Kenny Hates Prospects

QUOTE (Melissa1334 @ Aug 14, 2009 -> 05:20 PM) no, nothing wrong with that. but me being a sox fan, i wouldnt be a poster on a non sox board, esp twins, tigers, etc boards. he wouldnt want rios just bcuz the 60mil too lol oh how the royals have gotten the fans to think the same loljp oh, btw, besides last yr, dejesus' numbers every year are very avg and he doesnt steal enough bases considering he has pretty good speed. nice player but rios is still better Agree. DeJesus is a nice player, but he's a left fielder who doesn't wow you with speed or power or anything really. He's a smart hitter who is hard to retire and he hits a lot of balls hard, and he gets on base, but he's a complimentary piece IMO, while Rios at his pre-2009 production level is a core player you're supposed to build around.

QUOTE (WCSox @ Aug 14, 2009 -> 05:58 PM) Total salary on a contract is a lot more important than dollars per game. When the Sox traded for Peavy, nobody cared about the Sox over-paying him to pitch for only one month this year. The problem was the $70 million or so owed to him over the course of the contract. If you're in a the playoff hunt, the 40 games in August/September or September/October are worth a lot more than 40 games in April/May. If contending teams weren't willing to over-pay for good players in July or August, we wouldn't see numerous trades after the All Star break every year. What he's saying (I think) is that for teams near, at, or over their budgets, about 40 games isn't enough to offset the remaining cost of the contract.

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Aug 14, 2009 -> 05:28 PM) $4M for ~40 games is a pretty significant amount of money to give to a reliever. We as Sox fans complain about Linebrink and Dotel and they get that for an entire season. Exactly. If a team is already at its max payroll-wise then does Wagner sell enough tickets/food/merchandise etc. to offset the $4M or whatever left owed? Probably not, especially for a contender that has already made additions that factored in a projected late-season surge in sales. Ownership groups do not like to lose money, and there have been and will be in the future far better players who will clear waivers simply because another $1M or so puts them on the wrong side of their projections. Remember last year how we didn't claim Chad Bradford or Paul Byrd when each player could conceivably have helped us and would have only cost a little over a million or less? Even if Wagner has not hit waivers yet and is about to shortly, there will be contending teams that will be forced to let him go unclaimed, and even if he made it through the NL to us I doubt the Sox would claim him after the Peavy and Rios additions. The Yankees have said they can't add salary. Are they bluffing? Maybe, but they made no significant additions. Boston added salary with VMart and is eating the contracts of Lugo, Smoltz, and Kotsay, possibly others. The Dodgers brought in Sherrill (could that be the end of the leftover Manny money?) and the Cards added both DeRosa and Holliday. The Phils already brought in Cliff Lee's contract. It's no given Wagner gets claimed by anyone. Baez clearing at less than half the price of Wagner I think sends that message, as a lot of teams out there could use another solid righty in the bullpen.

Here are a few more reasons to get Wagner: Hideki Matsui Johnny Damon Robinson Cano Eric Hinske ...because if we make the playoffs we're probably going to run into the Yankees in the first round.

QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Aug 14, 2009 -> 02:11 PM) I never thought we had a chance at Goodwin. And with Danks, Mitchell and Thompson in the fold, he's not much of a loss. Morgado, Jones and Williams are the guys we really need to get inked (two of three would be more than acceptable). I obviously have no problem with the Peavy trade, but our pitching depth took quite a hit. We've got to replenish ASAP. Our overall pitching depth didn't take much of a hit IMO. Peavy will be a big upgrade over Richard and DCarter is a long way off given the organization's comments about his changeup. Russell had improved but was still facing a numbers game given the Pena acquisition and the amount of good right-handed relievers in the upper levels of the system. The real loss IMO was Poreda because it seriously weakens our lefty reliever depth. The closest lefty we have is probably Leesman in Kanny now. Justin Jones looks like he's committed, so it will really help if we can get Morgado to ink on that dotted line. We should be targeting young LHP both in next year's draft and also in trade over the offseason.

QUOTE (High Mileage @ Aug 14, 2009 -> 02:34 AM) He's a slighty above average player, with a superstar contract. Most Similar Batters 1. Pete Reiser (950) 2. Shane Mack (942) 3. Gabe Kapler (940) 4. David DeJesus (939) 5. Danny Taylor (939) 6. Roy Weatherly (938) 7. Ray Blades (938) 8. Coco Crisp (936) 9. Milton Bradley (934) 10. Wally Judnich (934) I wouldn't have wanted Rios for DeJesus, let alone Rios for $60M. He's a superstar talent who is this year playing like an average offensive CF and is on a contract that even in this economy would be below market value should he revert to his previous career numbers, which is to be expected in a friendlier hitting environment where meaningful baseball is played. If Rios played on the Royals he would be the best position player you have. No need to get jealous about the Sox adding Rios and Peavy while your outstanding GM preps for the playoff run by adding the vaunted Yuniesky Betancourt.

QUOTE (Jenksy Cat @ Aug 14, 2009 -> 02:27 PM) So basically there's not a chance in hell he clears waivers to get through the NL to us... Well, Jason says he's owed $1.75M the rest of this year plus the $1M option. Most contending teams are probably at their salary limit or beyond it and would need authorization to claim him on waivers knowing the Mets would in all likelihood dump Wagner's deal if a trade could not be worked out. Danys Baez is only owed half that and yet he has cleared waivers despite being healthy and having a halfway decent year. Wagner hasn't pitched in the Majors for a year. It's possible Wagner hasn't even hit waivers yet. Maybe the Mets will wait for his rehab to finish and then call him up to showcase him for a game in the Majors. That would drive up more interest, but then it would also make it tougher getting through waivers. Or maybe he has already cleared waivers, or maybe he has already been claimed. We don't know.

QUOTE (son of a rude @ Aug 14, 2009 -> 02:10 PM) pipe dream. No. Wagner missed half of last year and all of this year and will not qualify for compensation. He has a $1M buyout on a $10.5M option that is definitely not getting exercised from a team that is already paying KRod and Putz. The Mets are way out of the race and if he's healthy, expect him to be traded because there is always a demand for good power lefties.

QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Aug 14, 2009 -> 02:13 PM) Let's call KW right now and tell him to do it. He is game for that ain't he? I imagine the Sox have already had scouts watching his rehab outings.

Wagner >>> Randy Williams I signed up for this a while ago and am still on board. His rehab assignment so far: 6IP, 0R, 3H, 0BB, 0HBP, 0WP, 8K and supposedly hitting mid-90's. If he clears waivers he should take talent to acquire, especially if we want to get some salary shaved off, but he shouldn't cost anything all that great in terms of prospects. I propose a deal where we split the buyout, pay a little bit of salary this year, then send them a good but lower-ceiling prospect or two.

QUOTE (Markbilliards @ Aug 14, 2009 -> 01:36 PM) What is the last day to sign drafted players? Monday, think at midnight or noon or something

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Aug 14, 2009 -> 01:45 PM) Goodwin will be attending UNC people. [sarcasm]Does he have a brother we can trade for in the meantime who may be willing to drop Borass? Is Tom Goodwin any relation?[/sarcasm]

QUOTE (knightni @ Aug 13, 2009 -> 05:39 PM) I have a feeling that Thome will be back next year as the big lefty bat. If that is the case then there's really no place for Flowers to play except at C hitting vs. lefties, because we'd never bench Thome against RHP, and if Flowers can only get AB vs. lefties, I'd much rather keep him in Charlotte so he can catch everyday. No reason to get so excited about a prospect that we end up forcing him into a bad spot. All it would take would be one bad month statistically in limited playing time along with a couple bad errors, and suddenly Flowers would be back in Charlotte with less confidence. If we can't find AB we should just wait until 2011 or mid-season 2010 if we're out of the race at that time and then turn it ALL over to Flowers.

QUOTE (Wise Master Buehrle @ Aug 13, 2009 -> 05:32 PM) Let's just hope that Rios is aware that if he pulls that kind of stuff here, he will not have many friends in Chicago for the duration of his contract. We should also remember we're talking about a team that was not long ago managed by a guy who would challenge his players to fist fights to resolve everyday disputes. Something tells me between that and the constant 3rd or 4th-place finishes, Toronto didn't exactly have the most cohesive clubhouse.

QUOTE (qwerty @ Aug 13, 2009 -> 05:37 PM) Not true. Lillibridge was highly criticized during practically all of spring training. Lillibridge is no defensive wizard by any margin. Lillibridge is not a major league baseball player. Well, not everyone hated on him during ST. The K's and lack of walks were a problem but he wasn't hated on like he is now. Lillibridge can play a Major League SS and because of his arm would probably be the 2nd best defensive CF on our team. He may not be a starter but he's a more than capable defensive replacement and pinch runner.

QUOTE (knightni @ Aug 13, 2009 -> 05:26 PM) Flowers shouldn't be a DH unless the Sox have a third catcher and Flowers' defense isn't good enough to start. Also, I'd be hesitant to play Flowers at 1B for fear of a Toby Hall injury repeat. I just wouldn't want to take away playing time from a prospect like that. At least let him hit. Carrying 3 catchers would be fine because if Flowers DH'd a lot, you could look at it like 2 catchers and a DH. Plus having Flowers on the bench next to the pitchers and Ozzie should help him learn more about catching than playing 1B. But he could play 1B here and there if we wanted him too. The main concerns I'd have with Flowers being here next year are his playing time and the lack of a big lefty bat in the middle of the order. If we work those two things out while keeping AJ (because it's foolish to expect Flowers to be able to handle a veteran pitching staff like AJ can straight out of the minors) then I'd be fine with having him here in 2010.

Games like last night really hurt though. It's games like that that really seem to lift up a team and start a winning streak or bring everyone down and lead to a period of poor play. Thank God we have today off.

Rios deserves the benefit of the doubt here. Toronto is kind of a s***ty place to be, not only because of the dome and turf, but because that team can play very, very well - well enough to win other divisions in baseball - and still fail to make the playoffs because of New York, Boston, and Tampa Bay. In Chicago, Rios will go into each and every ST with not only playoff expectations but also a realistic shot at making them. If we make the playoffs this year, it will be 3 division titles and a World Championship within a 5-year period.

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Aug 13, 2009 -> 04:46 PM) Yep, feels good since I'm almost always wrong, haha. Except I'd rather have been wrong cause I love Getzy. It is okay though, Nix is solid and Lillibridge is a darn nice bench player if used properly (great defense at multiple positions and speed). Thank you! I've been arguing this for a while. Lilli wasn't hated until he had to play regularly and it wasn't his fault we didn't have better options. His defensive versatility and speed can be an asset to a playoff team. Now that Lillibridge is back up, this is even less of a reason to keep Wise. Lilli can backup at SS so Nix doesn't have to play there ever again and he becomes our 3rd CF after Rios and Pods. Wise is just taking up a spot and it's about time we called up another pitcher. I don't know what the rules are as far as calling up Nunez again (how long does a player have to stay down after being demoted before he can be recalled again?) but just putting another arm in the back of the pen would help us in case we run into another situation where our pen gets really overworked like last night.

QUOTE (MattZakrowski @ Aug 13, 2009 -> 09:11 AM) Playoff rotation of Peavy Buehrle Danks Floyd I think we just have to get there. Agree. And as bad as some of our relievers have looked, we still have a ton of talent in our bullpen. Rios makes our OF defense a ton better and our team speed makes us constantly dangerous. The 2009 Sox could be a lot like the 2008-2009 Bulls in that the team that makes the playoffs (if we get there) is going to have a deceptively poor record. We'll be a lot better in September and October than we were only on. But unlike the Bulls who don't have the talent on the court to win it all, the Sox actually do if they get hot at the right time.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Aug 13, 2009 -> 02:52 PM) I want Flowers up and in a Platoon next year too, but seriously who is going to give Castro that money?: If he's platooning with AJ, where would Flowers play against righties? 1B? DH? I guess if we had PK, AJ, and Flowers split up the C, 1B, and DH spots we could get them all enough playing time, but I really think we're going to need a lefty DH. Maybe we can pick up a lefty RF to replace Thome's bat, but finding a good defensive lefty-hitting right fielder who can also get on base and hit for power is like finding Amelia Earhart in the bottom of the ocean.

QUOTE (Requiem Schmuquiem @ Aug 12, 2009 -> 12:35 PM) []His fastball topped out at 94mph How reliable the gun? I hope it's not like Hoover Met --- what with 99 MPH for Aaron "Mike Porzio" Poreda and all. Ugh.

Wow... Withholding excitement because he looked pretty bad this spring, but still great news. Can't wait to watch him in ST as he should see a lot of time. I thought the biggest concern going into the season was whether his bat would play at 1B, but so far he has answered those questions in the affirmative, so the improvement behind the plate is just gravy. It would be fantastic to finally be able to develop a strong all-around catcher after years of Ben Davis, Josh Paul, Mark Johnson, etc. ' I do hope we can bring Castro back at near the minimum and ease Flowers in instead of throwing him into the fire right away.

QUOTE (OilCan @ Aug 12, 2009 -> 08:25 PM) Who is that Josh Fields hitting 3-3 v Pawtucket? I just now realized that by hitting refresh I get new quotes from Master Shake. Brilliant!