Eminor3rd

QUOTE (Dunt @ Oct 16, 2014 -> 03:35 PM) Im saying no to giving up that type of package and taking all that money on top of it. As others have pointed out, CarGo is injury plagued and that is a lot for a guy that cant play 150-162 games. I'm just saying it would get it done. I'm on the fence as to whether or not it's good for the team. Our front office would have to have reason to feel good about his medicals, of course.

QUOTE (Chilihead90 @ Oct 16, 2014 -> 02:15 PM) I don't think there is anyway the Rockies take that offer. None of those guys are blue chip prospects. To get CarGo, you may have to build a package around Tim Anderson, someone they may like when they want to trade Tulo eventually. I think it's a viable offer if you assume you're taking all the money off of their hands.

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Oct 16, 2014 -> 02:17 PM) Fielding percentage is a horrendous metric to evaluate defense. Using advanced defensive metrics, the Sox this past year, ranked 28th in team defense (Astros / Indians were worse) with our defense costing us 48 runs. The Royals defense ranked 1st and saved 74.8 runs.

Yeah, our defense is GARBAGE in the corners. Abreu, Gillaspie, Garcia, Viciedo. Yikes.

IMO, the Royals are clouding our judgement, everyone. The reason they are winning is because they are currently doing EVERYTHING better than everyone. To me, we should think of our priorities in terms of the holes we need to fill, and we should fill the holes with guys that are good at as much stuff as we can afford. A run scored is a run saved. vice versa. Priority 1 = corner OF bat, preferably left-handed. Ideally, it replace Viciedo. If not, it platoons with Viciedo. Move Garcia from RF to LF if necessary. Priority 2 = acquire many pitchers, both starting and relieving. Reclamation projects with upside, young castoffs with upside, undervalued assets, etc. To me, we have only two guys locked in the rotation next year. Noesi, as much as we're impressed, ended up with a 4.75 ERA (4.83 FIP). Danks can be DFA'd for all I care. We'll find a place for Rodon when we're ready. For the reclamation model to work, you need to bring in four guys for two spots so that when you end up with Felipe Paulino, you have Jason Hammel to use instead. Same with RPs: the list of guys who are good relievers for more than a few years is extremely, saddeningly small. Get good, cheap arms with warts and expect 25% of them to stick under your tutelage. Priority 3 = acquire good catcher that is here for several years. Flowers will make a good backup. Prioritize defense/handling over offense. It can be a veteran or a young guy, whatever.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Oct 16, 2014 -> 10:00 AM) Well, Hawk the idiot, who the game has passed by, said KC had the best bullpen in the league in March. They have had a great bullpen for a few years now. But that was when it included Soria and when Tim Collins was a monster. Hawk didn't see Wade Davis coming.

KC also BARELY made the postseason. I think any time you come to a conclusion where you say any of pitching/hitting/defense/baserunning is any more important than the rest, you're overthinking it and you're not making a useful conclusion. A good team needs to be able to do all of those things, and if they don't they're going to struggle to overcome it. KC's weakness is offense, and because of that they snuck in with the wild card. Now, during the postseason, they have more homeruns than EVERY other team. The pitching in defense isn't trumping offense in the postseason -- it's being tacked onto a monster offense that didn't exist before. KC is a solid team that is playing hot at the right time.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Oct 16, 2014 -> 07:32 AM) Melky has a ton of warts. It is very understandable why some wouldn't want the White Sox to sign him. That's not why it would ruin greg's offseason though. I'm not real high on him either, honestly. But it's because I'm not sure how good he is.

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Oct 16, 2014 -> 06:34 AM) Why would that ruin your offseason? Because greg is more concerned about our players being likeable than he is about our team winning games.

QUOTE (LDF @ Oct 15, 2014 -> 01:14 PM) and I will still continue to say, he may surprise many next yr. I still think he will rebound. I am done with danks discussion. I am really battling an uphill battle. keep up the good discussion. I hope you're right, I just don't see any reason to believe. Danks is a command-based pitcher, and from what is now a pretty generous amount of "rebound time," he can only touch his old velocity of low 90's by sacrificing his command. He's comfortably in the mid to upper 80's. When he's on, it'll play, but the margin for error is SO slim there that if he's having even a slightly mediocre night, he's going to give up BOMBS. I predict 4-5 good starts out of him next year that make you drool a bit, but also 4-5 total meltdowns and 15-20 starts of 4.50-5.00 ERA. To be effective he really needs to be near his best every night, and that's just too much to ask of anyone.

QUOTE (StRoostifer @ Oct 15, 2014 -> 01:02 PM) I did not know that about Gillaspie, there goes that... Let's put it this way. Since Belt is likely to fill the LF void left by Morse, the Sox will likely have to over pay to get Belt and that's not likely to happen either. I would love to have Belt but the idea is just not very reasonable. Montas could be used as part of a package for Travis Snyder tho. Belt: You're right, prob not available. Just saying that's the TYPE of guy to target with a guy like Montas. Snider: Holy god Hahn would be instantly fired if he traded Montas for Snider.

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Oct 15, 2014 -> 11:25 AM) Those are 3rd tier guys. We have one of our own - Danks. Danks is not even close to a third-tier SP today. He is replacement level at $14m per annum.

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Oct 15, 2014 -> 12:23 PM) Trading the little bit of young pitching we have is not advisable. That's how we got into this mess. Sox couldnt' even cobble together a decent starting 5 last year, not to mention a bullpen. Sure as heck don't need another Swisher trade. We're not talking about trading our guys for like Matt Kemp or anything, we're talking about cost-controlled, mid-to-late twenties guys that fill long-term holes, like Brandon Belt. Building around pitching prospects is incredibly risky business -- or at least riskier than building around positional guys. To me, we have enough holes to fill on the roster that I'll gladly trade some risky upside for a bird in the hand, so long as said bird is controllable with upside.

QUOTE (chw42 @ Oct 15, 2014 -> 09:55 AM) Sub .400 SLG the past two years. If you hit him second, that's fine, but that doesn't cut it for a guy who might hit 3rd, 5th, or 6th on this team. Steamer projects a 109 wRC+. You wouldn't take something like that batting 5th or 6th?

QUOTE (LDF @ Oct 15, 2014 -> 07:48 AM) I truly believe in how the sox brass will identify the priority of their needs. I see the sox going internal with Phegley or thru a trade. if 1 of the other posters who is very good with the advance stats, maybe they can answer this. I believe Flowers had a better 2 half than he did in the first half. does anyone have a guess why if this is true? You are correct, and substantially: 1st half: 61 wRC+ 2nd half: 149 wRC+ Also, by month: Apr: 132 May: 75 Jun: 8 (lol) Jul: 103 Aug: 97 Sept: 174 http://www.fangraphs.com/statsplits.aspx?p...amp;season=2014

QUOTE (StRoostifer @ Oct 14, 2014 -> 07:23 PM) As I said in another thread, with Morse heading to FA and leaving LF vacant it makes too much sense for the Giants to put Belt in LF. But for conversations sake, Lets say he can be had for the right price. I agree that Montas would raise an eye but what else do the Sox have to send with Montas that the Sox aren't trying to hold onto? I wonder if there's any chance they would have interest in Gillaspie since it looks like Panda is going to FA. I don't think Gillaspie/ Montas makes a trade but could be intriguing enough for trade discussions to continue/ get started. Didn't Gillaspie have a public falling out with SFG before they dumped him? I doubt they'd want him back. Also, I think it would take more. Like Montas/Semien/random flyer or two. Maybe even a stronger #2 piece than Semien, actually.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Oct 15, 2014 -> 09:09 AM) A large part of his negative view is his low baseball IQ in the OF. If that wasn't there, it would change everything. To me it is rather like saying if Paul Konerko was fast, would you like him better. Well sure, but that ain't gonna happen. I was just responding to the post that said Rasmus has been essentially Viciedo at the plate 2 of the last 3 years. I was making the point that you can take that level of offense if it comes with high-end defense.

QUOTE (scs787 @ Oct 14, 2014 -> 09:34 PM) Rasmus' D would be nice, but offensively he's basically been Viceido 3 of the last 4 years. If he comes rather cheap( I'm talkin 7-8N) I guess it wouldn't be the worst signing though. But if Viciedo played high-end defense, would you dislike him so much? I know I wouldn't.

QUOTE (LDF @ Oct 15, 2014 -> 07:31 AM) and I am not going to disagree. however others might think differently. Chiefly, his children

QUOTE (LDF @ Oct 15, 2014 -> 07:29 AM) oh cmon now, this is baseball at its best. discussing the value of certain players. this is fun. My whole point is that it is precisely NOT discussing players of certain values. It's discussing acquiring players based on things that are NOT related to their value.

QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Oct 14, 2014 -> 07:55 AM) His war would have 5th on the staff at the cost of nothing. It's a hole. If you wish we had a 0.7 fWAR out of our 5th spot, you're not factoring in opportunity cost. The fact that our 5th starter happened to be worse doesn't change the fact that a 0.7 fWAR starter isn't very valuable.

QUOTE (MAX @ Oct 14, 2014 -> 08:10 PM) I think you missed the mark on my reasoning. Are people in sports going to use drugs while on your favorite team? Yes, they are. The team really has no choice in the matter. When the team chooses to attract and acquire a proven cheat with a tens of millions of dollars that is entirely different. I understand that I have taken a hard stance on this but that's how I feel. I think of all the pitchers who were affected by Cabrera's cheating and it makes me sick. He likely contributed to the demise of some young pitchers careers while using PEDs. The consequences of his actions are far reaching and not easily defined. I'm so glad I don't care about PEDs this much. What a stressful thing to have to want your team to NOT acquire players that will help it win.

QUOTE (StRoostifer @ Oct 14, 2014 -> 12:25 PM) This is an interesting idea with logical points made to support it. I agree that a guy like Montas does not need to be shopped as teams will naturally inquire about his availability. I'm very curious as to what kind of return Montas would bring or with him as part of a package. I think this is the type of guy that would have to start a conversation about, say, Belt.

Obviously I want Martin, but I acknowledge that he may end up too expensive. I've always loved Aoki, even though it seems like no one got on his hype train until his power disappeared, strangely -- I guess being on a playoff team will do that. I'd take him on a two or three year deal at $6-7m AAV I like the LaRoche idea at like 2/$24m or so.

QUOTE (TheFutureIsNear @ Oct 14, 2014 -> 06:08 PM) Again, didn't read the 1st 14 pages of this thread so don't know if he's been mentioned yet, but what about Travis Snider? He doesn't exactly have a ton of MLB success yet, but he's still 26 and has some great pedigree as a top prospect not that long ago. His slash of .264/.338/.438 wasn't exactly bad for a part time player and his 13 HR's is 359 AB's is pretty good. I'm sure the Pirates aren't exactly in a hurry to trade him as he's still fairly cheap, but with McCutchen, Polanco, and Marte in their OF already I'm sure they can be convinced....As to what it would take to get him? No clue, its tough call on what his value is (he wasn't trade for much originally) and what the Pirates need. I like the idea. I'd take a flyer. But then I'd still go out and try to shop for a better guy.