whitesox61382

Wins aren't a good stat for judging how effective a pitcher is. Its that simple old man. A pitcher that wins 20 games with a 6.00 ERA because he has a great bullpen, defense, and offense(in other words plays for the Yankees) isn't a better pitcher(or more effective for that matter) than a pitcher that wins 10 games with a 3.00 ERA because he has a terrible bullpen, defense, and offense. Yet, with the crackhead logic that you use you would argue otherwise. Yes wins and loses are the only things that matter, but thats a team stat that relies heavily on how te team plays. The team determines if they win or lose(errors, run support, bullpens, luck, ect all things a starting pitcher has no control over), and a starting pitcher is a small part of the team. The stat that measures a pitchers effectiveness the best is ERA, since the amount of EARNED RUNS are the only aspect that he can control. Only old guys like you who have hit the crack pipe one too many times believe that wins are the best way to measure a pitchers effectiveness. Keep running Wright out their every 5th day because you think he is a good pitcher(as you think his 14 wins indicate), and than you question why this TEAM has gotten nowhere.

Lets get some things straight. No one is rooting against Wright. As Sox fans we want every Sox player to excel, but thats just not how things happen. Some players just don't have the talent to play everyday in the majors, and there is nothing wrong with getting on their case when they don't play well. Its a business, and if one of us didn't perform well at work, than we should suffer the consequences(being fired in most cases), and struggling major leaguers should be no different. Wright isn't a good pitcher, and its that simple. Please don't give me that 14 win BS, because you guys should be smart enough to realize that wins are a terrible way to judge how effective a pitcher is. When people say that he has potential, I think they mean the potential to give up the longball, because thats all he has done over his career. Combine that with his high walk total, and you have a pitcher with a high ERA who shouldn't be in the majors. I think the Sox should move him to the pen. He pitched pretty decent in that role last year. Move either Cotts or Rauch into the rotation.

It looks like Chris Young and Robert Valido both got off to good starts. It will be interesting to watch these two youngsters progress. The offense at Kannapolis should be pretty good. I hope that Gray can get some consistant playing time. That kid can really rack, but he might get stuck behind Valido and Gonzalez. I think that they should put Gray at high A ball since he has some college experience. Is it just me or does Birmingham never have a good offense. I usually go through all the minors and watch/keep an eye on about 5-6 top prospects at each level, but I don't see one prospect at AA worth keeping an eye on. Morse is probably the closest thing to a top offensive prospect at that level. It disappointing to see Miller get roughed up. He might have some of the best raw stuff in the system and this could really be a make or break year for him. Hopefully he can rebound.

While there is talk that Sweeney might eventually move to 1B, at this time he is still an outfielder and should be ranked as one. While the odds are certainly against Bounds and Rogowski(as they are for all prospects), that doesn't mean you should rule them out. I have been a fan of Rogowski's for a while because he is a complete player. He has shown the ability to hit for average, hit for power, draw walks, steal bases(rare for a 1B), and plays very good D(from what I am told). He had a bit of a disappointing season last year, but he is still young and giving up on a guy before he turns 23 is just plain stupid IMO. In regards to Bounds, all this guy has done is hit. Granted he was a little old for rookie ball the past 2 years, but that doesn't mean that he should be ignored. I am really looking forward to seeing what he can do in A ball this year. If he continues to hit like he did in rookie ball, than he could develop into one of the better position prospects in this organization, so saying that he has no chance is completely incorrect(although you are welcome to your opinion). The fact is that you can say that about almost every prospect and be right almost all the time, but to make that judgement on guys as young as Rogowski and Bounds who have both shown good potential isn't fair. I also really like Gray and want to see what he can do in A ball. He didn't get much attention in college despite his impressive stats because he played along side Weeks, but he could end up being a real steal in this draft. For some reason I think about Marcus Giles when I think of Gray. Maybe because they are similar size wise, are both average at best defensively, and both hit a ton. We will see if he defense develops, but I can definately see him reaching the majors. As my college coach always told me, if you can hit, than we will find a position for you. I think Lopez could be a decent player, and if he was listed instead of Gray I wouldn't have complained, but I think Gray has a better chance of making it because of his ability to hit.

You should probably include a closer prospect to make the list. With all due respect to Bullard and Baj, I think Fabio Castro is the Sox best closer prospect. With that said, it was a good article. The outfield depth is amazing and it is a tough pick.

I actually think it could be a good move for Purdue. Keady is a very good coach, but he hasn't been able to get top recruits the past decade or so(with a few exceptions). I think Purdue could use some new blood and I am sure that they would get a solid coach to replace him. Lavin would be top option. I also think their assistant Martin could be a good option. I have heard good things about him and I think he could better relate to top recruits.

DBAHO, you did a good job of explaining my reasoning. I am not suggesting that we trade CLee tomorrow. Remember that this thread is an attempt to predict what is going to happen by 2007. Based on JR's history it would make sense that CLee would be traded at some point in the future. As DBAHO pointed out, he is scheduled to make 6.5M in 2004, 8M in 2005, and has an option for 8.5M in 2006. 8+M for a corner outfielder with an OPS in the low-mid .800's and suspect(but improving) defense is a pretty big commitment(roughly 1/8th of the total payroll). Factor in the depth of young outfield prospects(Reed, Borchard, Anderson, Sweeney, Young, Nanita), as DBAHO points out, and it makes more sense to trade CLee, especially if you can fill another weakness in the process. Why keep CLee when you can probably get a low-mid .800 OPS and better D out of someone like Reed(not to mention a leadoff hitter, which the Sox really need) for 300K? Unfortunately, financial implications play a major factor in the decisions that are made. Personally I hope that the Sox keep CLee and he develops into the player that he has the potential to be, but this thread is based on what I think will happen and not what I want to happen.

The one reason why I like this move is because I think the Sox might hit into fewer DP's. Thomas will probably draw around 100 walks again this season, which means he will be on 1B quite a bit. One of Maggs few flaws is that he hits a lot of hard ground balls, which leads to a lot of DP's. Since Maggs doesn't draw as many walks and Thomas is more of a flyball hitter, I think that it will result in a lot fewer DP's, which killed this team last year. We will see if it is a permanent move.

wite, I am probably far from right. Your predictions(whether you thought about them or not) are probably just as likely to happen as mine. I have come to find that it is hard to accurately predict the future . - I do think Cabrera would make more sense than Garciaparra, especially from a financial standpoint. - I am not sure about 2nd. I am hoping that either Harris or Uribe can step up, but I don't have much faith in either. Losing Hummel and Miles could turn out to bite the Sox in the ass. Valentin could be a short-term option at 2nd if Harris and Uribe fail. I can't see the Sox spending money on 2 middle infielders this upcoming offseason, and I think the depth at SS would make Cabrera a better find, although I am a huge fan of the underrated Vidro. - With each passing day I think it becomes more and more likely that Maggs is gone after this year. I truely believe that he is only worth about 12M/yr on the current market. I think Sheffield is a good standard to go by, and I believe that Sheffield is slightly better. If Maggs wants 14+M/yr, than I think it is in the Sox best interest to let him go, at which point I hope they trade him before the season ends so they get something in return since it is highly unlikely that they offer him arbitration. The problem is that if the Sox are in contention(which they should be), than you wouldn't trade Maggs. With the Sox young outfield depth I think that will help with the lose of Maggs. - My guess is that Thomas plays 3 more seasons, reaches 500 HR's, and retires as a Sox, which means he wouldn't be on the 2007 team. - The only way that the Sox can deal Konerko at this point is if they take on an equally bad salary. The hope is that Konerko rebounds this year, which will make it easy for a team to swallow his 9+M contract for next year. I would love to see Konerko moved, especially for prospects, but I don't think it is likely at this point. - When I said that Buehrle would be traded I meant in either 2005 or 2006 when his backloaded contract starts to become a burden on the Sox payroll. I think St. Loius is the likely destination with thei need for starting pitching, some financial flexibility, and Buehrle's quotes in which he said he would like to pitch for them. Adam Wainwright was just a name that poped off the top of my head. I do think the Sox will ask for a very good pitching prospect in return for him. - Like Buehrle, when I mentioned the idea of trading Lee it was for the 2005 or 2006 season(most likely in 2006) when his backloaded contract becomes a burden on the Sox payroll. I doubt that the Sox would get rid of 2 proven outfielders within 1 year of eachother(assuming Maggs is set free). By 2005, I have a feeling that Martinez will retire(since he signed only a 1 year contract), Olerod will be close to the end, and Ichiro could also be gone, so that would certainly open a void for CLee. Seattle has already expressed some interest in CLee this offseason, so I think that would be a perfect fit. I think that the Sox would ask for Soriano in return, but Seattle would say no, and the Sox would twist the M's arm enough for them to give up either Travis Blackley or Clint Nageotte. - My lineup for 2007 assumes that a majority of the Sox prospects will live up to their potential, which WILL NOT happen. I all likelyhood you could probably substitute some cheap FA for a few of the prospects that don't develop. I think all of the prospects I list should be ready by 2007(assuming they develop). Reed will probably be in the majors by sometime this season. I believe that Sweeney will be on a fast track after his impressive showing this year and 2007 will be his 1st full season in the majors. Loney is in the exact same boat as Sweeney. In fact he is almost identical to him. He is a 19 year old, lefty with a pretty swing, who has really impressed this ST(BA of .444 in 27 AB's), and is probably on the fast track. Unfortunately I highly doubt that LA gives up such a promising offensive prospect. Anderson should be in the majors by 2006 at the latest. Borchard is in the same boat as Reed. Honel and Wing should be in the majors by 2005(2006 at the latest). Cotts should be in the majors fulltime by 2005. Wainwright/Nageotte/Blackley should be in the majors by 2005(2006 at the latest). So not only should all of them be in the majors by 2007, but most of them should have a year or 2 under their belts. - It would be interesting to pull up this thread come 2007 and see just how wrong I am .

Actually the Phoenix region was the region that killed me. I had Stanford-Maryland and UConn-NC State in the sweet 16 and UConn is the only one left standing. Kentucky losing hurt my St Loius bracket, but I am still ok in that region(had GT and Kentucky in the Elite 8). My East Rutherford region is perfect(thats what I get for being a pussy and picking all the favorites in that region). My Atlanta region is only missing Miss State(I thought about taking Xavier).

witesoxfan, pretty interesting little story, however I think a few things are a little unrealistic/optimistic(than again who am I to say what the future holds). - I don't see Garciaparra in a Sox uniform. He has expressed interest in heading out west, and I think the Dodgers would be a perfect fit with their money to spend, need for more offense, and need for help up the middle. -With that said, one guy to keep an eye on is Cabrera. I think the Sox could be a player, and with big named SS like Garciaparra and Renteria getting the attention of the big fish I think the Sox could sneak in and get Cabrera for around 6-7M/yr. -I think Maggs walks at the end of the year, if he isn't traded before hand. I will go out on a limb and say that he is traded at the deadline to the Dodgers for James Loney. - I think Thomas will either be traded or retired by the 2007 season. - Konerko will be long gone after 2005 and unfortunately the Sox are unable to trade him so they get nothing in return for him leaving. - I think Harris falls flat this year and the Sox finally give up on him. - They live with Uribe at 2nd until a better option appears. - I think Buehrle is traded because his backloaded contract takes up too much of the Sox spending money. I will go out on a limb and say that he is traded to St. Loius for pitching prospect Adam Wainwright. - I think Lee is also traded due to his backloaded contract and the depth that the Sox have in young outfielders. I will go out on a limb and say he is traded to Seattle for either Trevor Blackley or Clint Nageotte. - While your Helton purposal isn't that far fetched I doubt that JR would be willing to give one player that kind of money long-term. - I think the Sox will build from within over the next couple of years. The Sox upper minor league system is very weak, but the lower minors have as much talent as an organization. By 2007 I think the Sox will start seeing the benefits of that talented lower minor league system. - Here would be my 2007 Sox lineup, its not as original as witesoxfan though. 1) Reed - LF 2) Cabrera - SS 3) Sweeney - 1B 4) Crede - 3B 5) Loney - DH 6) Anderson - CF 7) Borchard - RF 8) Uribe - 2B 9) Olivo - c #1 - Honel #2 - Garland #3 - Wainwright #4 - Blackley/Nageotte #5 - Cotts/Wing Closer - Wright Division Winners AL East - Yankees AL Central - Tribe(Sox finish 2nd with a very young team and win the division in 2008) AL West - Angels AL Wild Card - Jays NL East - Mets NL Central - Cubs NL West - Dodgers NL Wild Card - Padres World Series: Angels over Dodgers(all LA WS) Ms. Cleo is done looking into the future.

IF Benson stays healthy? Do you understand how big of an IF that is? He hasn't pitched more than 130 innings the last 3 years, so how confident are you that he is going to stay healthy and break this trend? Furthermore, how can you be so sure that he will be better than Schoeneweis? His stats the past 2 years are only marginally better. Not to mention the fact that you have to take into consideration the .25-.30 increase in ERA that generally occurs when a pitcher moves from the NL to the AL. If you factor that into the equation, than Benson's ERA the past 2 years is almost identical to Schoeneweis's career ERA as a starter. So how are you so sure that Benson will be better than Schoeneweis? Both have the potential to improve with Benson having mild sucess early in his career, and Schoeneweis adding a cutter and refining his change. The deciding factors for me are the following: 1) Lefty - Schoeneweis is a lefty, and through the years lefties have had more sucess than righties. I also like the idea of having 2 lefties in the rotation, especially when you consider that they have different approaches(Buehrle - finesse and Schoeneweis - power). 2) Health - Schoeneweis has never had any serious injury concerns, the same can't be said for Benson. He has had major surgury on his arm and hasn't pitched 130 innings since. 3) Trade - The Sox already have Schoeneweis, but to get Benson the Sox would probably have to give up a very good prospect, especially if JR were cheap and made Pittsburgh pay some of his contract(which would force him to give up a better prospect) Add those 3 things up, and I am going to give Schoeneweis a shot(with his new pitches) before I come to the premature conclusion that he is a terrible starter and the Sox need to trade for another marginal starter like Benson(another possible Ritchie calibur trade). I am not questioning your pessimism, because it is warranted to some degree and nothing but optimistic opinions from everyone can get old very quickly. I agree with you that on paper the Twins are probably the team to beat this year, but the Sox(and Royals for that matter) aren't far behind and could easily win the division, so counting them out before the 1st pitch is thrown is way to premature, and I think thats what most of the posters are taking offense to.

How can you say that the Sox have no chance? The Sox might not be the favorites(at least I don't think so), but they certainly have a chance in the AL Central. You critize Schoeneweis, which is fine because I don't think he will have a great season, but you have to understand that the 5th starters last year combined for a 6.75 ERA last year. Schoeneweis's career ERA as a starter(5.25) looks like a CY Young canidate compared to the production that the Sox got last year. Furthermore, have you seen the end of the rotations for the Twins and Royals? They are just as bad as the Sox. Finally, Benson certainly isn't the answer. He has posted an ERA of 4.70 in 02 and 4.97 in 03. Not to mention the fact that he is injury-prone(missed the entire 2001 season and hasn't pitched more than 130 IP the last 2 years). Just some things to think about.

I didn't do quite as bad as you , but the upsets definately put a dent in my brackets. - I lost 6 of my sweet 16 teams(Kentucky, Gonzaga, Miss State, Stanford, Maryland, and NC State) - I lost 2 of my elite 8 teams(Kentucky, Stanford) - I lost 1 of my final 4 teams(Kentucky) - My Final game is still intact(UConn over Wake Forest)

Look at all that fat shifting over to Colon's left side when he threw that pitch. That is disgusting.

Why has Rauch fallen off the radar the past couple of days? His 1st outing was very good and his 2nd outing was so-so, but he has performed no worse or better than Grilli(for example). I realize that if Grilli is no kept on the roster, than the Marlins will get him back, but I don't understand why Rauch has all of a sudden fallen off the radar. I think his upside is better than any of the other bottom of the rotation pitchers(Schoeneweis, Wright, Grilli). He had a solid year last year, including a great 2nd half, and it puzzles me that no one mentions him. I can understand sending Cotts to AAA to prove that last year wasn't a fluke and improve his control, but Rauch has nothing left to prove in the minors(IMO). Oh well, I guess it is good to have enough depth that Rauch doesn't make the roster.

Cotts throwing strikes, which is always nice to see. 1-2-3 for him. I still think he needs a little time at AAA, but he could definately play a big role in the 2nd half.

Does anyone know who the 3rd batter was. I took a quick glance and didn't recognize him. It was a pinch hitter for the pitcher. Of course the Chip and Steve were talking to the Cubs GM and didn't bother to call a play during the inning.

First of all, you clearly misunderstood what I meant when I said depth. I was in no way refering to the rotation as a whole. Secondly, you are under the misconception that depth automaticly means talent, but that is not nessacarily the case. The simple point that I was trying to make is that the Sox have multiple reasonable options at the bottom of the rotation and backend of the bullpen, which can't always be said(last year as an example). Furthermore, I think you really don't understand the numbers that a "typical" #4-5 starter/backend of the bullpen pitcher puts up in the AL. A "typical" #4 starter generally puts up an ERA in the high 4's(give or take a little). A "typical" #5 starter generally puts up an ERA above 5(give or take a little). A "typical" backend of the bullpen reliever generally puts up an ERA in the high 4's-low 5's(give or take a little). Is it unreasonable to think that the Sox can't get that production(and probably better) from the #4-5 starters/backend of the bullpen? Finally, you can't make a habit of judging pitchers based on a handful of outings in the majors. If teams disregarded pitchers after a few bad outings, than most of the top pitchers in the game today wouldn't be where they are now. The fact is that a majority of pitchers(including the top pitchers in todays game) struggle in the 1st couple of years in the majors. Lastly, which pitchers put up poor numbers in the minors? Wright? Rauch? Grilli? They all put up pretty impressive numbers in the minors, so please specify which pitchers you are talking about. In conclusion, the Sox don't have a great pitching staff, but there is certainly some potential and DEPTH(multiple reasonable options that could fill in if a pitcher is struggling or injuried).

I a perfect world, the Sox will keep 7 relievers(only 4 bench players), which would allow them to keep Grilli, Rauch, and Wright. It really doesn't matter which of them is the starter and which of the 2 that start off in the pen. I would like to see Wright in the pen, however, because I believe he could excel in that role(ala Hawkins). I would kind of like to see Rauch as the 5th starter, but if Grilli pitches better than him, than he should be the 5th starter. Another thing to keep in mind is that Schoeneweis probably has a short leash, so if he struggles as a starter he could be moved to the pen, and Grilli, Rauch, or Wright(which ever isn't the 5th starter) could get a shot in the rotation. A forgotten man in all this is Ginter. I had him as my favorite to secure one of the bullpen spots, but he hasn't pitched yet. Does anyone know whats up with Ginter? A sleeper to watch out for is Diaz as well. He might be able to sneak into the bullpen under the radar. The thing that I like is that the Sox actually have some depth and serious competition for the final pitching spots. This will only make the team stronger IMO.

The word on the street down here in Tucson is that Ryan Sweeney is the youngster that is turning heads. He showing the ability to be a possible 5-tool player and is flat out raking. I really think this guy is going to be a top prospect by the end of the year, and a youngster that could develop very fast. I really think he was the steal of the draft last year.

I got to go with Evans. Every mock draft I have seen has Evans above Woods, Clayton, and Jenkins. Plus I have read numerous articles that talk about how much Evans stock is rising. Take it to the bank, Evans will be taken before Woods in real life.

Unfortunately, I think Alford would be one of the top canidates if Davis was fired. I am not a huge Davis supporter, but I would much rather have him than Alford. I don't understand IU's fasination with Alford. I realize that he was a great player here, but great players don't always turn into good coaches, and IMO Alford isn't a good coach. He really seems to lack good recruiting skills(the one thing that Davis is pretty good at) and that might be the most important thing in the college game today. I have no doubt that there would be some other big name canidates mentioned. IU has fallen off a little over the past decade, but it is still a pretty high profile college job. After Knight was fired, Pitino was one of the favorites for the IU job(I would have loved that), and I would assume that other big names would be mentioned(included up and coming coaches at the mid-major level). I think this article suggests that Davis will have at least one more full season, and I think that is fair. However, he has set some bad records this year. 1st regular season losing season in 34 years, and barring a miracle run in the Big 10 Tourny the 1st time since 1985(I believe) that IU has NOT made the Touny(2nd longest streak to Arizona I believe). These are things that don't sit well in Indiana. My guess is that if IU doesn't win 20+ games next year(including the tournaments) AND get to the Big Dance that he will be fired at the end of next year. Despite the great recruiting class, Davis could have a tough season next year. Most reports/scouts think that Smith(the prized recruit) is all but guaranteed to go Pro instead of step foot at IU. This significantly weakens IU recruiting class(makes it a boardline top 10 class). Furthermore, IU will still be plagued with a lack of talent and depth in the front court. They are losing their best big man in Leach and only adding 1 true big man(White). That makes for an extremely weak front court, unless Davis can pull a miracle and get Tello(a top 25 PF) to commit or Ewing/Kline make great progress by next year.

I think they will take Dockett. His stock is really rising and Tennessee has already lost 2 starting D-lineman(Kearse and Smith) so it only seems logical that they would take someone like Dockett. Receivers like Evans and Clayton are typical 1st round calibur draft picks, but with the depth at receiver this year they might slip down to the 2nd round. I was never impressed with Troupe, although with Wycheck retiring they could go with him, but I think their D-line need is greater.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2004/bask...s.ap/index.html Almost every time that a GM, athletic director, owner, ect says that their coaches job is secure it almost goes without saying that they end up being fired within the next year or so. I think that Davis should get 1 more year to prove himself. He has a great recruiting class coming in and should be given a shot to see what he can do with it, however if he struggles again next year, than there is little doubt that he will/should be fired. Losing is not taken lightly at Indiana.