BlackSox13

QUOTE (LDF @ Feb 15, 2016 -> 12:09 PM) dang, i forgot about that.... ref the bold. i was looking at him since the beginning of the off season as well as 2 team players. Just my opinion but of the remaining free agents, Jackson makes fhe most sense despite being a RHB. I certainly wouldn't complain if the Sox signed Fowler or Desmond but from the sounds of it I'm thinking the Sox are out on those two. Jackson, however, I've read nothing indicating the Sox have moved on or that the ship has sailed so its still a possibility. How much of a possibility I'm sure I don't know, but still possible. I googled Desmond again and still can't find anything new. Someone check the power cord for the rumor mill and make sure its still plugged in.

QUOTE (LDF @ Feb 15, 2016 -> 11:57 AM) as i have said, it is up to that fickle lady called lady luck. i still want to be so positive in my thoughts, as long as they finish.... well.... i leave that there. To be honest, I'm not much of a believer in luck. Certain players just need to perform up to their career averages which, to me, is more about focus/repetition/desire/outlook/working hard and things of that nature.

QUOTE (LDF @ Feb 15, 2016 -> 11:51 AM) that is for dang sure. i remember in the latos thread, i said something like i really never want to play poker with hahn. i think that move, more than anything else got me stoke for this season. ref the bold, yeah i agree. make me wonder of the asking price.... with jackson, there will always be his agent as the the bump in the road for any negotiations. With the caliper of player that Jackson is, I don't think Boras is as big of a factor as he would be with higher caliper players. Not taking anything away from Jackson but overall, he's not an elite player so Boras can only do so much for Jackson. It's not like Hahn hasn't had dealings in the past with Boras so the possibility of signing Jackson does exist and especially since Jackson has such a small amount of interested teams to choose from. I think it's possible that Hahn is waiting out the market for Jackson like he did with Latos. Time will tell. I know the Sox are reportedly seeking a LH OF bat but I'm hoping the Sox are able to snatch Jackson up. His defense in CF would be a huge boost.

This is rather surprising and agree with others that say things must go right for the SOX to win 90 games. I definitely think it's possible though.

QUOTE (LDF @ Feb 15, 2016 -> 11:21 AM) excellent, excellent post.... and i agree. yeah i can some complaints, esp with laroche, but i can also see Avi as a platoon, esp in the beginning of the season, where laroche has started off slow .... during his career. the sox got extremely lucky in latos, attitude aside, the fix at 2 and 3 baseball..... fantastic. . the 2 catchers... great move. now for me, pls get the team an of'er???? With Latos, I think it's more than just luck. I believe Hahn deserves some credit for knowing Latos' market based on Latos' reputation and injury concerns so Hahn did right by waiting out the market to get a potential steal. Patience was the key in the Sox signing Latos. Take Ian Kennedy for instance. That was a huge gamble by the Royals. If Kennedy under-performs, the Royals are screwed for the next five years. Anyway, back to Desmond. I've been searching Google all morning long and cannot find anything new on him. It looked as though last week his market picked up and now its silent once again. That's not to say things aren't happening, just weird nothing new has surfaced since late last week. Then again, this has been a bit of a weird off season.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Feb 15, 2016 -> 10:25 AM) The funny thing is most of us thought it was a pretty good roster last year. But right now on paper, it is much improved. Hopefully they get improved performance out of some guys as well. If things break right, it could be a really stacked team. Obviously they want a fast start. If anything, that is more motivation to bring in more before the season begins. I am really looking forward to this season. I was disappointed they didn't get Upton or Gordon or Cespedes, but reality says upgrades are still available. Couldn't agree more. I was one of those fans that liked every move the FO made last year with the exception of the Samardzija trade and that was only because he was a one year rental. I've gotten over it, moved on and consider that trade as one of those things that just didn't work out. Such is life. As others have said, LaRoche can't possibly get any worse than he was last year so any improvements from him will help. I believe Melky will be a more consistent player and consider his first half of '15 as more of an outlier. Overall, the IF is improved on defense and especially on offense with the addition of Frazier and to a lesser extent Lawrie. As of right now, the team is much more of a power threat than it was just one year ago. Hopefully Hahn adds another OF bat so that Avi can platoon with LaRoche and maybe begin playing some LF against LHP when LaRoche is on the bench and hopefully Melky is in the DH spot. Who knows, maybe Avi is better suited for LF. It's just beyond me how anyone can complain when looking at the players the Sox have added and subtracted. Imo, the subtractions are equally as important as the additions and could very well make a huge difference in the brand of baseball we see on the South side this year in comparison to last year. I'm seriously excited to see what the Sox do this year. Hopefully, Hahn will be able to add another bat and preferably an outfielder.

This time last year, most fans were excited about the upcoming season and praising Hahn for the moves he made. One year later, many are b****ing about those very moves because a few players under-performed and its now the front offices fault for signing/trading for players that, on paper, many agreed were pretty good moves at the time. Sometimes things do not go according to plan, that's life. I guess it's a matter of perception where one can choose to live in the past or focus on what has been done in the present to hopefully change the future. I'm excited about the moves the Sox have made so far and still believe they will add before opening day. The roster looks alot different now than it did last year. I think Hahn has done well so far and hopefully the results are better this time around. I see no reason not to be optimistic.

Hahn has said they will continue to look for additions to the team through the end of SP and yet, some talk as though this is it and they are done. Base on the off season moves so far, at this point I see no reason to doubt Hahn in what he says. The Sox took out alot of trash this winter and brought in some pretty nice additions to fill some holes so lets see what Hahn does between now ( February 15) and opening day (April 4). This means the Sox have 1.5 months to finalize the roster for opening day so there's plenty time. The lack of patience and abundance of dissention is really old and worn out. Call the whambulance...

QUOTE (southside hitman @ Feb 15, 2016 -> 09:00 AM) http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/the-best-tr...016-off-season/ Fangraph's Dave Cameron ranked the ten transactions of the off-season he liked the most. The White Sox trade for Todd Frazier ranks second only behind the heist of the decade aka the Shelby Miller trade. Lol, Dave Stewart gave it up big time on prom night in that trade! There have been some good trades this off season but none of them comes close to the Atlanta/AZ trade. AZ should file charges against Atlanta for stealing candy from a baby. Anyway. I didn't like seeing Thompson or Montas go, but filling a long term void at 3B with Frazier was a smart move by the Sox FO and a good trade.

http://www.camdenchat.com/2016/2/15/109932...yovani-gallardo The Orioles back is up against the wall big time. The Orioles have spent plenty this off season and that does not include the potential signing of Gallardo and possibly Fowler. How will these signings affect more important players such as Machado and Jones, whom are free agents after the '18 season? Baltimore is a very desperate organization without minor league depth and play in one of the toughest divisions in all of baseball. Boston is on the rise, Toronto will be around for a while and the Yanks will continue to spend their way to contention once they shed some salary over the next two years. The Rays future looks bright with what they have on their major league team as well as their minors. Imo, Baltimore has disaster written all over them for now and the future.

QUOTE (LDF @ Feb 14, 2016 -> 08:55 PM) this is on me, i just don't like most of the marvel movies. i was going to ask BS13 a question, but i will ask it here. if you are not a fan, is it still a movie worth going to see??? YES! YES! YES! Honestly man, the only comic book stuff I've gotten into is Thor ( love the Norse mythology ) and The Avengers ( because Thor is in it and my wife is a Marvel fan). Otherwise, I haven't seen the other super hero's movies ( iron man, hulk, captain America etc.). I have seen the XMen movies but that's because my wife left me with no choice. Point is, like you, I've never really been into the super hero stuff BUT, Deadpool is well worth seeing. I am officially a fan of Deadpool now. The humor in that movie is right up my alley and could rival and maybe even top the Ted movies as far as adult raw, raunchy vulgar humor is concerned. The wife and I are going to see Deadpool again this week. This is the second movie I've liked so much I will actually go back and pay to see again, the first was Ted.

Just got back from seeing Deadpool,great movie! Ryan Reynolds' sarcasm was at its finest and reminded me alot of his role Monty in the movie Waiting. My wife and I are going back during the week to see Deadpool again.

I think there are some things that are overlooked when talking a team's money and their payroll. It costs money for the following.... staff at the ballparks throughout the minors + USCF, scouts salary and travel expenses, costs of signing players in the June draft, costs of signing INTL free agents, FO staff, transportation expenses (plane/truck) for the Sox and all their ML affiliates, equipment throughout the team's system, and probably other stuff I haven't thought of. I don't claim to know how much money the Sox generate or how much they actually have to spend but I do know there are more expenses than just the 25 man payroll.

Going to see Deadpool this afternoon. Of course the wife had to pick a cold snowy day.

Boring weekend for FA rumors. I can't find any new write-ups on Desmond, Fowler, Gallardo or Jackson. Booooooring!

QUOTE (ptatc @ Feb 13, 2016 -> 03:37 PM) Shouldn't be much of an issue. I'm guessing it's an upper rib from the description but they really didn't say. Those won't effect much functionally. If it's a mid or lower rib, it's going to hurt like crazy to breathe and especially cough for a good month. That may take a little longer. However, I've never worked with an athlete with a mid to lower rib removed. I searched the net but could not find any info that specified which rib Montas had removed. Thanks again for your insight. You certainly know your stuff ptatc. QUOTE (hi8is @ Feb 13, 2016 -> 04:06 PM) ptact is the man. He's got a legitimate medical background and worked professionally in the sports PT world if memory serves correct. Helped me out here when I had a boxers fracture. Big shout out to him - great guy to have on this board. Another example of Soxtalk winning. I could not agree more.

QUOTE (bucket-of-suck @ Feb 13, 2016 -> 04:19 PM) I would agree that as it stands now, they are more inclined to deal for a bat than sign one. Thanks bucket. You just confirmed what I've been suspecting since before Cespedes signed.

QUOTE (LDF @ Feb 13, 2016 -> 02:20 PM) ref 1st bold, that was completely on the luck of the draw. good idea but it didn't work. so should the sox not do anything else until, fiscally, the contracts come off the books??? this here is the crux of my pov. ref to 2nd bold, well the point that is being concentrated on is not informing the fans, ok, but don't provide that appearance of going after the top Fa's. what was the purpose of that??? the answer is the Fo internal reasoning. while i really don't trust the sports writers in their attempt to create or rpt news, i still look and read, esp when the talk of cesp coming down to 2 teams topics. not once were the sox mention in that whole part for the final contract. this was not me believing until the final decision was made. when the final story did comes out, then i will look back to see where the sox was in all this. finally the last bold, patience and i understand what you are saying here. i have been patient and preaching this same old line of patience since 2002 on here and other places. back then i was the only one who trusted the sox owners group. now, a decade plus later, i am on the other side of the coin. i want actions and as i have said, go to the salary of 150 mil, to fix this team. that window of improvement in small ..... that money invested will bring the fans back, will help to compete with the PR for media time in chi, and the main albatross of a contract will be coming off the books. go over the int'l signing allotment, and hopefully they will be drafting right. improve the infrastructure called the white sox team, from the minor / farm team all the way up. now what will happen if they don't get that elusive OF'er..... what other points will fans look at and use as the excuse, well this team is solid as of right now, esp in the pitching dept??? With all do respect, I think I'm done here. It's obvious you have a huge beef with the FO and to the point where nothing they do or say is the right thing. I really don't know what else to say, man. Lighten up, its just Baseball.

QUOTE (LDF @ Feb 13, 2016 -> 02:22 PM) that was all shear luck of the draw. QUOTE (bucket-of-suck @ Feb 13, 2016 -> 04:17 PM) No it wasn't. Latos had offers potentially in excess of 3x the amount he signed for. Sox appealed to him for the opportunity and their reputation with pitching and injuries. Thank you. You took the words right out of my mouth. I was reading stuff on Friday that said exactly what you say in your post.

http://www.baseballessential.com/news/2016...-gallardo-deal/ I think is a pretty interesting writeup about comparisons between Gallardo and Chen. It gives some potential insight to what the Orioles might be trying to work out with Gallardo and why its seemingly taking so long for a deal to materialize. I still think the O's were better off with Chen but the article makes a good case for the O's going after Gallardo.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Feb 13, 2016 -> 09:47 AM) Patience is correct Gallardo is going to get $40-45 million allegedly Latos got $3 million Signing Ian Kennedy in January cost $70 million Two more examples that show the Sox have the right approach and actually do have a plan. I don't know about you but if the Sox signed Kennedy to that contract, I'd be pissed! I know I wouldn't be very happy about giving Gallardo 3/40-45M either. The Sox FO did well with staying patient and signing Latos for peanuts. Latos' potential upside, the idea of him working Cooper to get back on track as well as working with Hermie to hopefully stay healthy has me pretty geeked over the signing.

QUOTE (LDF @ Feb 13, 2016 -> 09:35 AM) with ref to the 1st bold, 2nd tier players, yeah i would settle for them, in fact i was counting on them for the final piece of the of'ers. now with ref to selling sports apparel, i do not give a rats arse on that, i want the team to be in the best shape they can and invested in to compete. 2nd bold, innuendo's and half truth, esp when trying to imply that they were in the running, now that can be subjective in on it is used and how or to the audience they are intending that info to..... meaning the fans and to possible season tickets. gullible, never once did the fans really question the sox fo during the soxfest on how earnest in their pursuit they were to getting key players. gullible is when posters are saying, the sox can go into the season and if specific players don't perform they they will replace them...... when and with whom, when the opportunity is to improve the team now, in the offseason. ref the 3rd bold. i will give you credit for saying there are 3 spots left, i for one will be happy and has been happy if the sox were to get an of'er. i have been spouting since the off season began on Avi as a platoon for dh with lorache and i would be happy with saladino b/c of anderson on the horizon. and lastly i have given the sox their just due for improving the team up to now, esp after the latos signing. look at the latos thread, i have given them many plaudits to date, for all that was accomplish. i am just saying, do not stop now..... for me, 1 last position is needed, the outfield. I would settle for 2nd tier players as well, but even then I would only be willing to go so far. The end has to justify the means. I'd like to see the Sox improve the lineup as bad as anyone but also do not want the Sox to get so desperate that they sign a player to another potentially bad contract. As bad of a signing as LaRoche turned out to be, I'm glad it was for only two years. Can you imagine if the Sox were stuck for another year or two after '16? Yikes! Take Fowler for instance, I would be willing to go 3 years on a player like him but if he insists on more than that, I wish him well and walk away from him. 4 years + is too long of a commitment for a player that's about to turn 30 with below average defense and part of his game relies on speed which doesn't bode well for players as they age. In this case, imo, the end would not justify the means. IOW, I feel Fowler's game could hold up for another two or possibly three years but not four or more. Thing is, we don't know exactly what Fowler is looking for and we don't know just how far the SOX are willing to go so to criticize is really a moot point. As for innuendos/half truths, do you really want the Sox to come out and publically tell the world their off season game plan? I don't see how that's going to help them in negotiations with free agents and GM's with regards to the trade market. The FO should be as vague as possible not only for negotiations sake but also in an effort to not get the fans hopes up on a specified player in case they fail to deliver. Much like what we've seen this off season from fans buying into the internet rumors.now, as for the persuit of the big free agent outfielders, in the end, does it really matter since those players signed elsewhere? It's all hindsight and irrelevant now. What matters is, what are they doing now to continue to improve the team, specifically the OF? Hopefully, that question will be answered between now and the end of ST. I'm with ya on the Latos signing and I'm really excited about his potential upside. When he's healthy, Latos has some pretty nasty stuff. I also agree that Avi should be a platoon partner for LaRoche ( if Avi is not traded ) and that the outfield needs another upgrade. Hahn has been transparent with regards to the front office's desire to upgrade the OF. Just because it hasn't happened yet does not mean it will not happen at all. Thats why I continue to point out that theres still plenty of time left and for fans to be patient.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Feb 13, 2016 -> 09:06 AM) I agree with this 100%. And to me, Nightengale saying the Sox are out of cash is like white smoke at the Vatican. Something must be imminent. They were out of money, they trade for Peavy. Even have less than no money, claim Rios. Busted again, find $4 million to pay Manny for a month. Totally busted Paulie is leaving, AJ is leaving,....sign Dunn, bring Paulie and AJ back. These are all great examples of the Sox FO " posturing " in the past. In all honesty, I truely believe the FO does this so they do not get the hopes up of fans in case they fail to deliver and why the FO comes across as being so vague at times. Can you imagine the back-lash if the Sox say they are going after a specified player and fail to deliver? Holy smokes, the back-lash would be beyond furious. The last time I recall the Sox naming a player they were going after was Torii Hunter and we all know how that turned out. Imo, that was a lesson the FO learned from and why they try not to be specific with names. I do believe the budget is tight but also believe the Sox have some excess money to spend and are willing to do so, but only for what they perceive to be the right player and circumstances. Seeing as how I don't work in the FO or have inside information, all I can do as a fan is sit back and trust they are out there doing their best in continuing to improve the team. Hahn has come out said numerous times they have " many irons in the fire " so that's why I remain patient and willing to see how this plays out. I get emotional enough during the season when games are played, no point in me getting started just yet. It's too soon. Patience fellow Sox fans.

QUOTE (LDF @ Feb 13, 2016 -> 08:08 AM) again you make a very good compelling point. however you are taking and seeing one part of this, the team spending. ok, last yr, they spent on Fa's, what was the final total salary of the team??? now use that number and see how many times over the course of, lets say 5 yrs did they, the sox spend to that amount. + / -. those writers you mention are looking at the big picture and are not getting fixated on something that is really not close to telling the story. btw, if they had the budget to pay for the top 3 Fa's, then they still have the budget to acquire another player. anyway all agreed that the sox, if necessary would sacrifice their comp pick to improve the team...... listen here, the word is improve??? what i see that you find poster like i as pathetic b/c i do not personally buy into that fluff. what i find most disconcerting is fans are so gullible to believe every little word that the FO spews without question. With 2nd tier free agents, does the end justify the means to improve the overall team? Are ticket and SOX apparel sales going to spike signing 2nd tier free agents like they would with players such as Cespedes/Gordon/Upton? Nope. Is giving up a draft pick and taking on the salary of players like Desmomd/Fowler worth the risk? Possibly and that's certainly debatable depending on ones POV. Personally, I think the risk is justifiable depending on the annual salary and length of contract. I would imagine the Sox FO office sees it the same way and are only willing to go so far and I don't blame them in that regard. What has the Sox FO spewed that has made fans so gullible? All they have said is that they are exploring all opportunities with reference to trades and free agents that do and do not come with comp picks attached. They have yet to come out and name a player they were directly going after, nor should they. As far as the financials go, we as fans have no choice but to take their word because none of us know exactly just how much money they have to spend, only speculation based on opinion. Due to the Sox willingness to spend in the past for what they perceive to be the right player(s) and as recently as last winter, I see no reason for me to question them just because some writers and tweeters were wrong with their " inside " information. It's the fans fault for allowing their selves to get suckered by those " insiders " , not the FO. There was 6 positional holes to be filled going into the off season. Did anyone realistically see the Sox filling all 6 of those voids? I sure as hell didn't. So far they have filled 3 of those 6 holes. Let's look at those 3 holes that are left SS, RF or OF and DH. The Sox rolling the dice with Saladino at SS is justifiable based on Saladino's defense and to serve as a potential place holder to Anderson for a season. DH, well we all know LaRoche isn't going anywhere and just have to accept that in retrospect, he was a bad signing. Sometimes FA signings just don't work out and the Sox aren't the only team this happens to. RF/OF, well, that's really what were talking about here and the Sox have actually acknowledged they are seeking an OF bat, preferably a LHB. The off season is not over, opening day has yet to arrive, so there's no reason for me to doubt they are indeed still seeking that upgrade for the OF. If the Sox fail to upgrade the OF before opening day, then you can bet I'll be unhappy about it but, I will still give the FO credit for adding Frazier/ Lawrie/ Avila/ Navarro/ Latos and re-signing Albers while moving on from duds such as Flowers/ Beckham/ Samardzija/ Soto etc. All I'm saying is that I'll withhold any criticisms I may potentially have until I see what the final 25 man roster looks like at the end of ST. Still plenty of time for the Sox to make upgrades and despite what some think, I feel the Sox have come a long way and I'm pretty excited about that.

QUOTE (ptatc @ Feb 13, 2016 -> 05:09 AM) Its a common procedure for thoracic outlet especially if they have an accessory 1st rib. I've seen stress reactions in ribs. They are rare. The couple I've seen are in Olympic caliber triathletes usually from an improper arrow position in biking. However, they are treated conservatively. I've never heard of any bone being removed for a stress reaction. In the most severe cases they do surgery to reinforce the bone like kevin white. This isn't an option for the rib due to the size and shape of the bone but removing it is really drastic. Holy cow! Thanks for the in-depth response, seriously, that's good insight right there and I appreciate it. Any idea as to what potential long term effects this may have for Frankie? Even though Frankie is no longer a part of the Sox organization, I still wish him the best and hope he can continue his dream of becoming an MLB pitcher. Everything I've read about him has indicated he's a really good guy and its saddening to hear of things like this happening to people like Frankie.