Chicago White Sox

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jan 14, 2011 -> 11:44 PM) I just think considering the age of the roster and the contract situations of some of our pitching staff, should we not win this year or next year, we could reach a point wherein it is most prudent to rebuild and take the route they considered this offseason, but ultimately decided not to take. And at that point, having Adam Dunn around really isn't going to help us. I would, however, have been willing to take the risk in committing to Beltre because I feel adding him, as well as Lee and Thome would have given us a better team on the field for the next two years than the Dunn/Konerko combo will. If we fail to win in the next year or two, why can't we trade Dunn at that point? Wouldn't that only help the rebuilding process?

QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Jan 8, 2011 -> 01:05 PM) I won't go nuts over two years and 4 million. But my stance on relievers remains the same. And I'm one that doesn't believe this team is any better outside the massive upgrade in Dunn. If Beckham and CQ don't bounce back and PK regresses along with not having Peavy for possibly half the season we could once again fall short to the Twins or even the Tigers. I understand your stance and the risk behind signing relievers to multi-year deals, but how else were we going to improve our bullpen for 2011? Free agency was our only option and that meant offering multi-year deals. There's obviously a huge risk that Crain and/or Ohman sucks in one of their years with us, but would you rather throw out two unproven minor leaguers without great track records in 2011 to avoid that risk? Given our situation, I'll worry about 2012 and 2013 later. It would have been utterly stupid to go into the season with obvious holes in the bullpen, given the potential of our offense and rotation, because we were worried Crain and Ohman MIGHT be bad in future years.

QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Jan 7, 2011 -> 05:56 PM) Then why waste coin on Ohman? What would you rather spend our money on other than the bullpen? What other need do we have at the major league level that deserves more attention right now? You keep saying don't sign relievers to multi-year deals, but how else do you expect us to improve the bullpen in 2011 if we don't have any options available in our minor league system? I don't think we can afford to trade what little minor league talent we have for a reliever. I don't see another choice but to overpay in free agency, especially since we're all in 2011.

QUOTE (LVSoxFan @ Dec 8, 2010 -> 03:59 PM) Wait we let Freddy walk? Who's taking his spot? I thought our five were: -Peavey -Buehrle -Danks -Floyd -Garcia Did I miss something? Edwin Jackson.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Dec 8, 2010 -> 10:24 AM) Because before you know it, you're paying out a bunch of money to players that are no longer on your baseball team. Maybe if this wasn't a one-time event. Who else do we owe defer money to? Other than possibly Manny, I don't think there is a single player we owe deferred money to who won't be on our roster next season. At the end of the day, all this does is bring the present value of that third year down a bit. I think PK was willing to help out the Sox financially a little bit in exchange for a third guaranteed year. The deferred money is only a positive for the Sox.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Dec 8, 2010 -> 09:55 AM) That 6 million figure for 2013 is probably evidence that we didn't want to go that 3rd year and we're going to be paying Jake Peavy $4 million to buy out his contract. Great, now we are derferring money too. Why is deferring money a bad thing??

QUOTE (flavum @ Dec 8, 2010 -> 09:16 AM) If Reinsdorf is overpaying Konerko, I hope he in turn extends out the budget so they can actually get a bullpen, and not be forced to trade Floyd and/or Quentin. This signing won't be something to celebrate until we actually know what the roster is looking like going into February. This is exactly what I'm worried about. I'm torn between the Konerko/reliever via trade and DLee/FA reliever options. I see pros and cons to both options. However, I'm really concerned that if we sign Konerko, KW is going to overpay for a reliever using Quentin. He may think with Konerko and Dunn he can afford to sacrifice some offense to strengthen the bullpen. I honestly think that would be a huge mistake. That's why I'm starting to lean towards the DLee option if KW can also get a legitimate right-handed setup man.

QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Dec 8, 2010 -> 03:10 AM) So he had an off year in which he was suffering lingering effects from a broken hand the year before. From '07 to '09 he sported a .935 OPS. I really don't see this as a bad move. And at only 1 year? Worth the risk, IMO. I've got to be honest with you, that .935 OPS is a pretty skewed stat. In 2007, he had an absolutely crazy and complete outlier of a season. He put up a 1.037 OPS, which was due to an usually high BA of .282 and SLG of .627. Pena, if healthy, is more like a .870 - .890 OPS player IMO. That is incredibly valuable for a team that needs a left-handed power bat. I think it's the perfect signing for a team like the Cubs.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 7, 2010 -> 04:33 PM) I don't know how we could. What would interest them. Quentin? They kinda have that but better in Braun. Sale can't be traded as anything but a PTBNL and that's a mess. Morel and Viciedo are really our only 2 legit trade pieces right now, and trading Morel makes Teahen your 3b starter again since you'd have no money left over after taking on Fielder. Basically, the best legit non-pitching offer we can make is Viciedo + Escobar, and I'm not sure I'd do that deal either considering that Fielder's going to be a $15 million or so player this year. I meant Beckham and a couple of prospects. Again, not saying I'd make that trade, but I'm sure that Doug Melvin would consider it.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 7, 2010 -> 04:15 PM) You'd be crazy to value Fielder and Gonzalez the same in a trade. First of all, one of them is a solid defender, the other is already best as a DH. Secondly, Gonzalez is on tap to make $6.5 million this season, while Fielder is looking at an arbitration raise from his $11 million deal last year. I wouldn't give up Beckham straight up for Fielder. I wouldn't have given him up for Gonzalez either, but I'd be less angry about that one. I agree with you completely. I wouldn't trade Beckham for either guy, although I'd probably have gotten over a Gonzalez trade quickly if an extension was worked out. Anyways, I'm just saying we could probably make a competitive offer for Fielder without including any major league pitching.

QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Dec 7, 2010 -> 04:08 PM) Yeah now that you mention it, that would be tough. Even if you package up some 2-3 of Escobar, Mitchell, Reed/Petricka (if they are even eligible), Mitchell, etc., maybe with one of the lower level guys... that probably still wouldn't do it, and the already thin system would be thoroughly gutted. But, if the Sox called, they must have had something in mind. I almost wonder if they were thinking someone on the major league roster, like Quentin. There's always a possibility they make the same offer they made for Gonzalez assuming they could sign Fielder to an extension. Not sure if Milwaukee would be interested in such an offer though.

QUOTE (SoxPride56 @ Dec 6, 2010 -> 12:11 PM) In that same article, he says it will be the teams highest ever...we had a $121 million payroll in 2008 according to Cot's How much of that figures includes considerations from other clubs? I know we were getting cash for Thome and Vazquez.

QUOTE (dmbjeff @ Dec 6, 2010 -> 11:11 AM) maybe quentin and viciedo could be offered up for rasmus?? With the signing of Berkman, they'd have zero interest in Quentin now.

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Dec 6, 2010 -> 10:57 AM) This is just an assinine contract. They better hope that they can win early in there years because this contract is horrid. Even worse, this sets the market for Carl Crawford at a lot of years and around 20M per year. That is unbelievable because Crawford isn't worth near that, imo. What's crazy is that this offseason is going to be full of massive overpays and the Sox may get away with three of the biggest steals in Dunn, Paulie, and A.J.

QUOTE (ScottyDo @ Dec 6, 2010 -> 09:33 AM) Granted. But it's clear, based on a whole season's performance, that all of those issues are not currently a problem for Konerko. They may be in the future, but that's a guess no matter who you're talking about. Can you say the same for Lee? As far as Lee + Putz vs. Konerko, sure, I'd rather have the former, but we don't have any idea what this team's budget is. We assume we're approaching the max, but we have no idea, really. So if you're asking Konerko v. Lee straight up, I'm going Konerko all the way. Agree completely. If the budget allows it, I think Konerko is the best option for winning in 2011. Sucks losing out on the draft picks, but you can't let that affect your decision if you're attempting to go all in.

Send Dayan to AAA and try him in the OF. If he shows he can handle it, then you have your 2012 LF/RF. If not, you can look into trading him at the deadline or next offseason. The kid is still extremely young and raw. I don't see how his value could go down by giving him more seasoning and a chance to play a position where his bat would be more valuable at. Whatever you do, you don't just trade a prospect like Dayan because there is no immediete fit for him. A bunch of s*** could go down and having a bat like his in AAA is incredibly valuable.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 4, 2010 -> 10:48 AM) If Konerko is signed, Dayan Viciedo. QUOTE (beckham15 @ Dec 4, 2010 -> 10:53 AM) if we sign konerko maybe a viciedo for bell swap? Heath Bell is a free agent at the end of next season, but I'm assuming he'll be type A. I'd consider trading Viciedo for him but I wouldn't give anything else of value.

QUOTE (pktmotion @ Dec 4, 2010 -> 10:41 AM) I was thinking about this the other day and it probably won't happen because LA is loaded with pitching. But what about a Jackson for Kemp swap. They both are in contract years, money owed is $8.35(Jackson) and $6.95(Kemp). Maybe include $1-$2 Mil to make it a wash or a low-level OF prospect like Tyler Kuhn. ...Quentin could then be used to get a young #4-5 starter. Someone mentioned the Reds, which would make an interesting trade partner. I'd be interested in Kemp, but not at the expense of one of our starters. Keep the rotation as is and if there's a way to get Kemp only using Quentin and minor leaguers then I'd consider it.

QUOTE (Stan Bahnsen @ Dec 4, 2010 -> 10:18 AM) This is what I'm worried about as well. Love Rios, but he's not a consistent enough run producer to be in the 3 hole. Yeah, I'd want Rios batting 6th if possible. Here would be my ideal lineup (assuming Pierre has to bat leadoff): 1. Pierre 2. Beckham 3. Dunn 4. Konerko 5. Quentin 6. Rios 7. Ramirez 8. Pierzynski 9. Morel I think that's a really strong lineup. Quentin's ability to hit righties also brings some balance in the middle. With Guillen as our manager though, I'd swap Beckham and Ramirez. I hate taking the bat out of Beckham's hands.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 4, 2010 -> 10:12 AM) If Paulie comes back, Dunn should hit 3rd. Let Paulie hit with a man on. Maybe flip them against lefties. I think Dunn and Paulie should bat 3rd and 4th, but I'm pretty sure Guillen will want Rios batting 3rd again next season.

QUOTE (Marty34 @ Dec 4, 2010 -> 10:09 AM) Time to push the learning curve for Beckham. I don't think they win the division with him hitting 9th or Rios hitting 3rd, and while Beckham may be best suited in the 2 spot I believe he still has the potential to be a solid 3 hitter. A Beckham/Dunn/Konerko*/Rios, middle of the order minimizes the base-clogging of having Dunn/Konerko batting back-to-back. Unfortunately, I don't think Beckham is ready for hitting 3rd and I'd rather not have him bat 2nd if Ozzie is going to insist on sac bunting Pierre over all the time. I'd rather have Ramirez batting 2nd and Beckham batting 7th. If he's got Dunn, Konerko and Quentin in front on him, Beckham is going to have a lot of chances to drive in runs.

QUOTE (ScottyDo @ Dec 4, 2010 -> 09:57 AM) Wow, what a ridiculously backwards way of looking at things. If that's truly how the Padres feel, they are a stupid, stupid team. "Well, we'd better trade this guy before we accidentally contend for the division or something..." Do you remember the "White Flag" trade? Selling off key pieces in the middle of a pennant race can create a lot of resentment with your fans. Look how long it took our fan base to recover. I don't think there's anything wrong with trying to avoid a similar situation as long as your return isn't going to be insanely better at the deadline.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Dec 4, 2010 -> 08:46 AM) What does Quentin bring that Rasmus doesn't? Terrible defense from an easier position? I also don't know where you get the idea that Williams has stated that the White Sox are interested in Rasmus - if he said that, he'd either be guilty of tampering or you have a pretty damn good source and shouldn't be posting that kind of information on here. Beyond ANY of that, LaRussa has (virtually) no control over personnel decisions, and it's up to John Mozeliak to determine whether or not Colby Rasmus gets moved. Considering Rasmus has like 4 years left before he hits free agency, and LaRussa has like 2 years left before he hits the links, I think he's probably going to keep Rasmus. Buehrle obviously makes no sense because they need to save money to pay for Pujols, and they have an entire rotation under contract. Where are you going to fit Buehrle into a rotation that consists of Wainwright, Carpenter, Garcia, Westbrook, and Lohse (who is due like $10 million)? What value does he add? The answer to that is "virtually nothing," so any trade involving that Cardinals does not involve starting pitching going over. The main player the Cardinals would be interested in would be Alexei Ramirez. You'd also have to include Morel or Viciedo, and then another prospect too. People like to say that Rasmus isn't proven, but, lucky or not, the guy put up a .276/.361/.498/.859 line last year while playing CF. That's pretty much like Beckham doing the same thing. Are you going to trade Beckham if he does that, even if he said that he enjoyed sex with women over the age of 60 and wanted to make love to Ozzie's wife? Are you saying you think it would take Ramirez, Viciedo and a prospect to get Rasmus? That price seems ridiculous. Why is Rasmus worth so much more than Ramirez?

QUOTE (Springfield SoxFan @ Dec 4, 2010 -> 08:05 AM) It has to be the Cardinals, KW has a man crush on Rasmus and he will be in the Sox outfield next year. I think KW wants to get Paulie and Putz signed quickly so he can look at possibly upgrading the existing roster. I still think there's a reasonable chance Quentin gets moved if KW is able to bring in another outfielder and Rasmus would be a great target. I just don't know what we could offer. Unless the Cardinals have interest in Viciedo or the prospects we get in a potential Quentin trade, I just don't see a match though.

QUOTE (Thunderbolt @ Dec 3, 2010 -> 12:25 PM) I actually think Teahen could have a Mark Derosa-esque effect off the bench for this team. Unfortunately, two of the guys he would back up, Dunn and Quentin, both hit righties better than lefties, so his value would be minimal there. Also, with Vizquel on the bench, there is absolutely no need for Teahen to ever play 3B. So that really only leaves 1B as a decent bench option and you have Dunn available for those few occasions. The way this team is currently constructed, there's little reason to keep Teahen around.