beck72

FWIW, george offman reported on the 12:30 update on the score that the Brewers are very interested.

QUOTE(Chisoxfn @ Jun 26, 2007 -> 05:06 AM) I think people are accurate that the Sox should and possibly will look at Baldelli (heck they may approach it during the trade deadline, after Kenny has loaded up in other areas). The only question is whether the Sox could buy low. If the sox give up a decent enough prospect, they should be able to get the DRays to bite on dealing Baldelli. His salary is probably becoming an issue, after missing so many games. 2007 was probably his last chance the Rays were going to give him for staying healthy.

QUOTE(iamshack @ Jun 26, 2007 -> 05:23 AM) Again, I think we are misunderstanding the point of the article. While the Mets may be willing to part with some talent for Jose, that doesn't mean they are willing to part with any of their top 5 prospects. It just means they are willing to part for some talent for a pitcher who would be under their control for another 2 years as opposed to one under their control for another 3 months. It makes sense, but it doesn't mean you're getting Milledge/Pelfrey/Gomez/Guerra. I do think it may be possible to get Humber though. I think you're right. But if the Mets are willing to give more for Jose than Mark, and better than other teams will give for Mark, trading Jose would probably still be the best bet. Esp. as Jose has a no trade clause that he likely won't give up for many teams. Then, worst case scenario if the sox can't re-sign Mark, the sox take the 2 picks for Mark.

QUOTE(Chisoxfn @ Jun 26, 2007 -> 04:30 AM) Just a word to the wise...I'd listen to what JD is saying cause there is probably some wings behind it and JD I think me and you would be the only people that would like Jones on the Sox, haha. However I wouldn't give up any good prospects and it would be on the basis that Kenny is planning on loading up with young talent with the idea of eventually selling some of that young talent this off-season to fill other needs as well as a nice mix of vets coming in as well so the team will again be attempting to go at the division/series next season (with Jones playing left), a prospect elsewhere and a big name hopefully brought in for the other position (or two upper echelon outfield prospects). Jones for LF wouldn't be bad. Esp. if the Cubs paid most of his salary and it didn't cost much talent. The sox have basically 3 OF spots open for 2008. It would give them more options bringing in Jones, who has shown he can play more than one OF spot. I agree that Kenny needs to bring in some younger guys, esp. with speed. OF is the most likely spot.

QUOTE(DBAH0 @ Jun 25, 2007 -> 12:32 PM) I honestly think you could do it, even if you couldn't re-sign Buehrle. Garland, Vazquez and Danks are the 3 locks to stay. Floyd is just about ready. The Sox could plug a Pelfrey or Humber into the rotation, to continue the rebuilding phase. Pelfrey and say Milledge or Gomez or Martinez for Count would be a great offer. I guess it could technically happen w/o re-signing Mark. the sox could hang onto Mark for the rest of 2007, and try and work out a deal. Yet signing him would go a long way towards dispelling talk about the complete dismantling of the sox for 2008. [something if I were GM, I wouldn't want to be facing the same questions from the media for the next year. And it would relieve the pressure from Mark, who is and will be asked about that all the time]. anyway, if the sox are serious about competing in 2008 and beyond, they need to have a rock like Mark to build their rotation around. Why not come and sign him before the trades start happening? It might even make more teams up their offers for Jose and Javy.

QUOTE(Al Lopez @ Jun 25, 2007 -> 11:48 AM) Well, if you want some support for your optimism, here you go: http://www.dailysouthtown.com/sports/arvia...231ARD1.article Two things: my uninformed opinion is that the source for this story is most likely Buehrle's father. From the context it's not his agent, it's someone close to Mark and I think his dad occasionally talks to the media, so that's my guess. Second thing - I don't believe that Mark is gonna sign with us. I did read that article. Even with all the weekend talk about possible deals for Mark, I don't get the feeling anything is pending. If Kenny gauges the trade offers for mark, and they are far lower than he expects, he should re-sign him now. My guess is the offers will be lower than they should be. Yet offers for Javy and Jose are likely more than we think they should be.

QUOTE(DBAH0 @ Jun 25, 2007 -> 12:14 PM) Oh please make this happen. He's signed thru 2009. Perfect for you then Omar. I would take any of the Mets top couple of prospects straight up for Jose right now, that's how much of a burden his contract has become. First, the sox would have to re-sign Mark, ala what the sox did with Freddy. when first they signed Jose and Jon. Then they were able to flip Freddy. IMO, that would be the best way to start the "retooling". Not only is it good baseball sense, since Mark is the best sox starter, it's also the best way to show fans that KW's intent is to compete in 2008 and beyond, even if the sox start trading some players.

QUOTE(greasywheels121 @ Jun 25, 2007 -> 11:12 AM) If he's traded, I can't see there being any scenario that he re-signs here. That's what I was thinking. Esp. now, as Mark's said he doesn't want to be traded, with his wife expecting. The extra stress of being traded to a new city and dealing with a new baby--Mark probably wouldn't give any kind of discount to the sox in the offseason. But with KW laying it out in the open, saying Mark could be dealt, might be just the kind of hard ball move to get his agent to come up w/ an offer. QUOTE(shawnhillegas @ Jun 25, 2007 -> 11:10 AM) Right now, I say trade him. If you want to sign him, sign him this offseason. This team needs to be completely rebuilt. I started another thread about the Mets and Contreras, with an official stating that the Mets would give more talent for Jose than Mark. That way the sox would still "retool" in KW's words instead of "rebuild". The sox could offer Mark a good deal and still be in the position to get top talent for either Jose or Javy.

Now this would be the route to go. Sign Mark to a long term deal soon. Then trade Jose-provided he'd agree to waive his no-trade. Others have talked about jose maybe waiving his no-trade to reunite with El Duque. Makes sense that the Mets would trade more for a guy signed for 2 more years than for a few month rental. And if the Mets don't think El Duque is done, they must think Jose still has stuff left in the tank. IMO, Jose is more likely to go the route of Freddy, and not be as dominant as he has been. So why not get the young talent they can now. http://www.nj.com/sports/ledger/index.ssf?....xml&coll=1

Does anyone else get the feeling that Mark could very well re-sign with the sox, and stave off the trade talk? If his agent called the sox and asked for a 5yr, $75 mill deal, wouldn't the sox bite? With Mark in the fold--which he should be--that would leave the sox open to dealing Jose or Javy. That would still allow the sox to get younger. The return on a SP locked in for a few years would be even better than what the sox could get for Mark. I know this depends on Mark and his agent contacting the sox. But they can probably see what the going rate will be, based on current contracts. Esp. with Mark and his wife expected a child soon. He could guarantee his place on the south side with a no-trade clause for a few years. Thoughts?

Don't know if this has been posted before. But here are Boston's top prospects from Baseball America's top 100 this year: 33-Ellsbury 51-Buchholz 81-Bard 83-Bowden For reference, Fields was 45, Sweeney-55, Danks-56, and gio-72

QUOTE(elrockinMT @ Jun 24, 2007 -> 04:34 PM) He'll go to the Bosox simply becasue they have what KW wants and will probably pay it. We could keep Buerhle I think, but I would be intersted to know just what Marks agent thinks he is worth. He probably wants Zito type money and if someone paid that again (but you know they will) after Zito's performance this year they are crazy. If MB would take 12 or 13 million than I say we should sign him for 5 years. Boston does seem to have the prospects and the willingness to deal them. MArk should be offered a 5 yr. deal worth $16 mill per from the sox. Whether they do or not who knows.

QUOTE(maggsmaggs @ Jun 24, 2007 -> 02:37 PM) If the Red Sox would be willing to give up Buchholz and Lowrie and then another mid-level prospect, I would be in for it. Lowrie is a terrific SS/2b who has a tremedous on-base percentage and just is a very solid player. He is probably ready for AAA and could be ready for the majors next year. Buchholz has got great stuff and his numbers this year in AA are just plain filthy. This is a good deal for the Sox if they could get these two and then another mid-level prospect. Bowden is two years younger than Buchholz and has put up filthy numbers except in his recent stop at AA. With him being a bit further away than Buccholz, he's more likely to be traded. Esp. as the sox need a top position player. Same with Lowrie. I agree though. Two of those top four guys mentioned and another mid level prospect should be the price. Hold to that or keep the picks. QUOTE(DBAH0 @ Jun 24, 2007 -> 01:36 PM) They've got Jon Lester plugged into the rotation now as well don't they with Schilling's injury? IIRC, Lester's been hurt too. It's only a matter of when Beckett gets hurt. And Dice-K is still a mystery for the playoffs. Getting a proven big game pitcher like Mark makes a ton of sense. Red sox fans would go ballistic if a competitor got Mark, and their rotation went to peices preventing them from going far in the playoffs or to the Series, and they had a chance to acquire him. QUOTE(SEALgep @ Jun 24, 2007 -> 01:55 PM) I would have preferred to keep Buerhle out of the AL, but Boston could easily sign him in the offseason anyway. At this point, we just the most possible talent we can get for him. I'm not too familiar with their prospects, but if the article is correct, and the Yankees have interest as well, it seems to be our best bet on milking this for all it's worth. Mets and Braves are another option, but there's so much hype with attaining players between the Yanks and Red Sox, I have to think we could really make out well with this. With the sox not in the running for the playoffs, it means take the best deal out there, regardless of league.

With Schilling on the DL, and Beckett [an injury waiting to happen] their only other SP with an ERA under 4, the Red sox sure seem primed to pay the price in terms of prospects to land a SP like Mark. http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/Statistics/T...seasonYear=2007

Looks like Boston could be the leading spot for MArk. According to the sun-times, Boston's asst. GM Allan Baird [who only comes when they are serious for players] was in town for Mark's start. The Tribune also mentioned that Baird was in town Saturday as well. Could Vazquez be an option for Boston, because why else would Baird stick around in town after Mark left? I can't see Boston giving up either Ellsbury or Bucholz, their top 2 prospects. Yet I could see a Michael Bowden, #3 and SS Jed Lowrie, #8 deal. Both are in AA, though Bowden isn't having the same success he had at the lower levels. Of course the kid is only 21, and from Winfield IL. http://www.suntimes.com/sports/baseball/wh...T-sox24.article

QUOTE(fathom @ Jun 23, 2007 -> 02:44 PM) That's the most promising article I've heard yet about Buehrle. However, you have to worry that once he gets to test the market, other teams will blow us out of the water. That is a great article. If Mark got to the market, though, few teams would be willing to offer him a Zito like deal. He isn't the flamethrower teams want their #1 SP to be. But for the sox he's more valuable for his consistency, leadership, and intangibles. A 5 yr, $80 million deal should give Mark the contract he's looking for.

QUOTE(DBAH0 @ Jun 23, 2007 -> 01:17 PM) Jones was actually decent defensively before he came to Wrigley; So I wonder if just a change of scenery will help him there possibly, or whether he's just declined defensively getting older? Here's a little blurb on his defense. http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/playerScouting?categoryId=85225 The Sox RF is one of the easier to defend. Not a lot of room and pretty straightforward. Wrigley's is harder with the odd dimensions, curves and cement. QUOTE(hitlesswonder @ Jun 23, 2007 -> 01:27 PM) That year probably is what makes him attractive to KW. The Sox have 3 OF positions to fill next season and they'll bring in a veteran for at least one. Jones contract isn't huge (although it isn't how would want the Sox to use money) and signing a FA would take more years and money. I could easily see this deal getting done. Maybe for MacDougal plus a prospect like Russel? So for 2008, the OF would Jones in RF, Erstad in CF, and Sweeney or Pods in LF. Looking good. If the sox traded MacDougal [i could see it and the Cubs have the need] the sox would get Jones, some cash, plus a prospect. Looking at some old blog threads, it seems Jones was moved from LF to RF so the Twins could bring in Shannon Stewart. Having Jones in LF would be an upgrade defensively over Pods. http://baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=12923

QUOTE(DBAH0 @ Jun 23, 2007 -> 01:03 PM) Dang; I don't think Dye is healthy. And he certainly won't be getting better leading up the trade deadline. The sox will be better off offering him arb. and getting the picks for him.

QUOTE(gosox41 @ Jun 23, 2007 -> 01:03 PM) So I can assume that the Sox won't give up any minor leaguers who will ever see the majors??? On the flip side, what current Sox minor leaguers have a chance of actually being good in the majors. I still don't think the Sox should have to pay him anything. Bob KW has made decent trades of these type. I'd expect it would be for no one of significance.

QUOTE(gosox41 @ Jun 23, 2007 -> 12:51 PM) I just threw up in my mouth. This is terrible. 2 condiitons have to occur for me to make this trade if I were GM: 1. The Cubs eat his contract 2. We don't give up anything more then a bag of balls in return. Why take on a bad player with a bad contract when this team is out of it. We should be selling not buying. Bob Both conditions would be met. The sox have to be looking toward 2008. With 3 OF spots open, getting one half of a platoon for either LF or RF wouldn't be that bad.

I predict the sox will sign Buehrle to the long term contract he wants and deserves. Few other teams will go overboard and offer him a Zito like deal. My guess is the Cards are the only other team Mark would be willing to go to. And the sox can still come in with a 5 yr deal that they can afford to pay--as they'll have Danks and another young SP [FLoyd, or Gio] in the rotation in 2008.

QUOTE(DBAH0 @ Jun 23, 2007 -> 12:25 PM) This was from the Sun - Times; FWIW, Jones had a .833 OPS last season, so IF he could get back to that kind of form and you can get him on the cheap, then it might not be such a bad deal. For comparisons sake, Dye has a .708 OPS this season so far. But the major problem with Jones is 2 things, OBP and his inability to hit LHP. OBP wise he has a career average of .326, which well doesn't really cut it. And in his career, he has a line of .227./275/.349 against lefties. So if we acquire him, he MUST be platooned. And really it's a perfect oppurtunity for Terrero to do so. He has a .952 OPS against lefties this season. So how does a Jones / Terrero platoon sound? I agree. Jones cannot hit vs LHP. If the sox think Terrero can be that platoon guy vs LHP, why not. On the face of it, Jones/ Terrero sounds horrible. Yet Jones has been healthy--something Pods and Erstad haven't been. And it would provide the sox with one OF spot for 2008. With Pods, Dye, and Erstad gone, Anderson probably not long for the organization and Sweeney might not be ready for 2008, the sox have 3 OF spots to fill. Even if Rowand signs with the sox, they have another spot to fill--preferably with a high upside prospect via trade.

QUOTE(witesoxfan @ Jun 23, 2007 -> 06:33 AM) Or 35 starts but who's counting anyways And if Minaya is getting desperate for a starter, it will be Garland or Vazquez going instead of Buehrle, and he's suggested that quite a few times. He's looking for a pitcher who is under contract through atleast 2008, which could get interesting should KW think about blowing the team up entirely; he can get quite a bit for Buehrle, and he'd get even more for Garland or Vazquez. Considering the boner Minaya has for Vazquez - as one may recall, the Mets were the likely destination of Vazquez before KW seemingly stepped up and offered Chris Young for him - I think it's very possible the Sox could steal a couple very solid prospects away from Omar for him. I love Javy to death and am his biggest supporter on this board, but if him getting traded meant getting 2 good prospects from the Mets for him, sign me up immediately. Of course, KW would have to take off his Javy blinders for something like that to happen. I think that's the best way to get the sox the talent to be better in a hurry. Trading Buerhle and the other free agents won't get the sox the kind of impact talent the sox need to be contenders in the tougher AL Central. The Bmac trade should provide evidence that it takes talent to get talent. What the sox may lose in trading Vazquez [a reliable workhorse] they may gain in an everyday position player and a pitcher or two that can help get outs at the major league level.

QUOTE(Greg The Bull Luzinski @ Jun 22, 2007 -> 03:00 PM) I thought it was interesting that this Suntimes article seems to suggest all starters are available except Danks. THE LINK If we are dumping Buehrle, I would at least like to think we are keeping Garland so our rotation for next year is not set up to be worst in baseball for years to come. KW letting the media know that other starters could be available allows him to field offers. He doesn't have to trade a guy like Javy or Jose [though he should]. But if the right deal comes along, why not. Garland shouldn't be going anywhere.

A few things: I could see two guys being moved that could bring some value back to the sox that haven't been mentioned much--Javy Vazquez and Aardsma. The sox won't get much for an injured Dye. Better off getting the 2 picks for him. Mark may not get the sox asking price. They may be forced to take the picks for him if they can't re-sign him. The sox gave Javy room to improve--and he hasn't. The mets would likely give up a Carlos Gomez or Milledge for Javy being locked up for yrs. Not for Mark though, as was stated in today's NY paper. Aarsdma is a better bet to help some contending team. And he's got good stuff, and proven over some time in the bigs. IMO, though, he's a flyball pitcher not suited for the Cell. Jose could be dealt in the offseason--ala Freddy. But few teams will give up much for him. Yet the sox should shut him down and have him healthy for 2008.