa @ Dec 17, 2013 -> 09:30 PM) In a heartbeat. The only guy I'd hate to lose would be Beck, but Grandal has shown he can put up a mid .800 OPS in the majors. If he's shown it, he's got it in him. Sanchez offers no use to this organization (Semien and Anderson block him) except maybe as a back up middle infielder. Thompson hasn't done s*** in the minors to prove he could be a major leaguer someday. Switch hitting, 24 y/o major league all star potential catchers don't grow on trees and to trade three unknowns for that is a steal imo. gotta take a risk sometime. This guy could be just as good as Wieters, and is a former first rounder so you know it's there. 1. Eaton 2. Alexei 3. Abreu 4. Dunn 5. Grandal 6. Garcia 7. Viciedo 8. Davidson 9. Beckham Mighty good young core to build around No doubt Grandal would be a huge get. Its a really interesting situation thats going to continue to develop out in San Diego, he just had surgery and previous to that he had the PED / Biogensis scandal as well, and they have a solid regular in Hundley that should produce near 2WAR next season, in addition to Hedges getting a look later in the year. I doubt the sox could get him at a song per se but I think if Hahn really wanted him we could get it done with whats currently on our major league roster and in our system (Johnson / Rienzo + Jones + Sanchez / Johnson). Thats a lot to give up but I believe Grandal could develop into a 4-5WAR catcher while he is with the sox and he fits everything Hahn is looking for. Looking at that package you're giving up a potential mid rotation starter, an excellent middle reliever coming off a 2WAR season that will be 28 this opening day, and a middle infield prospect that is either lost a bit of shine or gained a ton of helium. Personally I still like Sanchez a lot; consider that he could spend the next two seasons at AAA and still be on an age appropriate schedule to make it to the big leagues and he still hasn't burned an option yet, to me his tools and bat play a hell of a lot better at SS then at 2B. Micah on the other hand is coming off a very good season and could very well be moving out of the middle infield as soon as this upcoming season to the outfield and following a very billy hamilton-esque path to the show.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Dec 17, 2013 -> 04:15 AM) Bernie Williams? REALLY? C'mon, that guy and Semien don't belong in the same conversation. Go look at what Semien just produced at the same age at the same level as Williams(1990), I'm not the originator of that comp, Matt Garrioch from Minor League ball is. God forbid sox fans dream a little bit about an offensive product from their system.

QUOTE (SoxAce @ Dec 17, 2013 -> 01:40 AM) Highly doubtful Jackson stays at catcher for the foreseeable future. And I still think Hahn should do everything he can to get Yasmani Grandal out of SD. PED's be damned, his pitch recognition + OBP would be an outstanding fit here as a catcher (use him as a #2, #6/7 hitter). Another patient Cuban (if Abreu is as advertised).. just what the doctor ordered. One of the biggest team weaknesses the sox had going into the offseason (OBP) can be seriously addressed. Or.. see if Seattle's GM is still "all in" this year and if he's lost his marbles enough to give us Mike Zunino. QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Dec 17, 2013 -> 02:30 AM) Problem is, what would it take to get Grandal? If Hahn can get Grandal from the padres that would be huge, Hedges should make it to the show later this year and the projections expect Hundley to produce roughly the same WAR as last season. looking at the padres roster and farm it would appear they need MLReady starting pitching, and a solution at 2B/3B shortly. I think Headley fully intends to test the FA market seeing how thin third base is around baseball. Gyorko can slide over to 3B or remain at second depending on what they do. Their farm has a lot of nice arms and Hedges a few older OF bats in the low minors and Jace Peterson a good looking albeit old for his league SS that should be starting AA this year. I would think the sox would have to offer up something like E & M Johnson or Sanchez, flowers or phegley and maybe someone like Barnum. Or prospects the sox acquire by moving De Aza and Beckham.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Dec 17, 2013 -> 01:56 AM) That would be if they signed Tanaka and somehow traded for a catcher. With three homers in the majors last year, Davidson, who has big-time raw power, reached the 20-home run plateau for the first time in his career. His long swing and inconsistent contact rate will keep his average low, however. He still has work to do at third base, but scouts have faith that Davidson has the tools to become an average defender in time. Along with Eaton and Davidson, the White Sox now boast a young core of outfielders Avisail Garcia and Dayan Viciedo, second baseman Marcus Semien and first baseman Jose Abreu. www.baseballamerica.com Interesting that they listed Semien with those other five guys. I think Semien will be an above average defender at the keystone and hopefully he can deliver on his comps of Marcus Giles / Ray Durham / Bernie Williams as a hitter. Eaton and Semien back to back at the top of the order excites me.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Dec 16, 2013 -> 09:49 PM) There's also Carlos Sanchez, who's supposedly having a great　Ｖｅｎｅｚｕｅｌａｎ　Ｗｉｎｔｅｒ　Ｌｅａｇｕｅ　ｓｅａｓｏｎ． QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Dec 16, 2013 -> 10:04 PM) Lol, what's with the drawn out exaggeration True, Sanchez is having a very good VWL .344/.423/.426 11BB% 14K% and is still really young. Even if he had another 2 seasons at AAA, would still only be 24 midway through that season. He's got some of the best defensive tools. I could see the sox waiting till the trade deadline to move Ramirez and monitoring Sanchez's progress at Charlotte, we could certainly use a switch hitter in this line up.

Don't move Ramirez for the sake of moving him, Semien projects more as a 2B. This year is going to be a lot of fun to watch. Lots of question marks but Hahn has put us in a much better position for a quick turn around. If Viciedo breaks out he can be moved to DH in '15 and maybe Thompson supplants eaton and pushes him to LF or the next crown jewel of Cuba comes to the south side in Alfredo Despaigne, he's the same age as Abreu and equally as talented and a very solid defender in the outfield. Ramirez, Viciedo and Dunn have more value to this team than any other I don't see Jerry paying Dunn to play some where else, Viciedo is still so incredibly young and will help Abreu's transition here and there is no one thats ready to push Ramirez off SS. Hahn should focus on moving De Aza and Beckham, and ideally flowers as well. All though i feel if they're looking to '15 as the year there is no need to let Semien waste away in the minors let him take his lumps at the major league level and catch up to the speed of the game.

love this trade this past deadline i was posting for Hahn to go out and get both Eaton and Davidson. Sox still have major league chips to get some more talent and they still can see what they really have in Conor. It appears rick is going purely with youth I think we see both De Aza and Beckham moved, De Aza will be 30 near opening day while Beckham is only 27.

QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Dec 14, 2013 -> 05:06 PM) Just saying it's all threes first full seasons of facing MLB pitching. Last year's rookie of the year put up .293/.354/.478 and about 23 HRs over a full season. I think it's unfair to expect all 3 essentially put up rookie of the year caliber numbers. I know Eaton and Garcia aren't eligible and Abreu isn't your typical rookie, but my point it is really tough to just come in and put up those type of numbers true but its not as if something of that nature hasn't happened, let alone recently look at the marlins of 2006 Hanley Ramirez a brief cup of coffee with the bosox before he was traded at age 22 .292/.353/.480 4.3WAR rule 5 pick up Dan Uggla at age 26 .282/.339/.480 4.2 WAR, completely written off as a rule 5 selection from Arizona ( a system that has a strong reputation for developing well rounded hitters consistently) Josh Willingham after having two cups of coffee with the marlins finally got a chance to play ever day at age 27 .277/.356/.496 1.8WAR with terrible defense in LF Abreu is more highly regarded than Hanley was at the time of the trade albeit older, 27 when the season starts. Garcia has the tools to put it all together and is only going to be 22 at the start of the season the same age as Hanley and won't turn 23 till early June. Eaton will only be 25 at the start of the season and has a very strong track record through the minors and comes from a great system. To me the thing the sox have going for them with this core is that youth and real upside the sox struggle developing hitters(time will tell with Semien, Sanchez, Thompson, Johnson and Hawkins) from the ground up but their advance scouts have a real propensity for grabbing bats that need a fresh start after a major league trial (Quentin, De Aza, Gillaspie). At the end of the day do I think the sox will compete next year? no, but do they have the upside to be a dark horse and advance their time table significantly and maybe grab a wild card spot if they catch all the breaks? yes. At the very least it will be a lot of fun to see at the ball park and on tv.

I would really like to see Hahn orchestrate something like this seeing how he seems to have success with three way trades. White Sox trade: De Aza, Beckham, Flowers & Carlos Sanchez Blue Jays trade: Aaron Loup LHP, Adonys Cardona RHP & Mitch Nay 3B Padres Trade: Yasmani Grandal White Sox receive: Yasmani Grandal, Aaron Loup, Adonys Cardona Blue Jays receive: Beckham Padres receive: De Aza, Flowers, Sanchez and Nay Grandal is blocked behind hundley and the padres should have Austin Hedges on the back swing when he is ready, flowers provides additional depth and the possibility, that he is a late bloomer. Their system lacks MI and CI prospects, Sanchez and Nay. Also they have a gapping hole in CF known as Cameron Maybin and De Aza gives them two years at a reasonable rate. The blue jays need a second basemen and loup is a decent looking bullpen piece which address one of our concerns, cardona is a live arm with a good fastball but little else to show for it now and nay while talented is only in A- ball and they still have lawrie at 3B. The sox get a good young cost controlled catcher that has dealt with a ped suspension and appears to need a change of scenery a good looking lh relief pitcher and a live arm. while opening up a major league spot for Semien to develop.

I like this trade, but i feel they should've been able to get a bit more because pitching is such a premium. During the trade deadline i was hoping the sox would acquire Eaton, he has the tools to be a 4WAR player year in and year out think Denard Span in '09 .311/.392/.415 with average to slightly above average defense in CF while stealing 20 Bags. A future core of him and Semien excites me tremendously. L Eaton CF R Semien 2B L De Aza LF R Abreu 1B R Garcia RF L Dunn DH R Phegley L Gillaspie 3B R Ramirez SS We're in a rebuild might as well take a full season to see what we have in Gillaspie and Phegley. I still think Conor can develop into a 2 win player at 3B and phegley could very well develop into a 1-1.5 war player.

If the sox acquire Eaton I hope Davidson is coming back as well. Move De Aza to LF and move Viciedo to the rays for lobaton and an Arm

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Dec 10, 2013 -> 11:07 AM) This tells me that De Aza is as good as gone. or they're going to move him to LF where he is even more of an asset