Texsox

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Mar 24, 2012 -> 02:37 PM) A very strong argument could be made for Bobby being Kenny's finest moment both in his beginning and his end. My pick has always been Estaban Loaiza. But Jenks runs a close second in my book.

QUOTE (mr_genius @ Mar 25, 2012 -> 08:50 PM) i haven't read the book or seen the movie. but i'm sure the villains are inspired by Obama/Democrats The GOP pats your head and pins a ribbon on your shirt. You have successfully completed the program!

It is impossible to become POTUS without donations from the very people who will be affected later by government policies. It seems weirder to me to have someone donate, and a politician accept, donations from someone they disagree with and not accept donations from people they agree with. So later it should come as no surprise that the elected official sides with the same people who donated to his campaign. Which is why I favor knowing everyone who donates, even if they do it behind and through a PAC or other such vehicle.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Mar 25, 2012 -> 08:42 PM) Why is anyone assuming that this guy had his gun out? No one's assuming that. We're assuming he saw a scary black kid, muttered to the 911 number that they always get away with this, wandered out to confront him, scared the kid to the point that he was telling people on the phone that some one was chasing him, and then at some point they wound up close enough that the kid struck the guy hard enough to hurt him, and then the guy responded by shooting him. Ideally, this should be a crime. In Florida, it isn't. That's about how I see it. Add in the wanna be crime hero personality and the gang image of a hoodie and you have the perfect storm.

Would he have been killed if he was wearing a sweater tied around his neck and carrying a snickers bar?

I guess if this happened while Bush was President he wouldn't have made any statements. You know white Presidents comment about white things and black President comments about black things.

harmless hyperbole

QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Mar 24, 2012 -> 03:54 PM) I get tired of the fake national outrage for anything that can easily be painted as something it may not even be. I'm getting that way also.

So two gun carrying people meet in a dark alley they can have a shootout with no one being charged because they are both protecting themselves.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Mar 23, 2012 -> 07:02 PM) So in perfect conjunction with this thread, what should happen in IL with the bribe taking D who was endorsed by the party, including the governor after his tape asking for cash in an envelope came out? He is arrested and put on trial. If convicted, a D replaces him.

QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Mar 24, 2012 -> 10:57 AM) lostfan needs to get in here and post his terrifying picture. lol, that one is scary. To the point, why is it that all of the 8th grade gang kids that are in my school wear hoodies and if you ask them to lower the hood, they start arguing? We're painting hoodies as being harmless, which they are, but the image that many of the kids are trying to build is as some gangster. Congrats, the hoodie has that image, now we're going to complain when the public begins to fear kids in hoodies?

QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Mar 23, 2012 -> 07:57 PM) Alright, props to Lebron, Wade and the Miami Heat for this: edit: it's an old photo but it was retweeted in support of the Martin family I'm wondering what image the Heat were going for when they originally took that photo? Tough guys that will beat you, or angels here to serve and protect?

BTW, at this point I see Zimmerman more as a misguided, overzealous, badly-wants-to-be-a-real-cop, Barney Fife type than a racist vigilante looking to kill minorities. That may change. Much like the rent-a-cop that originally was thought of as the Atlanta Olympic bomber.

The guy who started the thread is new and confused (or drunk)

QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Mar 23, 2012 -> 09:12 AM) He's not the first. To be fair to Geraldo, Treyvon was black. Doesn't everyone cross the street to avoid black youths?! Or a Hispanic with a gun?

Here is an interesting thought, what would the law be if Martin was armed also and during the fight Zimmerman was killed? I would hope the same non arrest. That would mean in this situation, where both seem to fear the other, that there could be a shootout in the streets with neither person charged. Amazing.

QUOTE (Soxbadger @ Mar 22, 2012 -> 04:18 PM) Police chief has temporarily resigned. In my opinion this a terrible application of the law, and that begs the question, why are the police interpreting law? Generally the job of the police is to make an arrest and then for the district attorney to apply the law and determine whether the charges should be brought. I still am unclear why a police officer would ever believe that were "prohibited" from making an arrest. Murder is a crime, self-defense, as most people would imagine, is a defense. Just because you have a defense, doesnt mean the police cant arrest you or that the DA cant try and convict you. Ultimately its the trier of fact who determines whether the defense should apply. At the end of the day, I expect charges to be filed. Maybe I am misunderstanding what you wrote, but how can the police not interpret the law? They have to arrest someone for something, that something would be their interpretation that a law was broken. The law seemingly gives people the right to defend themselves. The police would have to interpret which law to follow.

QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Mar 21, 2012 -> 03:56 PM) They are all relatively recent, but my wife has to get transcripts from five different schools. That is info hell.

OMG.

QUOTE (HickoryHuskers @ Mar 22, 2012 -> 12:56 PM) I know that murder is typically a state and not a Federal offense, but are there any grounds on which the Feds can go after him if the state refuses? I heard the feds are involved if it is a race crime. That seem to depend on the tape with so far has been inconclusive. If he uttered a racial slur seconds before the killing, as some people claim, then the feds can be involved.

QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ Mar 22, 2012 -> 01:42 PM) And by the way, the justifiable force statute is premised on the fact that YOU (the shooter) are not doing something illegal. I'd say starting a fight is an illegal activity (battery) making this entire statute inapplicable. Since there's some pretty strong evidence out there that the dead guy was being followed and harassed, it's entirely proper (and reasonable) for a jury to conclude that Zimmerman started the brawl, engaged in criminal activity (battery) and was therefore not afforded the protection of the statute. That's why my point 2 comments ago about punching people in the face to justify killing doesn't work. I hope you are correct. However, one example I read was a killing between two gang members. The killer was not charged because the prosecutors felt the other gang member (the killer) had a legitimate fear for his safety. Another prosecutor suggested that it was theoretically possible that two gang members in a beef could say, grab your gun meet me in the street in five minutes. In theory, the resulting killing would be covered by self defense. Each had a reasonable fear and was protecting themselves.

The big change with the new law was the person is not required to retreat if possible. Under the old self defense laws, since Zimmerman was in a car he had an obligation to leave. Now the person can stand and defend. The law was passed to make it easier to defend yourself and stop arrests and prosecutions. Florida also has very loose gun laws. This is exactly what they have allowed with their laws. Florida and 20 other states want it easier to stand up for yourself instead of running from criminals. I can see why the guy was not arrested. He had injuries, he had reported a suspicious person. Now with the new information, the testimony from his girlfriend, (which cannot be collaborated or verified) I think they should make a new decision and arrest him. The other big problem I see is "feeling" threatened. Each of us have different fears and levels of fear. Lostfan in a hoodie caused my blood to run cold. Why should there be a sliding scale? Grandma from Ohio may, and possibly justifiably so, feel "threatened" where I would be "concerned" and Knight felt "comfortable". Why should grandma be allowed to fire her weapon and knot knight? And to be clear, I believe what Zimmerman did was morally wrong. But if the articles I read were accurate and the criteria is feeling threatened, and without any obligation to leave as was easily available, than it just may have been legal. And if that is the case, and states don't fix their laws, then God help us all.

The author has stated it is reality TV meets Roman gladiator.

From people's reactions and what I read initially, I assumed Zimmerman was some retired old white guy not 28 and Hispanic. Also, from what I've read on the law in Florida, it seems to be more of a problem with the law than the police response. That law seems so wrong, I wonder how anyone would be convicted of murder.